Would you let you 5 year old fly unaccompanied overseas?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No way.

My five year old can get scared of a lot of things on the way. Accidents can happen. And no one to comfort her for 10 hours on an international flight. No way.

I'm not even going to think about connections. What if there is a bad turbulence? Or she gets sick?

I'm not sure she would know how to operate the toilet door on a plane. Or open all the packaging of a food tray.

OP here: Here is what would happen in some of the situations you mentioned.

In flight:
Your child receives our Kids Solo service. Our staff provides continuous supervision and ensures his or her comfort and safety.
On intercontinental flights, your child enjoys games, films, cartoons, radio programs for children, and receives fun gifts to play with.
We provide a meal adapted to your child's tastes and needs on all flights over 2.5 hours. Starting at age 9, your child receives a regular meal, but can still choose the children's menu if desired. In this case, please remember to request the children's menu when booking the ticket, or at least 24 hours prior to the flight's departure.

Please educate your child, particularly if your child is an adolescent, that changing seats is not permitted during the flight. Please remind him or her to remain seated upon arrival, until accompanied by an Air France guardian.

Please note: if your child is traveling on the same flight as you but in a different cabin, he or she must remain under his or her Air France guardian's supervision until arrival.

Connections:
With the Kids Solo service, our staff provides continuous supervision to your child during connecting flights. This also applies if you are making the same trip but in a different cabin.
For connecting flights of more than 2 hours*, your child is welcomed in the Air France connecting area reserved for children traveling alone at Paris-Orly and Paris-Charles de Gaulle airports.

These lounges are specially equipped to offer activities for everyone: rest, reading, cartoons, board games and foosball (table soccer). Lounges also offer Sony PlayStation 3 and/or PlayStation Vita video game consoles.

In case of flight connections and cancellations: Your child receives priority care and attention from Air France staff in the event of a flight delay or cancellation. An Air France staff member remains present with your child at all times, even if lodging is necessary.
We immediately inform the individuals listed on the UM handling form of any measures taken for your child at any point in the trip.

So again, you would be okay with your 5 year old staying overnight in a hotel room with a complete stranger?

OP here: If that is what ends us happening, then I would have to be ok with it, because I would have weighed the risk of that possibility and still opted to have him get on the plane.

Nice dodge, OP. Are you ok with that risk? It's a yes or no question. If the answer is no, then you don't send him alone on the flight. Simple. If the answer is yes, you would be ok with it, then I'm not really sure why you're asking a public message board if you should do this, because you're clearly not going to find many parents who agree with you, American or not.

I mean, honestly, OP. Maybe this is the norm in other countries (I find this to be a dubious assertion), but you asked on a DC message board that is going to be populated by... wait for it... AMERICANS, so we're going to give you our perspective based on that. IF you want to do something different, no one here can stop you, but don't get pissy because we're not going to validate your choices.

And yes, there are 5 year olds who are "independent" enough in other parts of the world to work in sweat shops, or take care of their younger siblings all day because their parents are working or walking miles to get water... call me a helicopter parent, but I don't see this as a good thing. So let's stop with the "oh you overprotective Americans!" nonsense and admit that this is a batshit crazy idea no matter how you look at it.

No - it's absolutely not crazy. The reason that you think it's crazy is because dependence is the norm for American children, and your child is absolutely helpless because of your helicoptering.

Yes, the circumstances that sometimes require the independence in these children abroad can be tragic. However, the actual independence itself is a very good thing.

I was one of those very indepent 5 year olds; and I walked for miles on my own to explore. Many times with my even younger cousin. And no, we were not poor. To the contrary, I had a nanny and a housekeeper. I cherish all the good memories I have growing up.

Likewise, my grandmother was a latchkey child, Polish and Italian immigrant background in New York. She took over cooking chores by the time she was 5 years old. Her sisters would tell me stories about how she would stand on a stool to cook dinner for the family.

My godchild is a 7 year old girl growing up in Montreal. Mother is Swiss and the fater is Canadian. I spent a few afternoons on my last visit, and she delighted in showing me all around her neigborhood. She knew exactly how to get to school from home, how to get to the playground, how to get to the YMCA where she took swimming lessons, and how to get to both of her parents' work.. It's tragic that American children are incapable of such feats.

[Anonymous]

My godchild is a 7 year old girl growing up in Montreal. Mother is Swiss and the fater is Canadian. I spent a few afternoons on my last visit, and she delighted in showing me all around her neigborhood. She knew exactly how to get to school from home, how to get to the playground, how to get to the YMCA where she took swimming lessons, and how to get to both of her parents' work.. It's tragic that American children are incapable of such feats.

There is a big difference between being able to find those things and being loose alone to do it.

My kids knew the way at that age, too. They could give directions to another adult. That doesn't mean they drove it themselves!

[Anonymous]

FWIW, plenty of American kids grew up spending days out playing alone. Some of the stories my mom told me were shocking--playing in abandoned mines, walking across railroad trestles, etc. That doesn't mean she was safe.

