Moving from Arlington to Bethesda(ish) for job--best school clusters?

[Anonymous]

There are people who prioritize fancy vacations and people who don't. When we moved here from out of state one of the things a kid at the public school bus stop said to my kid was " I can't believe you've never been swimming with dolphins!"

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

School's with 5% FARMS adjacent to schools with 30% FARMS will likely have their boundaries adjusted to meet the new diversity criteria which the board added the other year.

This is false. The board did not add a new diversity criterion. Here are the four factors to be considered during boundary studies:

1. geography
2. facility utilization
3. continuity of school assignment
4. demographics

That's what they were, that's what they continue to be.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are people who prioritize fancy vacations and people who don't. When we moved here from out of state one of the things a kid at the public school bus stop said to my kid was " I can't believe you've never been swimming with dolphins!"

There are affluent people who prioritize fancy vacations and affluent people who don't.

(Fixed that for you.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are people who prioritize fancy vacations and people who don't. When we moved here from out of state one of the things a kid at the public school bus stop said to my kid was " I can't believe you've never been swimming with dolphins!"

There are affluent people who prioritize fancy vacations and affluent people who don't.

(Fixed that for you.)

Sure. Sometimes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

School's with 5% FARMS adjacent to schools with 30% FARMS will likely have their boundaries adjusted to meet the new diversity criteria which the board added the other year.

This is false. The board did not add a new diversity criterion. Here are the four factors to be considered during boundary studies:

1. geography
2. facility utilization
3. continuity of school assignment
4. demographics

That's what they were, that's what they continue to be.

They did say that they were going to put greater emphasis on demographics, though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here, once again--thanks to all who have provided helpful replies.

To be clear, we're genuinely not interested in private school. Our child was at one of the top schools in the DMV until recently and we weren't impressed. I don't want to start yet another public vs. private war.

If it makes MCPS families feel any better, I am hearing all of the same complaints about the district "going downhill" from FCPS families, too. I don't think it's a MD vs. VA thing. I think it's a pandemic thing.

What I don't understand, because I only recently started reading anything to do with MoCo, is if there are problems that go beyond the current issues with DL and the admin during the pandemic. I'd like to treat this as a discrete issue, since it won't last forever.

If the posters complaining about MCPS are just upset about DL/leadership during COVID, then it's really no concern of mine. If there are larger structural issues to be aware of, that would be good to know. Ex. we are currently zoned in APS and there is a *huge* divide in school quality between North Arlington and South Arlington--it's really discouraging. FCPS also has really uneven quality between "have" and "have not" schools. Magnets are all done by lottery and we've been waitlisted in the 200s each time we've applied at the ES level. TJ, the STEM magnet, is moving to a lottery-based admissions system as well, rather than a test-based one.

My impression is that MCPS is more equitable, though there are pockets of concentrated wealth (I get the sense this is Whitman/BCC clusters?). It seems like there are accessible pathways to a really great education whether you live in Bethesda, or Kensington, or Rockville, or Silver Spring, even if there is some variance in test scores/course offerings at home schools. Is that a fair assessment?

Yep. Exactly, that's a fair assessment.
There are lots of programs and offerings all over MCPS.

+1 Agreed. You definitely have options.

All the W clusters have a lot of wealth not just BCC and Whitman. Churchill and Wooton are in Potomac and Bethesda and Kensingtn are in WJ.

That's true, but people (especially on this board) sometimes have a distorted view of the degree of wealth, even at a place like Whitman.

There are lots of small, old, very modest homes throughout the Whitman cluster, for example in Bannockburn or Wood Acres. Now, because of the location, these homes that most on this board would call sh!t shacks still sell in the 8-900K range. Most families who buy there are very much stretching to get into the neighborhood and work normal-ish jobs with salaries that are hardly crazy for this area.

Of course such a family isn't poor. They still make more than most, even in this area. But they aren't remotely living a luxurious lifestyle jetting off on fancy vacations or even doing regular fancy meals out. In large part because they are stretching for the house, a lot of other aspects of their life really are more middle class with old Camrys, a week at the shore as vacation, etc.

