My FCPS High School has the lowest SAT scores -- how much should this influence decisions?

[Anonymous]

Ok, I've been looking at SAT scores and comparing overall scores and scores within racial groups. My HS's overall scores are the lowest of all FCPS. In addition, the scores for white kids are the lowest as well, even though there are other schools that have higher FARMs or lower percentages of white kids. Schools like Fairfax HS have similar FARMs and yet, the scores are significantly higher. Even scores for black kids are among the lowest for black kids as well (there are a few that have a lower ave. SAT). Same with Asian kids.

1. How much weight would you give to SAT statistics?

2. What could explain this --- is it possible that kids at this HS are not taking prep classes? Something else that does not reflect on the quality of teaching?

3. Should I not worry about it and just assume that by sending my kids to SAT prep classes they will get good scores (1800+)? Can I supplement my kids out of low scores?

4. When people say that certain high schools are good and others are bad, is there really a difference in the teaching or is it more about what the kids bring to the classroom? What are the "good" high schools doing that the "bad" high schools aren't? It doesn't seem like one can pin the blame strictly on Socio-economic/racial disparities if schools with greater FARMs have higher scores.

Thanks.

[Anonymous]

I think the answers depend somewhat on how close your kids are to going to that high school...are we talking next year or way way down the line (e.g., your kids are in elementary school)?

I went to a Ffx Co. HS with either the lowest or one of the lowest SAT scores. So it is hard for me to think it really matters too much on the individual level if you still have smart, achieving children. Even at my HS, there were many kids who went to Ivy League and other top schools. There were just a lot of kids from poor backgrounds as well, but I personally appreciated the socio-economic diversity.

I think this really depends on the kid and how active you are as a parent. If your children are generally strong performers academically, they may actually benefit from going to this high school instead of .. say ..a Langley. To a certain extent, the fact that they aren't competing against as many kids from the same school to get into UVA or something is probably a benefit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Ok, I've been looking at SAT scores and comparing overall scores and scores within racial groups. My HS's overall scores are the lowest of all FCPS. In addition, the scores for white kids are the lowest as well, even though there are other schools that have higher FARMs or lower percentages of white kids. Schools like Fairfax HS have similar FARMs and yet, the scores are significantly higher. Even scores for black kids are among the lowest for black kids as well (there are a few that have a lower ave. SAT). Same with Asian kids.

1. How much weight would you give to SAT statistics?

2. What could explain this --- is it possible that kids at this HS are not taking prep classes? Something else that does not reflect on the quality of teaching?

3. Should I not worry about it and just assume that by sending my kids to SAT prep classes they will get good scores (1800+)? Can I supplement my kids out of low scores?

4. When people say that certain high schools are good and others are bad, is there really a difference in the teaching or is it more about what the kids bring to the classroom? What are the "good" high schools doing that the "bad" high schools aren't? It doesn't seem like one can pin the blame strictly on Socio-economic/racial disparities if schools with greater FARMs have higher scores.

Thanks.

School culture matters more than SAT scores. That said, poor school cultures could lead to poor SAT scores. But it's hard to know how much differential there is here. A gap of 15 or 20 points may not be so alarming as a gap of 150 or 200.

[Anonymous]

I'm talking about this school being 75 pts lower than any other school (just comparing white kids' ave. score). Even the nearest high schools with similar housing/demographics are 75-100 pts higher (Edison/Lee). West Potomac is 150 pts higher and Stuart is 125 pts higher. Mt. Vernon and Annandale are 75 pts higher.

Everyone of those schools has a higher FARMs population.

What can you make of this? We're talkig about Hayfield here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm talking about this school being 75 pts lower than any other school (just comparing white kids' ave. score). Even the nearest high schools with similar housing/demographics are 75-100 pts higher (Edison/Lee). West Potomac is 150 pts higher and Stuart is 125 pts higher. Mt. Vernon and Annandale are 75 pts higher.

Everyone of those schools has a higher FARMs population.

What can you make of this? We're talkig about Hayfield here.

