NYT article

[Anonymous]

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/14/world/asia/squeezed-out-in-india-students-turn-to-united-states.html

I find this to be an interesting article and wonder if this will be the new trend in higher education, especially in light of the lower US test scores and achievements when compared with many other developed/industrialized countries.

Thoughts?

[Anonymous]

Thank you for sharing this, although the information in this article doesn't really reflect a new trend. Many countries send students to American universities because requirements for university admission are so stringent and even problematic, or else their universities don't provide the education that parents want for their children.

Many American students continue to be very bright; that hasn't changed. Many students from other countries are also very bright; again, no change.

As an educator, I agree with many other educators who think there are some problems with our current pre-university curricula. I'm optimistic that these problems can be fixed. That said, I'm very impressed with the many very bright students who sit in my university classrooms today. They're the reason why I feel so optimistic.

[Anonymous]

Ivy League colleges have had a substantial representation of foreign students in both undergraduate and graduate student bodies for a few decades. While weighted towards elites from most countries at the undergrad level, the story of aid, financed from massive private college endowments is also not new. NYT is uncessarily sensationalizing the story, and thus the backlash from right-wingers on the NYT discussion board, most of whom almost certainly did not attend an Ivy or anything comparable.

Also, if you were to look at the numbers of Indians, Chinese, etc. who have stayed on in the US after degrees from US elite institutions you would find leaders in fields ranging from engineering, technology, banking/financing, foreign affairs etc. Think Fareed Zakaria, Vinod Kholsa etc.

[Anonymous]

It's been going on for years but the numbers of international students in undergraduate programs are increasing, as the article noted. What is disturbing and what the Times article did not emphasize is that foreign applicants are NOT need-blind.

I am not sure the comments are from right wingers, 12:09! There's a robust debate around this, not sure how you can suss out whether a comment is right wing or not!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thank you for sharing this, although the information in this article doesn't really reflect a new trend. Many countries send students to American universities because requirements for university admission are so stringent and even problematic, or else their universities don't provide the education that parents want for their children.

Many American students continue to be very bright; that hasn't changed. Many students from other countries are also very bright; again, no change.

As an educator, I agree with many other educators who think there are some problems with our current pre-university curricula. I'm optimistic that these problems can be fixed. That said, I'm very impressed with the many very bright students who sit in my university classrooms today. They're the reason why I feel so optimistic.

for example?

There was a radio clip about college students spending way too much time in lecture classes - http://americanradioworks.publicradio.org/www_publicradio/tools/media_player/popup.php?name=americanradioworks/2011/lecturefull

While our high school curricula may not be perfect, we do focus on critical thinking, which is often overlooked in the freshmen and sophomore level classes at the university level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's been going on for years but the numbers of international students in undergraduate programs are increasing, as the article noted. What is disturbing and what the Times article did not emphasize is that foreign applicants are NOT need-blind.

I am not sure the comments are from right wingers, 12:09! There's a robust debate around this, not sure how you can suss out whether a comment is right wing or not!

Actually...

There are currently six U.S. higher learning institutions—five universities and one liberal arts college—which are both need-blind and full-need for all applicants, including international students.These are H Y P D in the Ivies, and the full list:

Amherst College
Dartmouth College
Harvard University
MIT
Princeton University
Yale University

Admissions at the remaining Ivies varies from not needs blind of internationals to needs-blind admissions but not a full needs met standard in a financial aid package. Also generally Canadians and/or Mexicans are treated as the same standard as US applicants.

[Anonymous]

Thanks. Source?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Thank you for sharing this, although the information in this article doesn't really reflect a new trend. Many countries send students to American universities because requirements for university admission are so stringent and even problematic, or else their universities don't provide the education that parents want for their children.

Many American students continue to be very bright; that hasn't changed. Many students from other countries are also very bright; again, no change.

As an educator, I agree with many other educators who think there are some problems with our current pre-university curricula. I'm optimistic that these problems can be fixed. That said, I'm very impressed with the many very bright students who sit in my university classrooms today. They're the reason why I feel so optimistic.

for example?

There was a radio clip about college students spending way too much time in lecture classes - http://americanradioworks.publicradio.org/www_publicradio/tools/media_player/popup.php?name=americanradioworks/2011/lecturefull

While our high school curricula may not be perfect, we do focus on critical thinking, which is often overlooked in the freshmen and sophomore level classes at the university level.

I apologize, there are certainly many K-12 schools that do a fantastic job teaching their students. There's absolutely no doubt about that! I'm sure your school is one of them. It's no secret that many don't, and teach to the test. Once they enter university, we scramble to teach critical thinking skills that many have not learned. At the university level, it's late to be introducing this type of thinking. Ideally, students should be learning critical thinking skills well before high school - really, they should be learning these skills in the first years of school. This opinion comes from years of experience on both sides of the university divide. I teach university students now, but started out with an elementary education degree and spent years in elementary and middle schools.