And many of those smaller, older houses in the worst conditions, are torn down for new builds, which are very expensive.
That is something to consider PP. If you buy in Kensington you'll be paying a chunk less than if you buy in Edgmoor. And you'll take a lot longer to sell it.

Some do get torn down and the new builds are substantially more expensive. It obviously depends on the quality/size of the lot, but the breaking point between tear down and not seems to be around $700k. If someone will pay more than that to live in the house, it usually won't be worth a builder to pay more.

Edgemoor is also one of the most expensive areas in Bethesda, much more so than the neighborhoods I mentioned.

Your data is old. A house sold for over $2mil on Moorland Road this past year. The house that was built on it looks like a $4-5 mil house. This is the kind of change we're seeing. Kensington will top out at $1.5mil for a new build and yes, the old tear down had better be no more than $700k.

Moorland Rd is in downtown Bethesda and zoned for BCC. I was talking about (relatively) more affordable neighborhoods zoned for Whitman, such as Bannockburn and Wood Acres.

My data isn't old. You are looking at an area that is in a different price range because of walkability to downtown Bethesda.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here, once again--thanks to all who have provided helpful replies.

To be clear, we're genuinely not interested in private school. Our child was at one of the top schools in the DMV until recently and we weren't impressed. I don't want to start yet another public vs. private war.

If it makes MCPS families feel any better, I am hearing all of the same complaints about the district "going downhill" from FCPS families, too. I don't think it's a MD vs. VA thing. I think it's a pandemic thing.

What I don't understand, because I only recently started reading anything to do with MoCo, is if there are problems that go beyond the current issues with DL and the admin during the pandemic. I'd like to treat this as a discrete issue, since it won't last forever.

If the posters complaining about MCPS are just upset about DL/leadership during COVID, then it's really no concern of mine. If there are larger structural issues to be aware of, that would be good to know. Ex. we are currently zoned in APS and there is a *huge* divide in school quality between North Arlington and South Arlington--it's really discouraging. FCPS also has really uneven quality between "have" and "have not" schools. Magnets are all done by lottery and we've been waitlisted in the 200s each time we've applied at the ES level. TJ, the STEM magnet, is moving to a lottery-based admissions system as well, rather than a test-based one.

My impression is that MCPS is more equitable, though there are pockets of concentrated wealth (I get the sense this is Whitman/BCC clusters?). It seems like there are accessible pathways to a really great education whether you live in Bethesda, or Kensington, or Rockville, or Silver Spring, even if there is some variance in test scores/course offerings at home schools. Is that a fair assessment?

Yep. Exactly, that's a fair assessment.
There are lots of programs and offerings all over MCPS.

+1 Agreed. You definitely have options.

All the W clusters have a lot of wealth not just BCC and Whitman. Churchill and Wooton are in Potomac and Bethesda and Kensingtn are in WJ.

That's true, but people (especially on this board) sometimes have a distorted view of the degree of wealth, even at a place like Whitman.

There are lots of small, old, very modest homes throughout the Whitman cluster, for example in Bannockburn or Wood Acres. Now, because of the location, these homes that most on this board would call sh!t shacks still sell in the 8-900K range. Most families who buy there are very much stretching to get into the neighborhood and work normal-ish jobs with salaries that are hardly crazy for this area.

Of course such a family isn't poor. They still make more than most, even in this area. But they aren't remotely living a luxurious lifestyle jetting off on fancy vacations or even doing regular fancy meals out. In large part because they are stretching for the house, a lot of other aspects of their life really are more middle class with old Camrys, a week at the shore as vacation, etc.

And many of those smaller, older houses in the worst conditions, are torn down for new builds, which are very expensive.
That is something to consider PP. If you buy in Kensington you'll be paying a chunk less than if you buy in Edgmoor. And you'll take a lot longer to sell it.

Some do get torn down and the new builds are substantially more expensive. It obviously depends on the quality/size of the lot, but the breaking point between tear down and not seems to be around $700k. If someone will pay more than that to live in the house, it usually won't be worth a builder to pay more.

Edgemoor is also one of the most expensive areas in Bethesda, much more so than the neighborhoods I mentioned.

