What is the maximum class size in an elementary school?

[Anonymous]

The elementary school we are zoned for has 25-27 kids per class with ~3 classes per grade. I'm wondering what happens if there are over 90 kids. Do they add a class and get very small class size or will they just have over 30 kids per class? With the current trend, I feel it will easily reach 30.

[Anonymous]

Sometimes the school will have a combination class - say, combining 1st and 2nd grade - in cases where there are not enough for a full class in either grade.

[Anonymous]

Mixed classes are very unusual. It's possible that they would do that, but I think the 90+ kids happens pretty regularly and they just make 4 classes (especially if it is 3rd grade or 5th grade b/c they take 5 SOL subject tests). You can look up the "membership" trends at any school and it will show you the month by month break down by grade. Schools don't typically get 10 new kids in ONE class after school starts. And I think the principals strategically lower (by having 4 classes rather than 3) the class sizes in 3rd and 5th grade at the beginning of the year b/c of those SOLs.

[Anonymous]

There really isn't a max on class size unless you're in a Title 1 school. Then the state puts a cap at the lower levels based on your percentage of students in poverty. For some schools it might be a cap of 20 in grades k-3 and in other Title 1 schools it might be 24.

Schools are staffed based on their enrollment in grades 1-6. (Kindergarten is staff separately). A principal has the discretion to staff grades however he/she sees fit. If over the summer, a lot of students unexpectedly move in, then the school may qualify for an additional teacher. Again, the principal can put that teacher wherever she/he feels. But numbers going up in a particular grade level does not automatically kick in an additional teacher. It's the overall enrollment numbers in grades 1-6 that have to reach a certain point.

[Anonymous]

we got to at least 30 this year in K. It happens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:we got to at least 30 this year in K. It happens.

Same in 2nd... but we started the year that way.

[Anonymous]

Depends on the school district. Different districts have different max class sizes. One thing I like about Alexandria (yes, I know--there are down sides too) is that ACPS is very committed to smaller classroom size. I *think* the max size for K is 22, then it moves up to 23-24 for 1-2, and then 25-26 for 3-5.

[Anonymous]

There have been a few discussion on this topic before, including this one: http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/45/187092.page

I responded in that thread as follows:


Actually, the max allowable depends on the age group --
so for 1st-3rd, it's 30 students
for 4-6, it's 35 max.

I found this out by calling the county, because I was curious. Mind you, it took a while to get a straight answer. The person I spoke with told me they follow the state mandates as far as the maximum allowable student/teacher ratio. So here is the link and the applicable section. I've cut/pasted it below:

§ 22.1-253.13:2. Standard 2. Instructional, administrative, and support personnel.
http://www.doe.virginia.gov/administrators/superin...endents_memos/2011/196-11a.pdf

C. Each school board shall assign licensed instructional personnel in a manner that produces divisionwide ratios of students in average daily membership to full-time equivalent teaching positions, excluding special education teachers, principals, assistant principals, counselors, and librarians, that are not greater than the following ratios: (i) 24 to one in kindergarten with no class being larger than 29 students; if the average daily membership in any kindergarten class exceeds 24 pupils, a full-time teacher's aide shall be assigned to the class; (ii) 24 to one in grades one, two, and three with no class being larger than 30 students; (iii) 25 to one in grades four through six with no class being larger than 35 students; and (iv) 24 to one in English classes in grades six through 12.



Incidentally, subsequent to posting that response, I was told by a teacher that Fairfax follows different guidelines for AAP classrooms (smaller class sizes). I can't site to any standards on that though.

[Anonymous]

our school tries to keep K-2 at 26 students or under. Not sure how they do this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There have been a few discussion on this topic before, including this one: http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/45/187092.page

I responded in that thread as follows:


Actually, the max allowable depends on the age group --
so for 1st-3rd, it's 30 students
for 4-6, it's 35 max.

I found this out by calling the county, because I was curious. Mind you, it took a while to get a straight answer. The person I spoke with told me they follow the state mandates as far as the maximum allowable student/teacher ratio. So here is the link and the applicable section. I've cut/pasted it below:

§ 22.1-253.13:2. Standard 2. Instructional, administrative, and support personnel.
http://www.doe.virginia.gov/administrators/superin...endents_memos/2011/196-11a.pdf

C. Each school board shall assign licensed instructional personnel in a manner that produces divisionwide ratios of students in average daily membership to full-time equivalent teaching positions, excluding special education teachers, principals, assistant principals, counselors, and librarians, that are not greater than the following ratios: (i) 24 to one in kindergarten with no class being larger than 29 students; if the average daily membership in any kindergarten class exceeds 24 pupils, a full-time teacher's aide shall be assigned to the class; (ii) 24 to one in grades one, two, and three with no class being larger than 30 students; (iii) 25 to one in grades four through six with no class being larger than 35 students; and (iv) 24 to one in English classes in grades six through 12.



Incidentally, subsequent to posting that response, I was told by a teacher that Fairfax follows different guidelines for AAP classrooms (smaller class sizes). I can't site to any standards on that though.

Not true at all. There was actually a proposal a few years ago to allow more kids in AAP classes than in general ed...not sure whatever happened with it, but at our school the AAP classes are larger than he general ed classes. The ridiculousness of it all is that the proportion of kids with ADHD and kids on the spectrum is larger in AAP, so larger class sizes make absolutely no sense.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There have been a few discussion on this topic before, including this one: http://www.dcurbanmom.com/jforum/posts/list/45/187092.page

I responded in that thread as follows:


Actually, the max allowable depends on the age group --
so for 1st-3rd, it's 30 students
for 4-6, it's 35 max.

I found this out by calling the county, because I was curious. Mind you, it took a while to get a straight answer. The person I spoke with told me they follow the state mandates as far as the maximum allowable student/teacher ratio. So here is the link and the applicable section. I've cut/pasted it below:

§ 22.1-253.13:2. Standard 2. Instructional, administrative, and support personnel.
http://www.doe.virginia.gov/administrators/superin...endents_memos/2011/196-11a.pdf

C. Each school board shall assign licensed instructional personnel in a manner that produces divisionwide ratios of students in average daily membership to full-time equivalent teaching positions, excluding special education teachers, principals, assistant principals, counselors, and librarians, that are not greater than the following ratios: (i) 24 to one in kindergarten with no class being larger than 29 students; if the average daily membership in any kindergarten class exceeds 24 pupils, a full-time teacher's aide shall be assigned to the class; (ii) 24 to one in grades one, two, and three with no class being larger than 30 students; (iii) 25 to one in grades four through six with no class being larger than 35 students; and (iv) 24 to one in English classes in grades six through 12.



Incidentally, subsequent to posting that response, I was told by a teacher that Fairfax follows different guidelines for AAP classrooms (smaller class sizes). I can't site to any standards on that though.

Not true at all. There was actually a proposal a few years ago to allow more kids in AAP classes than in general ed...not sure whatever happened with it, but at our school the AAP classes are larger than he general ed classes. The ridiculousness of it all is that the proportion of kids with ADHD and kids on the spectrum is larger in AAP, so larger class sizes make absolutely no sense.

I guess you're right. After reading your reply, I tried to find a quick answer on the county website and found this:
http://www.fcps.edu/is/aap/faqs/esfaqs.shtml, which states about 3/4 of the way down:

What are the student-teacher ratios for students who receive Local Level IV Services and full-time AAP (level IV) center classes?

The staffing formula for Local Level IV Services and full-time AAP (level IV) centers is the same as for general education classes.
[b]