She also told me about a man asking her directions when she was twelve. He asked her to get in his car--she knew better.

I suspect there used to be a lot more kids that disappeared, etc, back in the day before television and the internet.

[Anonymous]

I used to travel unaccompanied every summer when I was a small child. One of my grandparents would come get me in the layover city. I started doing layovers at age 8. I would not let a 5 year old do a layover but I would let him do a direct flight. For a direct flight the parent can come to the gate (but check if that's still true) and make sure he boards the plane. At arrival the child stays in the seat until all of the passengers have unloaded. Usually I was brought into first class or an empty seat near the flight attendants right before descent. A flight attendant will help the child retrieve their luggage and meet their relative.

For a layover flight the child has to be handed off to a new crew member. I remember once I was told to sit down by the gate and then they forgot about me. I had to find someone to take me to my next flight. I would not trust a five year old to advocate for himself like that.

[Anonymous]

I think it is ridiculous to ask a flight attendant to be your kid's babysitter for 16hrs

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No way.

My five year old can get scared of a lot of things on the way. Accidents can happen. And no one to comfort her for 10 hours on an international flight. No way.

I'm not even going to think about connections. What if there is a bad turbulence? Or she gets sick?

I'm not sure she would know how to operate the toilet door on a plane. Or open all the packaging of a food tray.

OP here: Here is what would happen in some of the situations you mentioned.

In flight:
Your child receives our Kids Solo service. Our staff provides continuous supervision and ensures his or her comfort and safety.
On intercontinental flights, your child enjoys games, films, cartoons, radio programs for children, and receives fun gifts to play with.
We provide a meal adapted to your child's tastes and needs on all flights over 2.5 hours. Starting at age 9, your child receives a regular meal, but can still choose the children's menu if desired. In this case, please remember to request the children's menu when booking the ticket, or at least 24 hours prior to the flight's departure.

Please educate your child, particularly if your child is an adolescent, that changing seats is not permitted during the flight. Please remind him or her to remain seated upon arrival, until accompanied by an Air France guardian.

Please note: if your child is traveling on the same flight as you but in a different cabin, he or she must remain under his or her Air France guardian's supervision until arrival.

Connections:
With the Kids Solo service, our staff provides continuous supervision to your child during connecting flights. This also applies if you are making the same trip but in a different cabin.
For connecting flights of more than 2 hours*, your child is welcomed in the Air France connecting area reserved for children traveling alone at Paris-Orly and Paris-Charles de Gaulle airports.

These lounges are specially equipped to offer activities for everyone: rest, reading, cartoons, board games and foosball (table soccer). Lounges also offer Sony PlayStation 3 and/or PlayStation Vita video game consoles.

In case of flight connections and cancellations: Your child receives priority care and attention from Air France staff in the event of a flight delay or cancellation. An Air France staff member remains present with your child at all times, even if lodging is necessary.
We immediately inform the individuals listed on the UM handling form of any measures taken for your child at any point in the trip.

So again, you would be okay with your 5 year old staying overnight in a hotel room with a complete stranger?

OP here: If that is what ends us happening, then I would have to be ok with it, because I would have weighed the risk of that possibility and still opted to have him get on the plane.

Nice dodge, OP. Are you ok with that risk? It's a yes or no question. If the answer is no, then you don't send him alone on the flight. Simple. If the answer is yes, you would be ok with it, then I'm not really sure why you're asking a public message board if you should do this, because you're clearly not going to find many parents who agree with you, American or not.

I mean, honestly, OP. Maybe this is the norm in other countries (I find this to be a dubious assertion), but you asked on a DC message board that is going to be populated by... wait for it... AMERICANS, so we're going to give you our perspective based on that. IF you want to do something different, no one here can stop you, but don't get pissy because we're not going to validate your choices.

And yes, there are 5 year olds who are "independent" enough in other parts of the world to work in sweat shops, or take care of their younger siblings all day because their parents are working or walking miles to get water... call me a helicopter parent, but I don't see this as a good thing. So let's stop with the "oh you overprotective Americans!" nonsense and admit that this is a batshit crazy idea no matter how you look at it.

No - it's absolutely not crazy. The reason that you think it's crazy is because dependence is the norm for American children, and your child is absolutely helpless because of your helicoptering.

Yes, the circumstances that sometimes require the independence in these children abroad can be tragic. However, the actual independence itself is a very good thing.

I was one of those very indepent 5 year olds; and I walked for miles on my own to explore. Many times with my even younger cousin. And no, we were not poor. To the contrary, I had a nanny and a housekeeper. I cherish all the good memories I have growing up.

Likewise, my grandmother was a latchkey child, Polish and Italian immigrant background in New York. She took over cooking chores by the time she was 5 years old. Her sisters would tell me stories about how she would stand on a stool to cook dinner for the family.

