What to do when your kid struggles academically at college?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The problem is not grade inflation. The high AP scores mean they know information. That’s good.

What most “high-performing” HS kids can’t do is write. If your kid actually wants an education and to grow their communication and analytical skills, they need to learn to write well. Encourage your kids to lean into the task, not avoid it.

Kids are oftentimes bad at structuring an argument, supporting their argument with specifics (they talk in conceptual terms), considering and rebutting alternative viewpoints, and writing concisely and clearly.

Op here.

Interestingly, my kid can write fairly well. They are doing well in English and related classes but simply can’t pass the high level math required for their major. They are exploring other majors now. Ultimately, my kid isn’t likely to work a traditional job; I’m fairly confident they will launch their own business (based on the multiple businesses they’ve run already).

I just want them to get a degree. I think they’ll regret it if they drop out.

College is tough, but there are many ways to get to the finish line. Take summer classes, and extend the time it takes to complete the degree. Find a new way to approach the class they are struggling with. I discovered I couldn't learn math in a large class setting (think state school large classes) - but taking it as a summer class, fewer students, more time with the (granted not a regular professor) teacher, only one class to focus on, tutors and study groups I ended up passing and understanding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kid is struggling. Can’t do advanced math, so they’ll need to change their major. Struggling with some other courses as well.

Both the kid and parents want them to earn a degree. Any degree.

Anyone btdt? How do we properly support? Is catching up with CC classes during breaks a practical solution?

Socially and emotionally the kid is fine.

How advanced math?

There's are related majors that are easier.

There are often easier variant and alternative courses in major.

Are you sure they are struggling? Maybe they are at a non grade inflated school. This information is hard to find, unfortunately.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My student has an executive function coach that meets with her (virtually) Monday morning and Friday morning and reviews upcoming tests, papers, deadlines, etc. They develop a study plan to the week and then for the weekend. It has been immensely helpful. I doubt we will do it all four years, but it has been a good start.

NP here. How did you find this? DC is getting their butt kicked in two classes this first semester - political science and history classes. They’ve met with the professors and the repeated comment is they aren’t analytical enough in their essays, seem to be able to regurgitate the readings but have trouble applying the concepts, etc. (This was a 4.0 kid in HS with all 5s on their 15 APs incl every social science offerring. They are feeling very demoralized.) I am not sure what kind of tutoring to even suggest that DC seek, but I suspect they need some “back to basics” type tutoring teaching them how to note take and study.

honeslty the feedback that your DC is getting should help them learn how to respond in the essays. Its a learning experience. if all else fails, see if they have a writing tutor kind of situation who can help. My DD is doing a philosophy minor and in the process had to learn an entirely different way to write essays, also was a straight A student in HS. Now that she's a junior, she's got it all figured out, but it was a little bit of trial and error and talking to professors to get feedback.

Does the school have a Writing Center on campus? This can help a lot with peer reviews and guidance. They still have to write the paper but it was extremely helpful for our freshman. However, it sounds like the student likely wasn't prepared for college writing, even with the outstanding HS grades. It's not uncommon. College expectations are a shift. Our student recently shared with us his learning rubric for an essay - it was longer than the paper! Reading through it I was surprised by the level of details they wanted in the first paper for the class.

I am the NP above, and I apologize for taking this off of OP’s point bc her child is focused on math struggle (and I do think one on one tutoring and practice are the best aids for that - many people struggle with processing math instruction in whole class settings).

But there aren’t any writing assignments that my DC can take to the writing center. These classes are basically midterm/final only, and Dac bombed the midterms and when they went to talk to the professors, the professors said there wasn’t enough analysis/application of concepts in the midterm essays, or else it had been done incorrectly. They didn’t get detailed feedback at all other than those statements.

I appreciate the support and suggestions, I just don’t think the writing center can be of help in this situation - for essays to be worked on outside of class, absolutely it would be. DC is now meeting regularly with the profs, and I encouraged a study group like another poster suggested (although they don’t know anyone in the class so I suspect they won’t pull that together, but we can only suggest!).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Direct result of inflated HS GPAs, no substance, no teaching proper term paper/writing, etc. Kids end up at college unprepared.

+1

And parents are orchestrating everything for them in HS. I know of parents who "help" kids with their essays, papers, and projects.