We are also slated for Hayfield, and I would love to understand this as well. Honestly, though, my oldest isn't even in K yet (next year) so I assume a lot could change by the time DC reaches 7th grade (which is where Hayfield starts as I'm sure you know). But, like you, I'd love to know how much weight I should give such test scores. Curious how old your children are?

[Anonymous]

Elementary school age. We have commuting reasons to consider other locations/schools in addition to the on-going question of whether the HS is going to meet our expectations. If we were to move (which is still an open question), we would want to do it in the next 2-3 years.

BUT, we do like the area generally and have been happy with the elementary school we use. We like that it is not so status conscious and not too hard to get around to the stores/restaurants/movies/etc. Certainly, it saves $$ to stay in our current home.

On the other hand, we want our kids to feel safe at school and be in an environment where learning is encouraged and admired (not something to be ashamed of). If we live in Ffx Cnty, we'd kind of like to get our share of "the best school system."

[Anonymous]

Laying all my baggage out in the open up front, I come from a perspective of having gone to a small rural high school where I was always a fish out of water, along with about 3 friends. The general atmosphere was anti-intellectual.

I think that a community of peers is really important for a teenager. If the school doesn't create a culture that supports academics, your child may have a hard time finding a comfortable place and your child may find a lot of classes to be geared too low (and thus boring, unrewarding, and not teaching much).

If Hayfield has good courses and supports the higher performers, then overall scores don't matter - so much does come from the home. But, if the scores reflect poor atmosphere or poor teaching, then I would plan to move.

How do you find that out? Talk to neighbors, go to PTA and strike up conversations, chat at the pool next summer. I'm not sure what else, but it seems like a key investment of time given your circumstances.

[Anonymous]

I think it probably means that they are encouraging all kids to take the SAT's, even kids who might not be considering college or who in the past would not have been taking them. (i.e. the poorer kids, the kids with more recent immigrant or ESL backgrounds.) Not just the best-prepared/most-motivated kids are taking them, so scores are bound to be lower.

We moved out of the Falls Church High School boundary in part because of the school's rep, but mostly because I wanted to be closer into DC. Before we moved, I did hear some good feedback from parents of current FCHS kids - they were very happy. (FC is way at the bottom of the fairfax SAT rankings.)

[Anonymous]

FYI - the overall scores for Hayfield in the most recent year were higher than the scores at Lee, Stuart, Falls Church and Mount Vernon. If you're looking at the scores for white students, that suggests you're looking at older data because FCPS hasn't released the disaggregated data for the Class of 2011 that breaks down the test scores by race/ethnicity for each high schoo. When it does, I wouldn't be surprised if the scores for white students at Hayfield have bounced back a bit.

I understand that some schools have larger numbers of high-performing, college-bound students than others, but I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a decent number of motivated students at any FCPS high school. The Kingstowne area that feeds into Hayfield and Edison generally is a pretty nice area that's an attractive place to live for those working in DC, Alexandria or Fort Belvoir.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:FYI - the overall scores for Hayfield in the most recent year were higher than the scores at Lee, Stuart, Falls Church and Mount Vernon. If you're looking at the scores for white students, that suggests you're looking at older data because FCPS hasn't released the disaggregated data for the Class of 2011 that breaks down the test scores by race/ethnicity for each high schoo. When it does, I wouldn't be surprised if the scores for white students at Hayfield have bounced back a bit.

I understand that some schools have larger numbers of high-performing, college-bound students than others, but I'd be very surprised if there wasn't a decent number of motivated students at any FCPS high school. The Kingstowne area that feeds into Hayfield and Edison generally is a pretty nice area that's an attractive place to live for those working in DC, Alexandria or Fort Belvoir.

Yes, the only break down by race is for the prior three years. So, these are 2009-2010 numbers I'm referring to. Only the overall SAT average scores are available for 2010-2011 (but the breakdown should be out later this month). I noticed that the Hayfield white students' scores for the last three years show a downward trend, although the school's overall scores are relatively stable. I don't think looking at stats one year back is really "older" scores. It's just the last scores available.

Anyone else have insight on what the culture is like at Hayfield?