IB programs in county

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrating elements here is that MCPS has rolled back the ability of the non-magnet IB schools to offer "pre-IB" classes.

It's part of this incredibly upsetting push-and-pull on the part of the Central Office. They want more families to choose B-CC or Einstein and claim to be expanding opportunities to these programs, but at the same time they are gatekeeping course offerings to the point that a teen who is looking for a like-minded peer group and pre-IB classes must wait until 11th grade to access those things.

RMIB has "pre-IB" classes for 9th and 10th graders. At least, for now.

Example: RMS English 9 is only available to IB magnet students. I don't know if that will change any time soon.

Right, but MCPS Central Office has been trying to strong-arm B-CC and Einstein away from offering those cohorted classes. They were opt-in, and open to any kid, but "equity concerns" has led the county to try to kill the ability of schools to offer them. This is a problem because it puts even more pressure on the magnet programs and raises the stakes for those kids if they'd like to experience any sort of academic challenge with like-minded peers before their junior year.

Say what? How do you know this and how can we push back against this?

What would the alternative model for MYP IB classes look like?

I'm the PP and I know because an administrator told me when I asked what classes are available to incoming 9th graders. This administrator seemed genuinely frustrated, and I probably caught them in a bad moment (I have an older child at the school).

MYP isn't classes, per se. In a wall-to-wall MYP school, all of the classes should fit into MYP, but I don't know how that would work at Einstein if it isn't a MYP school.

https://www.ibo.org/programmes/middle-years-programme/what-is-the-myp/how-the-myp-works/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the question is: does IB offer an advantage in college admissions compared to AP? Are they recognized equally? I thought IB was more work for the same amount of recognition?

It's also more money. IB tests this year are $119, AP tests are $97.

And more writing.

someone once stated that IB is depth and AP is breadth. I'm finding that this is true.

For example, in IB world history they take a couple of topics and go in depth, whereas in AP world history, they cover the span of world history.

And yea, a ton of writing, even in STEM classes. They have to write a research paper for almost all classes.

[b]As for colleges, the IB classes themselves don't mean much. But the IB diploma probably does. It's especially useful if your kid decides to apply to foreign colleges.[/b]

Yes, with IB it's the diploma that distinguishes you, not the individual courses. That's the opposite for AP, where the individual courses (and corresponding exams scores) are all that matter.

The impact of the IB Diploma for acceptance rates range from anywhere from a 10-40% increase depending on the school.

.
This really isn't true. Colleges will rate a student based on the classes they take and the level of difficulty. If a student is taking the most difficult classes available at their school, then that's a good thing. The classes will vary from school to school. For example, some IB schools don't have as many AP classes so a strong student would naturally choose a bunch of IB courses and maybe only a couple of AP ones.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrating elements here is that MCPS has rolled back the ability of the non-magnet IB schools to offer "pre-IB" classes.

It's part of this incredibly upsetting push-and-pull on the part of the Central Office. They want more families to choose B-CC or Einstein and claim to be expanding opportunities to these programs, but at the same time they are gatekeeping course offerings to the point that a teen who is looking for a like-minded peer group and pre-IB classes must wait until 11th grade to access those things.

RMIB has "pre-IB" classes for 9th and 10th graders. At least, for now.

Example: RMS English 9 is only available to IB magnet students. I don't know if that will change any time soon.

Right, but MCPS Central Office has been trying to strong-arm B-CC and Einstein away from offering those cohorted classes. They were opt-in, and open to any kid, but "equity concerns" has led the county to try to kill the ability of schools to offer them. This is a problem because it puts even more pressure on the magnet programs and raises the stakes for those kids if they'd like to experience any sort of academic challenge with like-minded peers before their junior year.

Say what? How do you know this and how can we push back against this?

What would the alternative model for MYP IB classes look like?

I'm the PP and I know because an administrator told me when I asked what classes are available to incoming 9th graders. This administrator seemed genuinely frustrated, and I probably caught them in a bad moment (I have an older child at the school).

MYP isn't classes, per se. In a wall-to-wall MYP school, all of the classes should fit into MYP, but I don't know how that would work at Einstein if it isn't a MYP school.

https://www.ibo.org/programmes/middle-years-programme/what-is-the-myp/how-the-myp-works/

MCPS designates the MYP IB classes in the official course title.

