Can someone explain the wealthy military officer phenomenon?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Late to the party here, but in all honestly, I think our high school counselors did many of us a disservice by directing us to go to 4-year universities.

I had lots of friends who after taking the ASVAB enlisted in the military at 18, retired 20 years later at 38 with pension and benefits, then started new careers in the private sector. They're all doing well now. The ones who become mustangs are doing particularly well... even not having reached the O-6 level.

While serving, the biggest expense for many was their car. While overseas, they got housing allowances allowing them to save up. For the ones deployed to combat zones, they got extra pay and their families typically stayed with parents back home. Not unusual at all to retire by 38 with a net worth over one million, no debts, then get a 150k job a year as a contractor.

Again, our high school guidance counselors did many of us a disservice.

Well, seems like your pollyanish view assumes you never see actual combat. I am not sure the families of dead soldiers, or ones with severe PTSD or lost limbs think it was a great career move.

Some massive %age of homeless people are veterans...so there is that too.

Which is one of the reasons I hate this thread. So many have died serving our country. My dad was in the military. I’m not going to begrudge any benefits they receive. I’ll just say THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

That’s a really interesting point that I hadn’t considered.

Your observation actually makes a lot of sense and explains the persistent, perceived sense of entitlement that I saw from so many officers’ wives.

Although, lol, I think maybe some of the wives are as delusional about their forfeited potential as their “I could have been CEO of a Fortune 500 company” officer husbands who choose to stay in until retirement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Late to the party here, but in all honestly, I think our high school counselors did many of us a disservice by directing us to go to 4-year universities.

I had lots of friends who after taking the ASVAB enlisted in the military at 18, retired 20 years later at 38 with pension and benefits, then started new careers in the private sector. They're all doing well now. The ones who become mustangs are doing particularly well... even not having reached the O-6 level.

While serving, the biggest expense for many was their car. While overseas, they got housing allowances allowing them to save up. For the ones deployed to combat zones, they got extra pay and their families typically stayed with parents back home. Not unusual at all to retire by 38 with a net worth over one million, no debts, then get a 150k job a year as a contractor.

Again, our high school guidance counselors did many of us a disservice.

Well, seems like your pollyanish view assumes you never see actual combat. I am not sure the families of dead soldiers, or ones with severe PTSD or lost limbs think it was a great career move.

Some massive %age of homeless people are veterans...so there is that too.

Which is one of the reasons I hate this thread. So many have died serving our country. My dad was in the military. I’m not going to begrudge any benefits they receive. I’ll just say THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

It literally does, though. DH transferred his GI Bill to our oldest, who chose a service academy, so he transferred it again to our youngest, who's going for free. You're not making your case like you think you are.

If you’re military you should realize what a stupid and clueless post it was to say “Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.” That just isn’t accurate.
Yes, the GI bill can help pay for college for one child, or split among children for the equivalent of one college education, but they indicate ALL military kids are getting scholarships at private schools and free college tuition. That’s a very incorrect assertion. I’ve got four kids and we’ve yet to use the post-911 GI bill because other scholarships offered to our child made the cost less. The GI bill comes with a lot of caveats - it’s not as if your child can go to any college and be fully covered. For example it was more expensive to use the GI Bill at MIT than to take financial aid from FAFSA.

It covered, or will cover, your children’s college because one chose a service academy and you only had two kids. Surely you can realize that not everyone fits into that circumstance?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

That’s a really interesting point that I hadn’t considered.

Your observation actually makes a lot of sense and explains the persistent, perceived sense of entitlement that I saw from so many officers’ wives.

Although, lol, I think maybe some of the wives are as delusional about their forfeited potential as their “I could have been CEO of a Fortune 500 company” officer husbands who choose to stay in until retirement.

Yes, you seem really sweet and not judgmental at all. I’m sure it was all them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

It literally does, though. DH transferred his GI Bill to our oldest, who chose a service academy, so he transferred it again to our youngest, who's going for free. You're not making your case like you think you are.

If you’re military you should realize what a stupid and clueless post it was to say “Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.” That just isn’t accurate.
Yes, the GI bill can help pay for college for one child, or split among children for the equivalent of one college education, but they indicate ALL military kids are getting scholarships at private schools and free college tuition. That’s a very incorrect assertion. I’ve got four kids and we’ve yet to use the post-911 GI bill because other scholarships offered to our child made the cost less. The GI bill comes with a lot of caveats - it’s not as if your child can go to any college and be fully covered. For example it was more expensive to use the GI Bill at MIT than to take financial aid from FAFSA.