Your data is old. A house sold for over $2mil on Moorland Road this past year. The house that was built on it looks like a $4-5 mil house. This is the kind of change we're seeing. Kensington will top out at $1.5mil for a new build and yes, the old tear down had better be no more than $700k.

Moorland Rd is in downtown Bethesda and zoned for BCC. I was talking about (relatively) more affordable neighborhoods zoned for Whitman, such as Bannockburn and Wood Acres.

My data isn't old. You are looking at an area that is in a different price range because of walkability to downtown Bethesda.

Ok fair enough. I think more of the really small houses that are not getting torn down, but bought by families seeking the local education, are in the northern part of the Bradley Hills ES zone.

[Anonymous]

Some of Edgemoor is zoned for Whitman

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There are people who prioritize fancy vacations and people who don't. When we moved here from out of state one of the things a kid at the public school bus stop said to my kid was " I can't believe you've never been swimming with dolphins!"

There are affluent people who prioritize fancy vacations and affluent people who don't.

(Fixed that for you.)

Sure. Sometimes.

Non-affluent people are unable to prioritize fancy vacations, no matter how much they might want to.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

School's with 5% FARMS adjacent to schools with 30% FARMS will likely have their boundaries adjusted to meet the new diversity criteria which the board added the other year.

This is false. The board did not add a new diversity criterion. Here are the four factors to be considered during boundary studies:

1. geography
2. facility utilization
3. continuity of school assignment
4. demographics

That's what they were, that's what they continue to be.

They did say that they were going to put greater emphasis on demographics, though.

No, they didn't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:OP here, once again--thanks to all who have provided helpful replies.

To be clear, we're genuinely not interested in private school. Our child was at one of the top schools in the DMV until recently and we weren't impressed. I don't want to start yet another public vs. private war.

If it makes MCPS families feel any better, I am hearing all of the same complaints about the district "going downhill" from FCPS families, too. I don't think it's a MD vs. VA thing. I think it's a pandemic thing.

What I don't understand, because I only recently started reading anything to do with MoCo, is if there are problems that go beyond the current issues with DL and the admin during the pandemic. I'd like to treat this as a discrete issue, since it won't last forever.

If the posters complaining about MCPS are just upset about DL/leadership during COVID, then it's really no concern of mine. If there are larger structural issues to be aware of, that would be good to know. Ex. we are currently zoned in APS and there is a *huge* divide in school quality between North Arlington and South Arlington--it's really discouraging. FCPS also has really uneven quality between "have" and "have not" schools. Magnets are all done by lottery and we've been waitlisted in the 200s each time we've applied at the ES level. TJ, the STEM magnet, is moving to a lottery-based admissions system as well, rather than a test-based one.

My impression is that MCPS is more equitable, though there are pockets of concentrated wealth (I get the sense this is Whitman/BCC clusters?). It seems like there are accessible pathways to a really great education whether you live in Bethesda, or Kensington, or Rockville, or Silver Spring, even if there is some variance in test scores/course offerings at home schools. Is that a fair assessment?

Yep. Exactly, that's a fair assessment.
There are lots of programs and offerings all over MCPS.

+1 Agreed. You definitely have options.

All the W clusters have a lot of wealth not just BCC and Whitman. Churchill and Wooton are in Potomac and Bethesda and Kensingtn are in WJ.

That's true, but people (especially on this board) sometimes have a distorted view of the degree of wealth, even at a place like Whitman.

There are lots of small, old, very modest homes throughout the Whitman cluster, for example in Bannockburn or Wood Acres. Now, because of the location, these homes that most on this board would call sh!t shacks still sell in the 8-900K range. Most families who buy there are very much stretching to get into the neighborhood and work normal-ish jobs with salaries that are hardly crazy for this area.

Of course such a family isn't poor. They still make more than most, even in this area. But they aren't remotely living a luxurious lifestyle jetting off on fancy vacations or even doing regular fancy meals out. In large part because they are stretching for the house, a lot of other aspects of their life really are more middle class with old Camrys, a week at the shore as vacation, etc.

And many of those smaller, older houses in the worst conditions, are torn down for new builds, which are very expensive.
That is something to consider PP. If you buy in Kensington you'll be paying a chunk less than if you buy in Edgmoor. And you'll take a lot longer to sell it.

