Taking Both AP Calc AB (Junior Year) and AP Calc BC (Senior Year)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What does this mean: Rigor is a threshold or a tier? As long as you take calculus, top colleges don't care what further math you take, even if your school offers more? Maybe it makes folks feel better, but I really doubt that's true.

Math is sequential. The vast, vast majority of students do not have time in high school to take multivariable. No student is getting dinged in admissions for taking AB and then BC, even if the high school allows students to take BC as a standalone course which could lead to taking multivariable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Our HS apparently makes kids do AB first and then BC.

Our school allows you to go straight to BC but strongly recommends AB-->BC for students who are ready for calculus in junior year. My son did that and is in a math heavy -major at VT. Lots of kids struggle with math at VT. From AP credits he skipped calc 1 but took Calc 2 and was glad he did. It was still challenging but he got an A and had a really strong foundation before going on to higher level math. There is no reason to rush through math classes. You need to really understand calculus if you are going to be an engineering major, or other major with a lot of higher level math.

OTOH, calculus class has a lot of irrelevant "play puzzle" topics like nowhere differentiable functions and indefinite integrals and series, that are nearly completely irrelevant to engineering. Going through more of the basics is more important than doing these advanced "pure math" topics.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't "want to see" 1.5-2 years of university math in high school. "Most rigorous" is a tier, not "most advanced class theoretically possible in every subject".

Colleges know that people taking calculus don't fully learn the material in the class (only 20% even get 5s, which is already a low bar) so appreciate students taking their time to study calculus thoroughly.

i have to disagree with this. My son went all the way up to multivariable calc in high school and pulled those credits over to college and completely was able to skip calc 3 which only has a 50% pass rate at his school and thins out the COE. he’s graduating this May with a double major in CS and applied math and is already working part time since summer for his employer he’ll be full time with in May, making well over 100k/yr. His high school prepared him incredibly well in the area of math and science.

What are you disagreeing with?

Congrats, your child is a rare genius and has good teachers. I'm proud of you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What does this mean: Rigor is a threshold or a tier? As long as you take calculus, top colleges don't care what further math you take, even if your school offers more? Maybe it makes folks feel better, but I really doubt that's true.

Math is sequential. The vast, vast majority of students do not have time in high school to take multivariable. No student is getting dinged in admissions for taking AB and then BC, even if the high school allows students to take BC as a standalone course which could lead to taking multivariable.

True. In fact the kids at our school who got into the top colleges were not the ones in the multivariable class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Colleges don't "want to see" 1.5-2 years of university math in high school. "Most rigorous" is a tier, not "most advanced class theoretically possible in every subject".

Colleges know that people taking calculus don't fully learn the material in the class (only 20% even get 6s, which is already a low bar) so appreciate students taking their time to study calculus thoroughly.

i have to disagree with this. My son went all the way up to multivariable calc in high school and pulled those credits over to college and completely was able to skip calc 3 which only has a 50% pass rate at his school and thins out the COE. he’s graduating this May with a double major in CS and applied math and is already working part time since summer for his employer he’ll be full time with in May, making well over 100k/yr. His high school prepared him incredibly well in the area of math and science.

You aren't disagreeing; you are just saying your kid did it this way. That does not mean that is what colleges want from everyone. Obviously, at your kid's college, he was an outlier -- otherwise the classes he skipped would not be the 'weed out' classes. Most students actually take them in college.

[Anonymous]

Our high school requires AB and then BC . However, they do give approval for kids who are recommended to do both at the same time for those they know can handle it. They just don’t advertise it that way and bend for exceptional students.

[Anonymous]

That is exactly what our school district encourages/requires. Kids go from Pre-Calc to AP Calc AB and then onto BC. The first 4-5 weeks of BC are a review, done at a fast pace since it's basically Calc 1 at college (AB) and then BC is Calc 2. The teacher can cover it at a fast pace because it is assumed everyone had AB last year.

I like it, because it helps build a strong foundation in Calculus. BC is a hard course (calc 2 is known to be a killer course for engineering) so much better to do well and actually learn it

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If a child is interested in applying to engineering schools, is this a really bad choice? We have heard that these classes may be redundant but child is worried that moving directly into BC after pre-calculus may be very difficult - particularly given that they are taking a host of other AP classes at the same time.

If you are targeting T25, this is the least of your worries. If you are targeting below that level, they don't really care. Focus on rigor, GPA and getting a high SAT.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Skip AP go straight to BC. No reason to spend two years in calculus. BC with AP Statistics is solid.

My kid did AB in 11th, and BC and Stats in 12th. BC is Calc 1 and Calc 2. AB is Calc 1.

Our district requires you to do AB first. That means the kids do extremely well in BC. For over 10+ years, the BC students (50-60 each year) earn all 4/5 (there has only been two scores of 3 in over 10+ years) and in actuality, 90%+ earn 5s. That's impressive.
Much more important for kids to fully learn the material and build a strong foundation in calculus than to rush thru it.
Also, even if your HS offers Multivariable calc (to take in senior year), unless it's thru DE, there is no way for your kid to get college credit, so they will be retaking Calc 3 wherever they attend. My kid (who got 5s on both AB and BC) is at a T30 college and 40% of their Calc 3 class freshman year was kids who already had MVC but had no official College credit for it, so had to retake it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What does this mean: Rigor is a threshold or a tier? As long as you take calculus, top colleges don't care what further math you take, even if your school offers more? Maybe it makes folks feel better, but I really doubt that's true.

YUP! If you get thru BC (via AB in 11th and BC in 12th) that is considered rigorous enough for almost any college. Most colleges prefer you take Calc 3 + at their actual university.
In reality, having your first calc course in 11th grade is TWO YEARS ahead of normal. Your kid is on a rigorous path. And if your kid is only on the Precalc in Junior year, I wouldn't recommend BC senior year unless math is very easy for them. My kid did AB then BC and BC (after the first 4-5 weeks of AB review) was a challenge---first time they ever didn't have a 99%+ in math since K. Calc 2 is a hard course, it's often a weed out course at college. So I'm glad my kid did AB first, learned the concepts and didn't try to plow thru BC as their first calculus course in 11th grade.

They are at a rigorous college in engineering and did calc 3 & Calc 4 (LinAlg/Diff Eq) and earned A-/A in both. So they were well prepared.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD is doing this path now. Took AB last year and now in BC. She didn’t feel ready for BC last year. I think it’s fine and gives her a more solid understanding of calculus. Only the last two units in BC are new content, which they are starting just now. Interestingly, even though BC was a repeat the first semester she did better in AB, different teacher who she liked better.

Our school requires AB first, so they "rush" thru the AB material in 4-6 weeks, so BC new material can be taught over a longer period/at a slower pace and finish well before the AP test so plenty of time for review/test prep