It covered, or will cover, your children’s college because one chose a service academy and you only had two kids. Surely you can realize that not everyone fits into that circumstance?

Yeah, I’m the PP that poster responded to and my point stands. It can help pay for college for one child. There is no universal benefit of free or even reduced college costs for every child. PP is, accordingly, getting college paid via GI Bill for one child.

There are some programs and specific scholarships, sure, but not an absolute.

The service academy thing is great - and congrats to them for that! - but that’s not an automatic benefit afforded to military children and has nothing to do with the GI Bill.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

+1. Totally agree. The PP makes it sound like military children just walk up to registrar’s office and get their free college easy breezy. That’s not the way it works.

I mean, I was excited to hear about this mythical benefit I didn’t know existed. 🤣

It literally does, though. DH transferred his GI Bill to our oldest, who chose a service academy, so he transferred it again to our youngest, who's going for free. You're not making your case like you think you are.

If you’re military you should realize what a stupid and clueless post it was to say “Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.” That just isn’t accurate.
Yes, the GI bill can help pay for college for one child, or split among children for the equivalent of one college education, but they indicate ALL military kids are getting scholarships at private schools and free college tuition. That’s a very incorrect assertion. I’ve got four kids and we’ve yet to use the post-911 GI bill because other scholarships offered to our child made the cost less. The GI bill comes with a lot of caveats - it’s not as if your child can go to any college and be fully covered. For example it was more expensive to use the GI Bill at MIT than to take financial aid from FAFSA.

It covered, or will cover, your children’s college because one chose a service academy and you only had two kids. Surely you can realize that not everyone fits into that circumstance?

Yeah, I’m the PP that poster responded to and my point stands. It can help pay for college for one child. There is no universal benefit of free or even reduced college costs for every child. PP is, accordingly, getting college paid via GI Bill for one child.

There are some programs and specific scholarships, sure, but not an absolute.

The service academy thing is great - and congrats to them for that! - but that’s not an automatic benefit afforded to military children and has nothing to do with the GI Bill.

Exactly. Following that logic everyone’s kid (including civilians) can get free college by just choosing a service academy. It’s not a benefit tied to the parent’s military service at all.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

You get in state tuition for any kid using any portion of it. If you can't swing in state tuition on an officer's salary, that's your problem

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s not that they’re so wealthy. They’re more along the lines of lower end of UMC. They avoided a lot of debt due to military benefits. They’re not flying business class and sending kids to private school.

Yes they are. There are military schools that give scholarships to military children. Then they also get college free.

Where are all these military children getting free college? IF the parent has GI Bill benefits available and IF they transfer these to their child, they could have the benefit. But that assumes a few things. One, that they did not use the benefit themselves first. Two, that they want to incur the additional 6 year service obligation the transfer requires. Lastly, the benefit is capped and would really only cover a 4 year school for one child.


If military kids are widely getting college for free in other ways, please enlighten me. I’d love to know for the future!

The benefit is capped, can be split and gets any kid using it instate tuition


https://www.va.gov/resources/in-state-tuition-rates-under-the-veterans-choice-act/

Okay, so it can be split. How does that change the fact that it is capped and wouldn’t get more than one child though a 4 year school?

Sure, if everything lines up and the parent wants to invite the additional service obligation ONE kid could get their degree fully paid. But it’s certainly not as simple as proclaiming that “military children get free college.” That’s not true anywhere near universally.

You get in state tuition for any kid using any portion of it. If you can't swing in state tuition on an officer's salary, that's your problem

While they’re using the GI bill. Once they stop, you revert to out of state in some states (like Virginia). Again, the GI bill comes with a lot of caveats. How you went from “military children get free college” to “you get in state tuition for any kid using a portion of the GI bill” (which not every service member has) is some strange line of thinking. In-state tuition doesn’t equal free obviously.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

haha they got nothin on FS wives

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Got married early, earned extra for every deployment since were married. Lived cheaply on base or got the housing and family allowance (tax free) and bought houses in every state they were based. When dh was active duty, he got like $3k in housing allowance in the DC area which paid our mortgage and it was tax free.
Free healthcare for the military member, much reduced healthcare for kids, reduced cost daycare, tax free groceries and booze, VA loans (dh is considered sufficiently disabled so we get no cost refis), no student debt. Also much better to go in as officers and not enlisted.

They also earn money from renting out any houses owned outright.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

haha they got nothin on FS wives

FS? Depends on the generation. Back in the day, women went to college in order to find a husband. If they came from timbucktoo - anything was a step up, so they were not "sacrificing" anything, in terms of relocating with their husaband, getting paid to do it, and having movers and packers paid, to boot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

That’s a really interesting point that I hadn’t considered.