I have even had a Dad tell me he is helping his kid with a term paper in college. This is sad.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My student has an executive function coach that meets with her (virtually) Monday morning and Friday morning and reviews upcoming tests, papers, deadlines, etc. They develop a study plan to the week and then for the weekend. It has been immensely helpful. I doubt we will do it all four years, but it has been a good start.

NP here. How did you find this? DC is getting their butt kicked in two classes this first semester - political science and history classes. They’ve met with the professors and the repeated comment is they aren’t analytical enough in their essays, seem to be able to regurgitate the readings but have trouble applying the concepts, etc. (This was a 4.0 kid in HS with all 5s on their 15 APs incl every social science offerring. They are feeling very demoralized.) I am not sure what kind of tutoring to even suggest that DC seek, but I suspect they need some “back to basics” type tutoring teaching them how to note take and study.

Not to hijack, my kid is also struggling here, but I think for him there are two things are at play. One, the writing curriculum at his public HS was mediocre and then bad because of covid, and two, I think part of this struggle is also normal. Learning to synthize information and apply concepts is a higher level thinking skills outside of mechanics of writing or sitting for AP tests. This is what most students should be learning and practicing in college so I would encourage you to normalize this experience for your kid.

I don't think this is a "back to basics" issue and the deficit is in note taking. A study group where they are exchanging ideas with peers, and going to office hours to do the same with their professor, would likely assist them in expanding their thinking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Kid is struggling. Can’t do advanced math, so they’ll need to change their major. Struggling with some other courses as well.

Both the kid and parents want them to earn a degree. Any degree.

Anyone btdt? How do we properly support? Is catching up with CC classes during breaks a practical solution?

Socially and emotionally the kid is fine.

Are you the poster whose kid was planning to major in business? If not, what was the intended major?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My student has an executive function coach that meets with her (virtually) Monday morning and Friday morning and reviews upcoming tests, papers, deadlines, etc. They develop a study plan to the week and then for the weekend. It has been immensely helpful. I doubt we will do it all four years, but it has been a good start.

NP here. How did you find this? DC is getting their butt kicked in two classes this first semester - political science and history classes. They’ve met with the professors and the repeated comment is they aren’t analytical enough in their essays, seem to be able to regurgitate the readings but have trouble applying the concepts, etc. (This was a 4.0 kid in HS with all 5s on their 15 APs incl every social science offerring. They are feeling very demoralized.) I am not sure what kind of tutoring to even suggest that DC seek, but I suspect they need some “back to basics” type tutoring teaching them how to note take and study.

Not to hijack, my kid is also struggling here, but I think for him there are two things are at play. One, the writing curriculum at his public HS was mediocre and then bad because of covid, and two, I think part of this struggle is also normal. Learning to synthize information and apply concepts is a higher level thinking skills outside of mechanics of writing or sitting for AP tests. This is what most students should be learning and practicing in college so I would encourage you to normalize this experience for your kid.

I don't think this is a "back to basics" issue and the deficit is in note taking. A study group where they are exchanging ideas with peers, and going to office hours to do the same with their professor, would likely assist them in expanding their thinking.

Teach them this method:

https://gallaudet.edu/student-success/tutorial-center/english-center/writing/pre-writing-writing-and-revising/the-note-card-system/

I learned it in high school and used it for all college papers including my thesis.

[Anonymous]

I have a kid who attended a top DC private high school and now one in public.

The DC private kid spent the entirely of high school learning to write intense literary critiques and analysis and getting a LOT of Bs in the process. I'd say she/he wrote 100 papers? At the time my husband and I were frustrated by the process as it consumed our family life (we didn't write them but were witness to a lot of late nights with a miserable kid). But that kid learned to write and analyze and is now breezing through college writing at a top 20 school.

Our public school kid is getting high As with probably 10% of the writing (both in number of assignments and depth of assignments).

I guess the moral of my story is that learning to write really well takes times and repetition. You either do this in high school (increasingly rare) or college (or often never at all.)

I'm not sure what the better option is. Our second kid wanted to attend public and we were completely fine with this in part because the expectations of the first kid's school were over-the-top (in our opinion).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a kid who attended a top DC private high school and now one in public.

The DC private kid spent the entirely of high school learning to write intense literary critiques and analysis and getting a LOT of Bs in the process. I'd say she/he wrote 100 papers? At the time my husband and I were frustrated by the process as it consumed our family life (we didn't write them but were witness to a lot of late nights with a miserable kid). But that kid learned to write and analyze and is now breezing through college writing at a top 20 school.

