How much are you actually paying your advocates/attorneys and are they even worth it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would start with an advocate to advocate for the IEP. Them get a lawyer for the placement issue down the line, since you aren't going to go from no IEP to restrictive placement in one step.

Nope, just go right to a special ed lawyer. Advocates are not a regulated field - waste of time and money.

OP here. The problem is that many of the lawyers we have spoken to want us to get an ed consultant first to do observations, etc to help the case. What do you do in this circumstance?

You interview people and figure out what the credentials are. For an advocate you want a credentialed SN professional, preferably a teacher. And yes they work in pairs a lot of the time. That's normal. And the fees that were quoted you were normal. We pay $300 an hour.

[Anonymous]

It seems the responses in this thread are all over the place. Get an advocate/don't get an advocate. Hire an attorney/don't hire an attorney. Get private therapy/don't get private anything. It sort of proves the point that every child is unique. Every family has their own set of needs. It's best to talk to different professionals to see who might be able to help you move forward. I have heard of advocates for as little as $100/hour and up to $300/hour. I think most give you a free consult. Talk to a few and if there's someone who feels right to you use them. None of them are perfect but many can help you move forward.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was back in the day, and maybe things have changed.

My son has mild autism, dyscalculia (disability in math), severe inattentive ADHD and very low processing speed, all of which meant he could not complete any work in the classroom at all. He was given an IEP straightaway, at Bethesda Elementary. He had pull-outs, a scribe (before he was able to write legible with reasonable speed) and group speech therapy for his speech delay, which also doubled as a social skills group.

Later on, with medication, executive function coaching and tutoring, he did a lot better. He was placed in the GT/LD program for middle and high school (gifted and talented, learning disordered, full of kids like him) and did well. He transitioned to a 504, since he did not need the IEP anymore.

This isn't a question of diagnoses, but of degree of impairment in the classroom. In elementary, my son simply could not function without services and accommodations. I've known plenty of ADHD/autistic kids with just a 504, because they were more functional than my son.

So how impaired is she?

You were lucky. We got 30 minutes group speech that was worthless as it was 6 kids with unrelated needs.

I don't recall exactly how much he had in school, but it sounds similar to what DS got. The SLP at that elementary was wonderful. I was so sad when she retired. We also paid for private speech therapy, but the school SLP was actually better.

All the school SLP's we dealt with were not wonderful. They were basic at best. Our private SLP was wonderful for years till she left to do something else.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would start with an advocate to advocate for the IEP. Them get a lawyer for the placement issue down the line, since you aren't going to go from no IEP to restrictive placement in one step.

Nope, just go right to a special ed lawyer. Advocates are not a regulated field - waste of time and money.

OP here. The problem is that many of the lawyers we have spoken to want us to get an ed consultant first to do observations, etc to help the case. What do you do in this circumstance?

I would get a really good private evaluation first.

[Anonymous]

Do research into how many get placement. You cant get blood from a stone.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve yet to meet a parent that got what they needed without a lawyer.

Plenty of us were able to get our kid what they need without a lawyer including outside placement.

+1. I walked into our CIEP meeting with just myself and donuts and coffee. I knew what the outcome was going to be. The hardest part was getting the meeting scheduled once we were referred to CIEP. That being said, I had evaluations done by the discrete programs in the county who all said they would not be able to accommodate my child. There was no other place to go except non public placement.

I think it’s different when your kid is sort of the middle. Higher needs than are available in a mainstream placement yet not acute enough for non public placement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This was back in the day, and maybe things have changed.

My son has mild autism, dyscalculia (disability in math), severe inattentive ADHD and very low processing speed, all of which meant he could not complete any work in the classroom at all. He was given an IEP straightaway, at Bethesda Elementary. He had pull-outs, a scribe (before he was able to write legible with reasonable speed) and group speech therapy for his speech delay, which also doubled as a social skills group.

Later on, with medication, executive function coaching and tutoring, he did a lot better. He was placed in the GT/LD program for middle and high school (gifted and talented, learning disordered, full of kids like him) and did well. He transitioned to a 504, since he did not need the IEP anymore.

This isn't a question of diagnoses, but of degree of impairment in the classroom. In elementary, my son simply could not function without services and accommodations. I've known plenty of ADHD/autistic kids with just a 504, because they were more functional than my son.

So how impaired is she?

Not surprising, considering this was BE.

Our experience at a different Bethesda [located] elementary could not have been more different. It was obvious there was an ongoing DS/school environment problem. We sought out and provided ASD, ADHD, private evals. The school in turn sent him to the office multiple times per week. Called us relentlessly to complain. Withheld recess for weeks. Yet, refused to consider eligibility for a 504 or IEP until we hired an attorney (this was years ago; we did not know enough to request in writing, ourselves). Tremendous foot-dragging on their end. Process took over a year.