So my DS has classes on the transcript that officially say:

MCPS IB in front of them for the "official" MYP IB classes. So he's "MCPS IB Chemistry A/B" and "MCPS IB Algebra 2" as a 10th grader.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the question is: does IB offer an advantage in college admissions compared to AP? Are they recognized equally? I thought IB was more work for the same amount of recognition?

It's also more money. IB tests this year are $119, AP tests are $97.

And more writing.

someone once stated that IB is depth and AP is breadth. I'm finding that this is true.

For example, in IB world history they take a couple of topics and go in depth, whereas in AP world history, they cover the span of world history.

And yea, a ton of writing, even in STEM classes. They have to write a research paper for almost all classes.

[b]As for colleges, the IB classes themselves don't mean much. But the IB diploma probably does. It's especially useful if your kid decides to apply to foreign colleges.[/b]

Yes, with IB it's the diploma that distinguishes you, not the individual courses. That's the opposite for AP, where the individual courses (and corresponding exams scores) are all that matter.

The impact of the IB Diploma for acceptance rates range from anywhere from a 10-40% increase depending on the school.

.
This really isn't true. Colleges will rate a student based on the classes they take and the level of difficulty. If a student is taking the most difficult classes available at their school, then that's a good thing. The classes will vary from school to school. For example, some IB schools don't have as many AP classes so a strong student would naturally choose a bunch of IB courses and maybe only a couple of AP ones.

Got it. Thanks for the clarification. I had been told what I said about the diploma being more valuable than the individual courses with IB, but I'll concede I'm not an expert in college admissions...yet!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I think the question is: does IB offer an advantage in college admissions compared to AP? Are they recognized equally? I thought IB was more work for the same amount of recognition?

It's also more money. IB tests this year are $119, AP tests are $97.

And more writing.

someone once stated that IB is depth and AP is breadth. I'm finding that this is true.

For example, in IB world history they take a couple of topics and go in depth, whereas in AP world history, they cover the span of world history.

And yea, a ton of writing, even in STEM classes. They have to write a research paper for almost all classes.

[b]As for colleges, the IB classes themselves don't mean much. But the IB diploma probably does. It's especially useful if your kid decides to apply to foreign colleges.[/b]

Yes, with IB it's the diploma that distinguishes you, not the individual courses. That's the opposite for AP, where the individual courses (and corresponding exams scores) are all that matter.

The impact of the IB Diploma for acceptance rates range from anywhere from a 10-40% increase depending on the school.

.
This really isn't true. Colleges will rate a student based on the classes they take and the level of difficulty. If a student is taking the most difficult classes available at their school, then that's a good thing. The classes will vary from school to school. For example, some IB schools don't have as many AP classes so a strong student would naturally choose a bunch of IB courses and maybe only a couple of AP ones.

Got it. Thanks for the clarification. I had been told what I said about the diploma being more valuable than the individual courses with IB, but I'll concede I'm not an expert in college admissions...yet!

Definitely true though- the IB Diploma is more valuable than just taking individual IB or AP classes. The downside is that it really limits the student's ability to take multiple electives that are of interest to them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So which IB programme has the best teachers?

How would we know? We don't have kids that attend all the IB schools.

Also, teachers are not bound to stay. There have been shifts throughout the years. There are always good and bad teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrating elements here is that MCPS has rolled back the ability of the non-magnet IB schools to offer "pre-IB" classes.

It's part of this incredibly upsetting push-and-pull on the part of the Central Office. They want more families to choose B-CC or Einstein and claim to be expanding opportunities to these programs, but at the same time they are gatekeeping course offerings to the point that a teen who is looking for a like-minded peer group and pre-IB classes must wait until 11th grade to access those things.

RMIB has "pre-IB" classes for 9th and 10th graders. At least, for now.

Example: RMS English 9 is only available to IB magnet students. I don't know if that will change any time soon.

Right, but MCPS Central Office has been trying to strong-arm B-CC and Einstein away from offering those cohorted classes. They were opt-in, and open to any kid, but "equity concerns" has led the county to try to kill the ability of schools to offer them. This is a problem because it puts even more pressure on the magnet programs and raises the stakes for those kids if they'd like to experience any sort of academic challenge with like-minded peers before their junior year.

Say what? How do you know this and how can we push back against this?

What would the alternative model for MYP IB classes look like?

I'm the PP and I know because an administrator told me when I asked what classes are available to incoming 9th graders. This administrator seemed genuinely frustrated, and I probably caught them in a bad moment (I have an older child at the school).

