Nyt: Asian American success isn’t a problem

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I expect I’m one of the UMC white people that the article talks about. I can see the perspective, because it’s true that Asian American families have brought a change to the culture of schools, where you cannot do well anymore unless you spend significant amount of time studying outside of school either in enrichment classes or with your family. There’s no doubt that this is a cultural shift, brought from countries where this kind of studying outside of school is common, and where failure to secure jobs in a few specific fields means poverty.

I will freely say that as a parent this is simply not worth the stress and pressure to me. It’s not how I want to raise my kids. And, I know enough about America to know that there is more to life than aspiring to only a few prestigious colleges and careers. I am not going to fight about it, but I certainly am going to escape it. In our area the Asian American families won’t consider any schools ranked less than 7 or so on GreatSchools, so our local schools are largely free of this pressure. Nevertheless, kids go to colleges that are just fine with us, get good jobs, go to grad school, etc.

If you don’t like the new rules, you can choose not to play the game.

Love this. We picked the wrong neighborhood for a decade until we realized exactly what you say - this is not an ‘American’ culture - this decision to cram school which came from our first gen Russian, South Korean, Chinese and south Asian neighbors. Loved living in such a diverse hood for some reasons but man didn’t like the cram school culture. Really killed the fun. My kids often had no friends to play with after school when they were younger. We simply moved to a more traditional (white and African American neighborhood) - oddly enough for better schools for our kids — and it is better. Not perfect but better. By better I mean the district offers all that intense stuff if the child is wired for Harvard but also let’s you be a Hampshirite College kid too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What I think is interesting- and call me a racist - is the values Asian Americans are bringing are basically WASP values (hard work, thrift and entrepreneurial chutzpah to mix metaphors, lol)

What makes me laugh is my friend - who grew up in South Korea - admitting his generation came to US to escape the cram school but - due largely to the pull of culture - ended up remaking all of them here. Kumon, etc.

Since when is hard work associated with wasp values???

And why is that no one ever associates African Americans with working hard??? Black women have always worked. There has never been a time when African American women didn’t work.

How come no one ever associated hard work with African American culture?

What a load of nonsense you wrote.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What I think is interesting- and call me a racist - is the values Asian Americans are bringing are basically WASP values (hard work, thrift and entrepreneurial chutzpah to mix metaphors, lol)

What makes me laugh is my friend - who grew up in South Korea - admitting his generation came to US to escape the cram school but - due largely to the pull of culture - ended up remaking all of them here. Kumon, etc.

Since when is hard work associated with wasp values???

And why is that no one ever associates African Americans with working hard??? Black women have always worked. There has never been a time when African American women didn’t work.

How come no one ever associated hard work with African American culture?

What a load of nonsense you wrote.

Sorry you feel that way. Think this is a difference in generation. Are you young? The country was certainly founded on African American hard work - which we now should acknowledge but traditionally since the leaders of the country were WASPs that’s who ended up getting the credit for setting the culture. I think if you look back in historiography- granted you would dismiss likely as simply racist - you will find this association. I’m just glad we left that neighborhood!

[Anonymous]

That nonsense is out there and it's destructive.

The Smithsonian museum had to retract and apologize for publishing a chart saying hard work and rational thought (among other traits) is ‘white culture’ and is something to be brought down as a part of systemic racism.

Hard work and rational thought is obviously not confined to any particular race or ethnicity. It's nonsense.


https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.miamiherald.com/news/nation-world/national/article244309587.html

[Anonymous]

Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I expect I’m one of the UMC white people that the article talks about. I can see the perspective, because it’s true that Asian American families have brought a change to the culture of schools, where you cannot do well anymore unless you spend significant amount of time studying outside of school either in enrichment classes or with your family. There’s no doubt that this is a cultural shift, brought from countries where this kind of studying outside of school is common, and where failure to secure jobs in a few specific fields means poverty.

I will freely say that as a parent this is simply not worth the stress and pressure to me. It’s not how I want to raise my kids. And, I know enough about America to know that there is more to life than aspiring to only a few prestigious colleges and careers. I am not going to fight about it, but I certainly am going to escape it. In our area the Asian American families won’t consider any schools ranked less than 7 or so on GreatSchools, so our local schools are largely free of this pressure. Nevertheless, kids go to colleges that are just fine with us, get good jobs, go to grad school, etc.

If you don’t like the new rules, you can choose not to play the game.

Love this. We picked the wrong neighborhood for a decade until we realized exactly what you say - this is not an ‘American’ culture - this decision to cram school which came from our first gen Russian, South Korean, Chinese and south Asian neighbors. Loved living in such a diverse hood for some reasons but man didn’t like the cram school culture. Really killed the fun. My kids often had no friends to play with after school when they were younger. We simply moved to a more traditional (white and African American neighborhood) - oddly enough for better schools for our kids — and it is better. Not perfect but better. By better I mean the district offers all that intense stuff if the child is wired for Harvard but also let’s you be a Hampshirite College kid too.

Both PPs are spot on in describing the realities in some areas. It's absolutely not bad to embrace a culture where so much time out of school is spent on academic pursuits. Obviously, there are significant benefits to children raised this way. But that way of life might not work for every kid or every family, especially if your circle does not include like-minded families. Academic success is well-earned, regardless of where the material was learned, but to be sure, the extent to which "school" success, as measured by test scores, is achieved through out-of school activities and enrichment hides the reality that kids are getting less and less at school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

um, maybe because Asians like to identify, group with white people?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

um, maybe because Asians like to identify, group with white people?

Nothing wrong with having white friends, but you make it sound like Asians put white people on a pedestal. You need to get to know more Asians if that’s what you think, especially immigrants.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

Asians are not white but are very much 'white adjacent. Hell, Asian people deep down have fought to be white adjacent. Furthermore, asian people like being grouped with white people. LOL!