Our public school kid is getting high As with probably 10% of the writing (both in number of assignments and depth of assignments).

I guess the moral of my story is that learning to write really well takes times and repetition. You either do this in high school (increasingly rare) or college (or often never at all.)

I'm not sure what the better option is. Our second kid wanted to attend public and we were completely fine with this in part because the expectations of the first kid's school were over-the-top (in our opinion).

It seems we have 2 themes running through this post - writing and math. I believe the OP is more focused on the weakness in math and what to do. But I agree, that writing is a skill that takes time and effort. Some people seem naturally gift in it, but others its not just the mechanics of writing, but the analytical and developing of ideas and critical thinking. That is really the hardest part. In terms of math, if the student really is challenged with the math curriculum it can be a signal that they need to change majors. If they feel its the major for them, and math is getting in the way - I would explore things like the. https://www.aleks.com/?_s=1352787356231917. Math tutoring and group support.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My student has an executive function coach that meets with her (virtually) Monday morning and Friday morning and reviews upcoming tests, papers, deadlines, etc. They develop a study plan to the week and then for the weekend. It has been immensely helpful. I doubt we will do it all four years, but it has been a good start.

NP here. How did you find this? DC is getting their butt kicked in two classes this first semester - political science and history classes. They’ve met with the professors and the repeated comment is they aren’t analytical enough in their essays, seem to be able to regurgitate the readings but have trouble applying the concepts, etc. (This was a 4.0 kid in HS with all 5s on their 15 APs incl every social science offerring. They are feeling very demoralized.) I am not sure what kind of tutoring to even suggest that DC seek, but I suspect they need some “back to basics” type tutoring teaching them how to note take and study.

honeslty the feedback that your DC is getting should help them learn how to respond in the essays. Its a learning experience. if all else fails, see if they have a writing tutor kind of situation who can help. My DD is doing a philosophy minor and in the process had to learn an entirely different way to write essays, also was a straight A student in HS. Now that she's a junior, she's got it all figured out, but it was a little bit of trial and error and talking to professors to get feedback.

Does the school have a Writing Center on campus? This can help a lot with peer reviews and guidance. They still have to write the paper but it was extremely helpful for our freshman. However, it sounds like the student likely wasn't prepared for college writing, even with the outstanding HS grades. It's not uncommon. College expectations are a shift. Our student recently shared with us his learning rubric for an essay - it was longer than the paper! Reading through it I was surprised by the level of details they wanted in the first paper for the class.

I am the NP above, and I apologize for taking this off of OP’s point bc her child is focused on math struggle (and I do think one on one tutoring and practice are the best aids for that - many people struggle with processing math instruction in whole class settings).

But there aren’t any writing assignments that my DC can take to the writing center. These classes are basically midterm/final only, and Dac bombed the midterms and when they went to talk to the professors, the professors said there wasn’t enough analysis/application of concepts in the midterm essays, or else it had been done incorrectly. They didn’t get detailed feedback at all other than those statements.

I appreciate the support and suggestions, I just don’t think the writing center can be of help in this situation - for essays to be worked on outside of class, absolutely it would be. DC is now meeting regularly with the profs, and I encouraged a study group like another poster suggested (although they don’t know anyone in the class so I suspect they won’t pull that together, but we can only suggest!).

There no practice essays?

That's just bad teaching and your kid she join a different class.

[Anonymous]

Blaming teachers for student shortcomings does not work like it does in highschool.

[Anonymous]

We are in the midst of this too. My kid is intelligent and struggles due to neurodivergence. Not every human excels in a world that's not designed for how they learn. No one requires the neurotypical kids to learn the way a neurodivergent person does so the neurotypical kids have a built-in advantage.

I tell my kid I'm proud of them. They forget to turn in assignments, which is usually the reason for any poor grades. They need accommodations, which are taking a long time to get. Professors are understanding, thank goodness.

First, kid's mental health is #1. I fully support their choices to drop a class, do what they need to be healthy, etc.

1. See if they can drop a class.
2. Explore getting an executive function coach.
3. Therapy, if needed.
4. Explore if they need medication for depression, anxiety, or ADHD.
5. Math can be tricky for certain kids, and dyscalculia/ADHD/anxiety or any combo can cause lots of stress and forgetfulness.