MYP isn't classes, per se. In a wall-to-wall MYP school, all of the classes should fit into MYP, but I don't know how that would work at Einstein if it isn't a MYP school.

https://www.ibo.org/programmes/middle-years-programme/what-is-the-myp/how-the-myp-works/

MCPS designates the MYP IB classes in the official course title.

So my DS has classes on the transcript that officially say:

MCPS IB in front of them for the "official" MYP IB classes. So he's "MCPS IB Chemistry A/B" and "MCPS IB Algebra 2" as a 10th grader.

Which school is this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:RM has the IB Diploma Programme, which is available for students zoned for RM, as well as other students who attend RM through a MCPS test-in IB magnet program. (The same is true for Kennedy, Springbrook, and Watkins Mill.)

B-CC has the IB Diploma Programme, which is available for students zoned for B-CC. (The same is true for Rockville.)

Seneca Valley has the IB Diploma Programme and the IB Career-Related Programme, which are available for students zoned for SVHS, as well as other students who attend SVHS through a MCPS regional college and career program.

Einstein has the IB Diploma Programme, which is available for students zoned for Einstein or at Einstein through the D-CC.

Rockville also has the IB Career-Related Programme.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrating elements here is that MCPS has rolled back the ability of the non-magnet IB schools to offer "pre-IB" classes.

It's part of this incredibly upsetting push-and-pull on the part of the Central Office. They want more families to choose B-CC or Einstein and claim to be expanding opportunities to these programs, but at the same time they are gatekeeping course offerings to the point that a teen who is looking for a like-minded peer group and pre-IB classes must wait until 11th grade to access those things.

RMIB has "pre-IB" classes for 9th and 10th graders. At least, for now.

Example: RMS English 9 is only available to IB magnet students. I don't know if that will change any time soon.

Right, but MCPS Central Office has been trying to strong-arm B-CC and Einstein away from offering those cohorted classes. They were opt-in, and open to any kid, but "equity concerns" has led the county to try to kill the ability of schools to offer them. This is a problem because it puts even more pressure on the magnet programs and raises the stakes for those kids if they'd like to experience any sort of academic challenge with like-minded peers before their junior year.

Say what? How do you know this and how can we push back against this?

What would the alternative model for MYP IB classes look like?

I'm the PP and I know because an administrator told me when I asked what classes are available to incoming 9th graders. This administrator seemed genuinely frustrated, and I probably caught them in a bad moment (I have an older child at the school).

MYP isn't classes, per se. In a wall-to-wall MYP school, all of the classes should fit into MYP, but I don't know how that would work at Einstein if it isn't a MYP school.

https://www.ibo.org/programmes/middle-years-programme/what-is-the-myp/how-the-myp-works/

MCPS designates the MYP IB classes in the official course title.

So my DS has classes on the transcript that officially say:

MCPS IB in front of them for the "official" MYP IB classes. So he's "MCPS IB Chemistry A/B" and "MCPS IB Algebra 2" as a 10th grader.

Which school is this?

Kennedy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrating elements here is that MCPS has rolled back the ability of the non-magnet IB schools to offer "pre-IB" classes.

It's part of this incredibly upsetting push-and-pull on the part of the Central Office. They want more families to choose B-CC or Einstein and claim to be expanding opportunities to these programs, but at the same time they are gatekeeping course offerings to the point that a teen who is looking for a like-minded peer group and pre-IB classes must wait until 11th grade to access those things.

There is no such thing as "pre-IB" classes in that sense. IB starts in 11th grade. Before that, there's the IB Middle Years Programme (MYP). I think that all of the MCPS high schools that offer a IB diploma programme are wall-to-wall MYP schools, but I'm not totally certain about that.

yes there is. See above post about RMIB.

Those aren't "pre-IB" classes, they are special classes for students who were accepted into the RMIB magnet program.

yes, and it's generally called "pre-IB" classes since it can only be taken by IB magnet students.

People can call the classes anything they want, but the fact is that the classes are not part of the IB Diploma Programme.

There are no specific pre-IB classes that are part of the IBDP or IBCP program. There is however a Middle Years Program in 9th and 10th grade which might be what PP is talking about. MYP preps students for Full IB in 11th and 12th grade. For example, since Seneca Valley is a wall-to-wall IB school, students in 9th and 10th grade have the MYP framework embedded in their classes, and they submit a personal MYP project in 10th grade. At the end of 10th grade, students decide if they want to go for the full IB diploma (IBCP or IBDP) or take some IB classes here or there or none at all starting in 11th grade. Not sure how it works at the other schools but this is how it works at SVHS.