In America you are treated based on your proximity to whiteness.

For example, do you really think it's a conidence that so many White men are married to asian women compared to Black and Hispanic women?

The majority of White men married to asian women would have not married their asian wives if their wife was black or hispanic. People are not colorblind and people do recognize patterns.

I've had white people straight up tell me this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

um, maybe because Asians like to identify, group with white people?

so true LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I expect I’m one of the UMC white people that the article talks about. I can see the perspective, because it’s true that Asian American families have brought a change to the culture of schools, where you cannot do well anymore unless you spend significant amount of time studying outside of school either in enrichment classes or with your family. There’s no doubt that this is a cultural shift, brought from countries where this kind of studying outside of school is common, and where failure to secure jobs in a few specific fields means poverty.

I will freely say that as a parent this is simply not worth the stress and pressure to me. It’s not how I want to raise my kids. And, I know enough about America to know that there is more to life than aspiring to only a few prestigious colleges and careers. I am not going to fight about it, but I certainly am going to escape it. In our area the Asian American families won’t consider any schools ranked less than 7 or so on GreatSchools, so our local schools are largely free of this pressure. Nevertheless, kids go to colleges that are just fine with us, get good jobs, go to grad school, etc.

If you don’t like the new rules, you can choose not to play the game.

Love this. We picked the wrong neighborhood for a decade until we realized exactly what you say - this is not an ‘American’ culture - this decision to cram school which came from our first gen Russian, South Korean, Chinese and south Asian neighbors. Loved living in such a diverse hood for some reasons but man didn’t like the cram school culture. Really killed the fun. My kids often had no friends to play with after school when they were younger. We simply moved to a more traditional (white and African American neighborhood) - oddly enough for better schools for our kids — and it is better. Not perfect but better. By better I mean the district offers all that intense stuff if the child is wired for Harvard but also let’s you be a Hampshirite College kid too.

eh.. my Asian kids never had any tutoring, but there were no kids in our neighborhood to play with a lot of the times because they were too busy with organized sports. So many UMC/MC kids of all races are over scheduled with activities, including sports.

I purposefully didn't over schedule my kids, so they had a lot of free time, but I hadn't realized that the kids here are so over scheduled. We moved from out west.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

Asians are not white but are very much 'white adjacent. Hell, Asian people deep down have fought to be white adjacent. Furthermore, asian people like being grouped with white people. LOL!

In America you are treated based on your proximity to whiteness.

For example, do you really think it's a conidence that so many White men are married to asian women compared to Black and Hispanic women?

The majority of White men married to asian women would have not married their asian wives if their wife was black or hispanic. People are not colorblind and people do recognize patterns.

I've had white people straight up tell me this.

Maybe Asians should be the ones determining whether “white-adjacent” is an acceptable term to describe Asians? Do we let white people dictate what terms should be used to describe black people?

It reeks of Latinx. Latino/Hispanic people hate the term yet people continue to use it. “White-adjacent” is the Asian “Latinx.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

Asians are not white but are very much 'white adjacent. Hell, Asian people deep down have fought to be white adjacent. Furthermore, asian people like being grouped with white people. LOL!

In America you are treated based on your proximity to whiteness.

For example, do you really think it's a conidence that so many White men are married to asian women compared to Black and Hispanic women?

The majority of White men married to asian women would have not married their asian wives if their wife was black or hispanic. People are not colorblind and people do recognize patterns.

I've had white people straight up tell me this.

What a load of BS based on nothing but your own imagination.

To the different PP complaining about “Asian culture” - Asia is huge and made up of many cultures. I am Asian American, born and raised in America. I have had so many people say things to me assuming I am a tiger parent, my kids prep or are in extracurricular academics. None of that is true but the white people at our school assumed these things of us and it has been very isolating. You need to stop stereotyping your neighbors.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Speaking of “white culture,” more people need to call out the “white-adjacent” thing as being racist in its own right. No, Asians aren’t white, and no one would mistake an Asian for one. Why group Asians with white people then? Feels like an attempt to trivialize Asian issues and also justify discriminating against Asians.

Asians are not white but are very much 'white adjacent. Hell, Asian people deep down have fought to be white adjacent. Furthermore, asian people like being grouped with white people. LOL!

In America you are treated based on your proximity to whiteness.

For example, do you really think it's a conidence that so many White men are married to asian women compared to Black and Hispanic women?

The majority of White men married to asian women would have not married their asian wives if their wife was black or hispanic. People are not colorblind and people do recognize patterns.

I've had white people straight up tell me this.

What a load of BS based on nothing but your own imagination.

To the different PP complaining about “Asian culture” - Asia is huge and made up of many cultures. I am Asian American, born and raised in America. I have had so many people say things to me assuming I am a tiger parent, my kids prep or are in extracurricular academics. None of that is true but the white people at our school assumed these things of us and it has been very isolating. You need to stop stereotyping your neighbors.

+1 yea, people probably think that of me and my kids, too. DC is in a magnet program. Never been to a tutor in their lives, and I certainly didn't tutor them at home. The most I did was buy a Singapore math book from Amazon when they were younger because the way the school was teaching math was not very good. Once they hit MS, I was pretty much hands off, as long as they kept up their grades. And no, we don't "punish" them when they bring home a B.

I'm sure if we stereotyped, oh, let's way a bunch of black or Hispanic people, all the liberals, both white and black and in between, would be up in arms. But, it seems that stereotyping Asian people as one big monolith is a-ok with the "I support diversity and equality" set.

[Anonymous]

^btw, my kids did the Singapore mathbook themselves. I just told them to do it here and there.