A parent here on this forum is being snarky about kids who are "not good at tests." But who were the tests designed for? Kids who can sit still for hours on end. A kid who sits still is not necessarily smarter but will get a better score.

In sum, support your kid and feel good about their unique qualities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We are in the midst of this too. My kid is intelligent and struggles due to neurodivergence. Not every human excels in a world that's not designed for how they learn. No one requires the neurotypical kids to learn the way a neurodivergent person does so the neurotypical kids have a built-in advantage.

I tell my kid I'm proud of them. They forget to turn in assignments, which is usually the reason for any poor grades. They need accommodations, which are taking a long time to get. Professors are understanding, thank goodness.

First, kid's mental health is #1. I fully support their choices to drop a class, do what they need to be healthy, etc.

1. See if they can drop a class.
2. Explore getting an executive function coach.
3. Therapy, if needed.
4. Explore if they need medication for depression, anxiety, or ADHD.
5. Math can be tricky for certain kids, and dyscalculia/ADHD/anxiety or any combo can cause lots of stress and forgetfulness.

A parent here on this forum is being snarky about kids who are "not good at tests." But who were the tests designed for? Kids who can sit still for hours on end. A kid who sits still is not necessarily smarter but will get a better score.

In sum, support your kid and feel good about their unique qualities.

Thank you for this post. My kid requires accommodations. But as he has often said - I get extra time on the test, but my brain is completely exhausted - the longer time he has doesn't mean he's sharper, or going to ace the test - it just is more time to exhaust him and drain him. He has to put in so much more time and effort just to attempt to meet the norm. We support him in every way possible. Mental health and wellness is so important as is trying to find out if there is a bigger issue at play.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My student has an executive function coach that meets with her (virtually) Monday morning and Friday morning and reviews upcoming tests, papers, deadlines, etc. They develop a study plan to the week and then for the weekend. It has been immensely helpful. I doubt we will do it all four years, but it has been a good start.

NP here. How did you find this? DC is getting their butt kicked in two classes this first semester - political science and history classes. They’ve met with the professors and the repeated comment is they aren’t analytical enough in their essays, seem to be able to regurgitate the readings but have trouble applying the concepts, etc. (This was a 4.0 kid in HS with all 5s on their 15 APs incl every social science offerring. They are feeling very demoralized.) I am not sure what kind of tutoring to even suggest that DC seek, but I suspect they need some “back to basics” type tutoring teaching them how to note take and study.

honeslty the feedback that your DC is getting should help them learn how to respond in the essays. Its a learning experience. if all else fails, see if they have a writing tutor kind of situation who can help. My DD is doing a philosophy minor and in the process had to learn an entirely different way to write essays, also was a straight A student in HS. Now that she's a junior, she's got it all figured out, but it was a little bit of trial and error and talking to professors to get feedback.

Does the school have a Writing Center on campus? This can help a lot with peer reviews and guidance. They still have to write the paper but it was extremely helpful for our freshman. However, it sounds like the student likely wasn't prepared for college writing, even with the outstanding HS grades. It's not uncommon. College expectations are a shift. Our student recently shared with us his learning rubric for an essay - it was longer than the paper! Reading through it I was surprised by the level of details they wanted in the first paper for the class.

I am the NP above, and I apologize for taking this off of OP’s point bc her child is focused on math struggle (and I do think one on one tutoring and practice are the best aids for that - many people struggle with processing math instruction in whole class settings).

But there aren’t any writing assignments that my DC can take to the writing center. These classes are basically midterm/final only, and Dac bombed the midterms and when they went to talk to the professors, the professors said there wasn’t enough analysis/application of concepts in the midterm essays, or else it had been done incorrectly. They didn’t get detailed feedback at all other than those statements.

I appreciate the support and suggestions, I just don’t think the writing center can be of help in this situation - for essays to be worked on outside of class, absolutely it would be. DC is now meeting regularly with the profs, and I encouraged a study group like another poster suggested (although they don’t know anyone in the class so I suspect they won’t pull that together, but we can only suggest!).

There no practice essays?

That's just bad teaching and your kid she join a different class.

practice essays?? we never had those when I was in college. and poster said her kid is failing 2 classes so I guess both professors are bad?

[Anonymous]

I struggled in college as well. One thing that helped me save my undergrad career was staying a spring or summer term and taking one of the hard "weeder" classes all by itself. Finding a summer subleter was not really worth it so it all worked out in the end.