I don't know about the other schools, but for RMIB, RMS English 9/10th is ONLY open to IB magnet students.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrating elements here is that MCPS has rolled back the ability of the non-magnet IB schools to offer "pre-IB" classes.

It's part of this incredibly upsetting push-and-pull on the part of the Central Office. They want more families to choose B-CC or Einstein and claim to be expanding opportunities to these programs, but at the same time they are gatekeeping course offerings to the point that a teen who is looking for a like-minded peer group and pre-IB classes must wait until 11th grade to access those things.

RMIB has "pre-IB" classes for 9th and 10th graders. At least, for now.

Example: RMS English 9 is only available to IB magnet students. I don't know if that will change any time soon.

Right, but MCPS Central Office has been trying to strong-arm B-CC and Einstein away from offering those cohorted classes. They were opt-in, and open to any kid, but "equity concerns" has led the county to try to kill the ability of schools to offer them. This is a problem because it puts even more pressure on the magnet programs and raises the stakes for those kids if they'd like to experience any sort of academic challenge with like-minded peers before their junior year.

Say what? How do you know this and how can we push back against this?

What would the alternative model for MYP IB classes look like?

I'm the PP and I know because an administrator told me when I asked what classes are available to incoming 9th graders. This administrator seemed genuinely frustrated, and I probably caught them in a bad moment (I have an older child at the school).

MYP isn't classes, per se. In a wall-to-wall MYP school, all of the classes should fit into MYP, but I don't know how that would work at Einstein if it isn't a MYP school.

https://www.ibo.org/programmes/middle-years-programme/what-is-the-myp/how-the-myp-works/

MCPS designates the MYP IB classes in the official course title.

So my DS has classes on the transcript that officially say:

MCPS IB in front of them for the "official" MYP IB classes. So he's "MCPS IB Chemistry A/B" and "MCPS IB Algebra 2" as a 10th grader.

At Einstein? My kid is at Seneca, which is a wall-to-wall MYP school, and the classes are not designated as MYP IB. it's just Honors Chemistry A/B, Honors Precalculus, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:One of the frustrating elements here is that MCPS has rolled back the ability of the non-magnet IB schools to offer "pre-IB" classes.

It's part of this incredibly upsetting push-and-pull on the part of the Central Office. They want more families to choose B-CC or Einstein and claim to be expanding opportunities to these programs, but at the same time they are gatekeeping course offerings to the point that a teen who is looking for a like-minded peer group and pre-IB classes must wait until 11th grade to access those things.

RMIB has "pre-IB" classes for 9th and 10th graders. At least, for now.

Example: RMS English 9 is only available to IB magnet students. I don't know if that will change any time soon.

Right, but MCPS Central Office has been trying to strong-arm B-CC and Einstein away from offering those cohorted classes. They were opt-in, and open to any kid, but "equity concerns" has led the county to try to kill the ability of schools to offer them. This is a problem because it puts even more pressure on the magnet programs and raises the stakes for those kids if they'd like to experience any sort of academic challenge with like-minded peers before their junior year.

Say what? How do you know this and how can we push back against this?

What would the alternative model for MYP IB classes look like?

I'm the PP and I know because an administrator told me when I asked what classes are available to incoming 9th graders. This administrator seemed genuinely frustrated, and I probably caught them in a bad moment (I have an older child at the school).

MYP isn't classes, per se. In a wall-to-wall MYP school, all of the classes should fit into MYP, but I don't know how that would work at Einstein if it isn't a MYP school.

https://www.ibo.org/programmes/middle-years-programme/what-is-the-myp/how-the-myp-works/

MCPS designates the MYP IB classes in the official course title.

So my DS has classes on the transcript that officially say:

MCPS IB in front of them for the "official" MYP IB classes. So he's "MCPS IB Chemistry A/B" and "MCPS IB Algebra 2" as a 10th grader.

At Einstein? My kid is at Seneca, which is a wall-to-wall MYP school, and the classes are not designated as MYP IB. it's just Honors Chemistry A/B, Honors Precalculus, etc.

The info I gave is what I'm seeing at Kennedy. If other MCPS IB schools do it differently than that might explain the difference, I guess. But the course title does say "MCPS IB" which makes it seem like it would be a districtwide designation.