My godchild is a 7 year old girl growing up in Montreal. Mother is Swiss and the fater is Canadian. I spent a few afternoons on my last visit, and she delighted in showing me all around her neigborhood. She knew exactly how to get to school from home, how to get to the playground, how to get to the YMCA where she took swimming lessons, and how to get to both of her parents' work.. It's tragic that American children are incapable of such feats.

Most of us responding to this thread grew up in an era where kids had a lot more independence - while I agree it's troubling in some ways that kids don't get a chance to exercise their independence, it's not necessarily a good idea. I definitely got into some bad situations as a kid - including dealing with a flasher, someone trying to lure me into their car, getting hit on the head by an older kid, getting lost in the neighborhood and stuck outside in a thunderstorm-- so I don't want my kids to have that level of freedom. Also - like it or not, OP's kid is growing up in this country and will have the maturity level and independence of his peers - not of a kid working in a manufacturing plant in Bangladesh. So while theoretically a 5 year old may be able to handle it - I doubt a 5 year old who has grown up in this culture would be able to.

[Anonymous]

It's one thing to put your child in the care of other people when you are in the same city--or even state. To put your child in the care of another--a stranger, no less-when he is on another continent-or two other continents--is a totally different story.

Sure you can do it. Everything will probably be fine. Just hope he doesn't get sick or have a careless caretaker.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For all of those saying "yes" -- I wonder: would you leave your 5 yr. old at home by him/herself for the same amount of time?

Look, I'm in the "no" camp, but I think this analogy is silly.

A kid alone could get hurt and there would be no one there to help.

A kid on a plane is not alone.

OK,... would you leave your 5 yr. old in a mall by him/herself??? there would be other people around to help!

OP here: You really are missing the point. They would be a chaperon (flight attendant) assigned to your child at all time. That would not happen at the mall since there is NO ONE to assign your child to who is responsible for him/her for the duration of the time.

It depends of how mature your kid is, but he is very young, he would get tired and would be with a completely stranger that maybe not well trained in how to deal with a hungry/tired/scared/overstimulated kid. It won't be my first choice.

Can't you find somebody flying there, maybe with help from your embassy/consulate

[Anonymous]

I'm thinking that OP is relatively young (well, at least younger than 30) and that might explain some things...

When it comes to flying there are flights and there are flights: a 2 hour domestic flight definitely not the same as a almost day long flight that arrives in a different country (actually, in two different ones) where people speak a different language and you need to go though immigration/customs. That pretty much as bad as it gets imho.

And yes, I also was thinking about "Home alone" when I was reading OP's responses.
Also loved the story from a PP about her childhood flights from Italy and going with "her" Italian flight attendant to visit relatives at a layover - that sure would make for an entertaining Italian comedy - and Monica Belucci can play a flight attendant Thanks for sharing, PP.

[Anonymous]

I will admit that I did not read all 15 pages of this thread, so my apologies if I am redundant. I have a 7 yr old and a 5 yr old, and am amazed at what a huge difference that two years of maturity makes. Honestly, I come across a ton of 5 yr olds and I don't think I have met a single one who I would feel comfortable sending on a trip like this. At 7, and with no connecting flights, I would send my kid on a trip alone. But not at 5, not on a trip overseas with a connection.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I will admit that I did not read all 15 pages of this thread

It is actually a very entertaining read, I recommend it
Loved the Italian flight attendant story
And OP is an enigma wrapped in a mystery.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will admit that I did not read all 15 pages of this thread

It is actually a very entertaining read, I recommend it
Loved the Italian flight attendant story
And OP is an enigma wrapped in a mystery.

What page is the Italian flight attendant story?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I will admit that I did not read all 15 pages of this thread

It is actually a very entertaining read, I recommend it
Loved the Italian flight attendant story
And OP is an enigma wrapped in a mystery.

What page is the Italian flight attendant story?

Page 7, 12:15 post ("veteran of UM lounge")

Also a story about a child who just "sat there" (the very last post on page 5) made me very sad for him.

[Anonymous]

I think what the OP doesn't realize is that $75 fee doesn't cover a babysitter for the entire 16 hours of transit. It covers her passing the kid to a flight attendant, them getting him on the plane into his seat. Them (maybe) checking on his a little more frequently than the other passengers. But not a dedicated person to make sure the kid is okay. Just someone to kind of, sort of make sure the kid is relatively safe.

I couldn't imagine being next to a five year old unaccompanied minor on a very long flight. My heart would break for that kid.

And what if the kid totally freaks out? They've have to land planes and de-board passengers for this.

Way too many potential issues.

It does seem like the OP has already convinced herself that we're just a bunch of crazy, overprotective Americans and the kid will be just fine. If that's the case, no amount of common sense will make a difference. That poor, poor kid.

[Anonymous]

I don't get those who are comparing this to what they did at 7 or 8. This child is five, and anyone who's had a child knows that there is a huge difference in maturity and decision-making ability between five and seven or eight. That is a difference of over 50% of the child's life. I'm a pretty free range parent, and I would consider putting a five-year old on a non-stop flight by themselves, if I had to. But a long international flight with a connection? No.