Your observation actually makes a lot of sense and explains the persistent, perceived sense of entitlement that I saw from so many officers’ wives.

Although, lol, I think maybe some of the wives are as delusional about their forfeited potential as their “I could have been CEO of a Fortune 500 company” officer husbands who choose to stay in until retirement.

+1 DP here. From what I have seen, military wives have an elevated lifestyle, compared to what they would otherwise have (had they not married an officer). Burial in Arlington Cemetery, for one. She would have had that being a teacher?

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Anonymous wrote:Late to the party here, but in all honestly, I think our high school counselors did many of us a disservice by directing us to go to 4-year universities.

I had lots of friends who after taking the ASVAB enlisted in the military at 18, retired 20 years later at 38 with pension and benefits, then started new careers in the private sector. They're all doing well now. The ones who become mustangs are doing particularly well... even not having reached the O-6 level.

While serving, the biggest expense for many was their car. While overseas, they got housing allowances allowing them to save up. For the ones deployed to combat zones, they got extra pay and their families typically stayed with parents back home. Not unusual at all to retire by 38 with a net worth over one million, no debts, then get a 150k job a year as a contractor.

Again, our high school guidance counselors did many of us a disservice.

Well, seems like your pollyanish view assumes you never see actual combat. I am not sure the families of dead soldiers, or ones with severe PTSD or lost limbs think it was a great career move.

Some massive %age of homeless people are veterans...so there is that too.

Which is one of the reasons I hate this thread. So many have died serving our country. My dad was in the military. I’m not going to begrudge any benefits they receive. I’ll just say THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE.

+1

DP here. I agree with thank you for your service - but they signed up mostly for the benefits, it is not like they signed up for the hell of it.

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Anonymous wrote:It’s because the taxpayer funds a huge portion of their expenses (housing while on base, no down payment for Va loans, the list goes on). Welfare queens to the max

+1. Even one of Reagan's hires (Stockdale, I think his name may be) wrote a book a few years ago describing the US military as socialistic. But if you dare question it, you're labeled a "communist" or worse. DH has several retired military in his family, and when they start bragging about their free health care and whatnot at Thanksgiving, I say "you're welcome."

Maybe when the conversation turns to the safe and free society we live in, your retired military family members can turn to you and say, “You’re welcome.”

Oh, they do, at every turn.

Good, I’m glad you are making sure to thank them for their service.

You are thanking them, right, and that’s why they’re saying, “You’re welcome”?

Thanking them for their service is cringe. They didn’t do it for you.

This.

The elephant in the room is that many people join or stay in the military because it is their best (financial ) option.

That is not politically correct but it is true. (That is why they use bonuses to get them to re-up, not flags or the constitution!)

Come on. That's not true. Of all the officers that got to retirement there isn't a single one I know that did it for a paycheck. Many easier careers that don't totally burn your family and regularly puts you at risk.

My spouse and I both got out at 8 (dual military, both service academy graduates). The majority of our former peers that we know that are staying in until retirement are…very average. Many of them were open about staying in until retirement simply to get retirement pay. Nice people, but very average in intellect, skill, and ambition. This label is true for both the ROTC graduates and the service academy graduates that we know; only OCS and prior service officers defy this trend in my experience. They definitely don’t have many options for stable pay and benefits at the level that they have in the military, although laughably more than a few have commented that they could have been “CEO level” if they had gotten out pre or post company command. Their wives are also to this day, even post GWOT era, the most into the “I am a military spouse! Thank me and my family! We serve too!” culture, way more than the enlisted wives that I knew. There are of course exceptions to every generalization. A small minority are exceptional.

To be fair, officers' wives are typically more educated (like attracts like), so they do sacrifice more than the high school grad who marries her first boyfriend right after he graduates from basic. For the latter, the military lifestyle is a step up. For the former, it's forfeiting what could have been.

That’s a really interesting point that I hadn’t considered.

Your observation actually makes a lot of sense and explains the persistent, perceived sense of entitlement that I saw from so many officers’ wives.

Although, lol, I think maybe some of the wives are as delusional about their forfeited potential as their “I could have been CEO of a Fortune 500 company” officer husbands who choose to stay in until retirement.

+1 DP here. From what I have seen, military wives have an elevated lifestyle, compared to what they would otherwise have (had they not married an officer). Burial in Arlington Cemetery, for one. She would have had that being a teacher?

Ah yes. So much bragging about their burial site. Are you people for real? What/when/where are you hanging out with these officers wives who are living an “elevated lifestyle”? I suspect none of you even know one and this is a throwback generalization to when they were expected to pour tea.