[Anonymous]

Lots of confusion going on in this thread. RM has a county-wide IB magnet program, and Kennedy, Springbrook, and Watkins Mill are the regional IB magnets. In the 9th and 10th grade years the students who are selected for the program are cohorted together and take core classes together. They may or may not have a special name (pre-IB, MYP, etc.), but somehow the school is keeping those students cohorted together when scheduling. That is supposed to be one of the benefits of the magnet.

The other 3 schools offering IB programs (BCC, Einstein, SVHS) are supposed to be offering rigorous courses to all of their students so that they are prepared for the diploma programme in 11th grade if they choose it. It doesn't matter if the course is "only" honors, it needs to be taught with the rigor needed for students to be successful with IB classes. If that is not happening, that is a choice within the school.

I know that at RM there is a focus in 10th grade to make sure that the honors level courses have similar rigor (especially with writing) to the magnet classes so that non-magnet students can still join the IBDP in 11th and be successful.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Lots of confusion going on in this thread. RM has a county-wide IB magnet program, and Kennedy, Springbrook, and Watkins Mill are the regional IB magnets. In the 9th and 10th grade years the students who are selected for the program are cohorted together and take core classes together. They may or may not have a special name (pre-IB, MYP, etc.), but somehow the school is keeping those students cohorted together when scheduling. That is supposed to be one of the benefits of the magnet.

The other 3 schools offering IB programs (BCC, Einstein, SVHS) are supposed to be offering rigorous courses to all of their students so that they are prepared for the diploma programme in 11th grade if they choose it. It doesn't matter if the course is "only" honors, it needs to be taught with the rigor needed for students to be successful with IB classes. If that is not happening, that is a choice within the school.

I know that at RM there is a focus in 10th grade to make sure that the honors level courses have similar rigor (especially with writing) to the magnet classes so that non-magnet students can still join the IBDP in 11th and be successful.

No, it is being dictated by central office.

[Anonymous]

We looked into the Einstein IB program. Here is the information the principal sent to me:
9th grade: MCPSIB English 9, foreign Language 1 (or higher, my kid was already in a level 3 language), AP NSL, Honors Bio (would not allow AP Bio), Honors Pre-Calc or IB math (but the IB math was too low for my kid. It was a blend of Geo and Alg), PE, tech credit.
10th grade: MCPSIB English 10, foreign language, APUSH, AP Chem, Fine Arts Elective, Health, IB Math or AP Calc.
11th: IB English Lit 1, IB foreign Language, IB History of the Americas, IB Physics, TOK1/Extended Essay (this is part of the IB Diploma Programme), IB Math or AP Stats
12th: IB English Lit II HL (Higher Level), IB foreign language, IB History of the Americas II HL, IB Science or AP Physics, TOK II (part of IB Diploma Programme), IB math

Here is where the issue came in (and we ultimately decided it wasn't the right fit):
1. My kid played in advanced band/orchestra/jazz band. Einstein is known for having a strong music program, but these courses did not fit into the IB Programme schedule after 10th grade, even if my kid took Health and Tech Credit in summer school (which he did).
2. His foreign language choice wasn't offered and he wanted to continue through AP and beyond with his language choice.
3. There is no IB World History at Einstein. They only offer IB History of the Americas because it appeals to the largest segment of the student body.
4. My kid couldn't earn the Diploma because he was already beyond the math levels covered in IB (even the HL level). He would be able to substitute with AP, but then you can't earn the diploma. Also: Einstein doesn't have a lot of kids taking Differential Equations so it isn't always offered. My kid hoped to take it.

Finally, people say Richard Montgomery is the best IB program for a lot of reasons. I have a close friend who was in the first class to graduate from that program, back in the early '90s. He went on to two Ivies, if that matters to you. I think that is a good sign. Some of the teachers who were part of the inception of the program are still at RM. Also, the kids are in a cohort, almost like an "honors" cohort because the test in to the program. Einstein and Kennedy allow any kid to take IB classes a la carte and they are not in a cohort. This is great if you have a bunch of kids who take a mix of AP and IB to best challenge themselves; not so good if the teachers can't move at the same pace/go in depth because of students who are struggling. At Einstein, kids take 3 SL (standard level) IB courses and 2 HL (higher level) IB courses. They are not allowed to take more HLs (so, my kid loved Chem and it was only offered as an IB SL).