Some do get torn down and the new builds are substantially more expensive. It obviously depends on the quality/size of the lot, but the breaking point between tear down and not seems to be around $700k. If someone will pay more than that to live in the house, it usually won't be worth a builder to pay more.

Edgemoor is also one of the most expensive areas in Bethesda, much more so than the neighborhoods I mentioned.

Your data is old. A house sold for over $2mil on Moorland Road this past year. The house that was built on it looks like a $4-5 mil house. This is the kind of change we're seeing. Kensington will top out at $1.5mil for a new build and yes, the old tear down had better be no more than $700k.

Moorland Rd is in downtown Bethesda and zoned for BCC. I was talking about (relatively) more affordable neighborhoods zoned for Whitman, such as Bannockburn and Wood Acres.

My data isn't old. You are looking at an area that is in a different price range because of walkability to downtown Bethesda.

Ok fair enough. I think more of the really small houses that are not getting torn down, but bought by families seeking the local education, are in the northern part of the Bradley Hills ES zone.

Sure, I have no reason to believe that the same factors wouldn't be in play in the Bradley Hills zone. Those neighborhoods are very similar to the ones I mentioned in that they are inside the Beltway and a short drive (but not walkable to) Bethesda and I would expect real estate to be similar. I'm just more personally familiar with the neighborhoods I mentioned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

That's true, but people (especially on this board) sometimes have a distorted view of the degree of wealth, even at a place like Whitman.

There are lots of small, old, very modest homes throughout the Whitman cluster, for example in Bannockburn or Wood Acres. Now, because of the location, these homes that most on this board would call sh!t shacks still sell in the 8-900K range. Most families who buy there are very much stretching to get into the neighborhood and work normal-ish jobs with salaries that are hardly crazy for this area.

Of course such a family isn't poor. They still make more than most, even in this area. But they aren't remotely living a luxurious lifestyle jetting off on fancy vacations or even doing regular fancy meals out. In large part because they are stretching for the house, a lot of other aspects of their life really are more middle class with old Camrys, a week at the shore as vacation, etc.

The above is true. However. In a system such as MCPS, which offers multiple pathways towards a great education (as you rightfully pointed out, OP), and because we're now in 2021, we need to ask what stretching to get into Whitman, or any W school, is really about. You're not paying for differences in curriculum, or school buildings, or class sizes, you're paying for differences in people. Specifically, those who value "academics" above most other things. One could point out that's a valid choice, and it would be except that MCPS offers myriad options for people who value "academics." So, it's not really about that. And, IME, the ones who stretch the most to get into those districts were protesting the loudest about any possible boundary adjustment, i.e., keep that in mind about which people they've been working hard to avoid.

To go back to your point, OP, the concentrated wealth lies in neighborhoods zoned for Whitman, Churchill, BCC, WJ, Wootton, in roughly that order. That may or may not matter to you. But, your assessment that kids can live pretty much anywhere in MoCo and get an excellent education is accurate. So: decide what location is most convenient for your commutes, consider any variables that matter to you (walkability, neighborhood pool, diversity, huge lots, etc.), and go from there.

Some of the reason that these areas are more expensive is that they are located closer-in to DC and are considered desirable for reasons other than schools, although of course that is a factor.

That's certainly true for neighborhoods zoned for B-CC and parts of WJ. But Wootton? Churchill? Nah. The DCC schools are much closer to DC than those.

As for desirable for reasons other than schools, that would be true of the parts of Potomac with colossal lots, if you want horses or something. Why Wootton would be preferable to, say, Quince Orchard or Sherwood for reasons other than schools is beyond me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Are you moving here because the person in the job prior to you left MOCO like everyone else?

Awooga! Russian Troll Alert!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you moving here because the person in the job prior to you left MOCO like everyone else?

Awooga! Russian Troll Alert!

No, it's an idiot alert for your post.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Are you moving here because the person in the job prior to you left MOCO like everyone else?

Awooga! Russian Troll Alert!

I'm sure the Russians are very concerned about the MD v. VA v. DC debate prevalent here.