OP, as you can see, each experience is different. For us, it was time and money well spent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’ve yet to meet a parent that got what they needed without a lawyer.

I’m one of the posters who said don’t bother. And how many do you know who didn’t get what they wanted with a lawyer? It’s unfortunate but all of us know so many who have spent a fortune on lawyers for different reasons, especially after 2020 and trying to get compensation or placement or services. We all did the best we could but in the meantime, our kids got older. I’m one who didn’t and just quickly pulled my kid when things got bad. I’m fortunate that I found an alternative that worked and could afford to supplement and spend money on that instead.

Do what is right for your child. You will be the best advocate and always trust your gut.

A good lawyer will advise you on what your child should be getting from the school system, and help you with the cost benefit analysis of fighting for it - or not.

signed,
a special ed attorney

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP here- our advocate was better than our attorney, Kim Glassman, who was not worth really anything we paid.

OP here. Thank you, this is helpful. Do you mind sharing how much you paid per hour for the advocate? We have gotten quotes from $150 up to $300 per hour for advocacy and it has been so varied.

How much did the attorney charge?

[Anonymous]

NYC private SN parent: upfront costs to get private neuropsych eval and private top psychiatrist and entry into a private SN school was hugely expensive. Then we hired an education to sue for reimbursement from the school district for said private SN school. BUT. Because NYS DOE reimburses approximately 100 percent for private SN schools it was absolutely worth the upfront expenses (which were not insignificant). I don't know what you mean in general by advocate because our NP suggested schools for us (we are spoiled for choice in NYC) and we sent NPs to all of them and toured those who considered DC a possible fit. In general, unfortunately, throwing money and lots of us at SN children for doctors, education, attorneys etc. is unavoidable and I am a frugal, careful person. But it paid off in spades. DC has been in the system since K and is now mostly remediated in academics and is functioning well socially (DX: language based LDs and ADHD). GL to you.

[Anonymous]

^ we hired an education attorney

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would start with an advocate to advocate for the IEP. Them get a lawyer for the placement issue down the line, since you aren't going to go from no IEP to restrictive placement in one step.

Nope, just go right to a special ed lawyer. Advocates are not a regulated field - waste of time and money.

OP here. The problem is that many of the lawyers we have spoken to want us to get an ed consultant first to do observations, etc to help the case. What do you do in this circumstance?

I would get a really good private evaluation first.

This is exactly the right path. You need documentation and independent observations that attest that your kid is in a bad placement. Your opinion isn't worth anything in a legal proceeding.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:PP here- our advocate was better than our attorney, Kim Glassman, who was not worth really anything we paid.

OP here. Thank you, this is helpful. Do you mind sharing how much you paid per hour for the advocate? We have gotten quotes from $150 up to $300 per hour for advocacy and it has been so varied.

How much did the attorney charge?

DP. Ten years ago my attorney's retainer was$2000 but we didn't spend anything beyond that because the school team agreed he needed private placement (that was from a LC placement).

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This was back in the day, and maybe things have changed.

My son has mild autism, dyscalculia (disability in math), severe inattentive ADHD and very low processing speed, all of which meant he could not complete any work in the classroom at all. He was given an IEP straightaway, at Bethesda Elementary. He had pull-outs, a scribe (before he was able to write legible with reasonable speed) and group speech therapy for his speech delay, which also doubled as a social skills group.

Later on, with medication, executive function coaching and tutoring, he did a lot better. He was placed in the GT/LD program for middle and high school (gifted and talented, learning disordered, full of kids like him) and did well. He transitioned to a 504, since he did not need the IEP anymore.

This isn't a question of diagnoses, but of degree of impairment in the classroom. In elementary, my son simply could not function without services and accommodations. I've known plenty of ADHD/autistic kids with just a 504, because they were more functional than my son.

So how impaired is she?

Not surprising, considering this was BE.

Our experience at a different Bethesda [located] elementary could not have been more different. It was obvious there was an ongoing DS/school environment problem. We sought out and provided ASD, ADHD, private evals. The school in turn sent him to the office multiple times per week. Called us relentlessly to complain. Withheld recess for weeks. Yet, refused to consider eligibility for a 504 or IEP until we hired an attorney (this was years ago; we did not know enough to request in writing, ourselves). Tremendous foot-dragging on their end. Process took over a year.

OP, as you can see, each experience is different. For us, it was time and money well spent.

PP you replied to. Yes, I am aware that Ms Seymour and her team are very supportive of disabilities and special needs. But we got the same helpful vibe from North Bethesda/Walter Johnson and Westland/BCC (I have several kids who attended different school clusters). Was the school you had trouble with Somerset, by any chance? I heard the Somerset Principal, back in the day (not the current one), was difficult to work with regarding SN services and accommodations. The Chevy Chase Principal is also a little quirky, and might or might not be helpful, depending on mood.

[Anonymous]

William jaffe, attorney. Charges by the hour. Honorable person. Will work with you.