Do you make $400,000 a year but feel broke?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think HHI 400k for a family of 4 should feel broke no matter what high COL area they live in, but I really don't think it's that much money, and can easily be spent if not careful. Our HHI is around 300k and we can max out our retirement and college savings and still go on 2 vacations/year and eat out once in awhile. We drive our 10+ year old Hondas to the ground and are careful with what we buy. With daycare, student loans, mortgage on a modest house, insurances, daily living expenses, it all quickly goes. Our luxuries are we get to spend 10k on traveling, eat out 1-2x a week, max out 401ks, and contribute 24k/yr to 529s, but that's really it.

the bolded part really says it all.

I wanted to respond similarly, but I just can't type that well with my head exploding.

I still don't think it's as much as people make it out to be. To me, it's higher end of middle class because saving for 529 and retirement really shouldn't be counted as luxuries. We save on a modest house, cheap clothes, old but functional cars to travel and eat out a bit more. I'm not sure why you people think that's so much. What are your expectations for a middle class family?

A middle class family contributes only a token amount to college savings, and relies heavily on aid/loans/work study. A middle class family plans to work until the parents are 70.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Private school is a luxury. Not a need. You are off your rocker.

This is a different debate. Again, I understand that most support a system that only allows the very wealthy to attend private school, sprinkled with some lower SES students for diversity purposes, but I don't agree with perpetuating that classist system.

Why don't you just work to make the public schools better, instead of trying to work out a system to give everyone aid to attend private or parochial or charter or whatever?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think HHI 400k for a family of 4 should feel broke no matter what high COL area they live in, but I really don't think it's that much money, and can easily be spent if not careful. Our HHI is around 300k and we can max out our retirement and college savings and still go on 2 vacations/year and eat out once in awhile. We drive our 10+ year old Hondas to the ground and are careful with what we buy. With daycare, student loans, mortgage on a modest house, insurances, daily living expenses, it all quickly goes. Our luxuries are we get to spend 10k on traveling, eat out 1-2x a week, max out 401ks, and contribute 24k/yr to 529s, but that's really it.

the bolded part really says it all.

I wanted to respond similarly, but I just can't type that well with my head exploding.

I still don't think it's as much as people make it out to be. To me, it's higher end of middle class because saving for 529 and retirement really shouldn't be counted as luxuries. We save on a modest house, cheap clothes, old but functional cars to travel and eat out a bit more. I'm not sure why you people think that's so much. What are your expectations for a middle class family?

But they are luxuries, especially when you are saving to the tune of 100k per year. You make 8X as much as the national median income. EIGHT! And don't use the DC area as an excuse, it was only 64k during the last census. You are the biggest dolt I've ran into on DCUM, and that is saying something.

You should just come out and say, I care more about saving 100k a year than I do about sending my kids to private school. There is nothing wrong with that decision, unless of course you whine that 400k is middle class and that you deserve a private school subsidy.

I agree they are luxuries that the majority are unable to afford.

I think it is interesting that your head is exploding when they are describing a middle class lifestyle. What your grandparents took for granted in the 1950s.

That's exactly the point - the middle class' financial situation has greatly deteriorated in the past 60 or 7o years. Did you miss the memo about stagnating wages and needing two parents to work to support a family, versus one full time working parent back then?

[Anonymous]

I dunno - call me crazy, but I don't think someone earning $400k per year can complain about stagnating wages. That person is benefitting from the lack of inflation.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You think Harvard is giving financial aid to families that make $400k/year? And that families who make $2m/year pay more? Okie dokie.

Up to $180K.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't think HHI 400k for a family of 4 should feel broke no matter what high COL area they live in, but I really don't think it's that much money, and can easily be spent if not careful. Our HHI is around 300k and we can max out our retirement and college savings and still go on 2 vacations/year and eat out once in awhile. We drive our 10+ year old Hondas to the ground and are careful with what we buy. With daycare, student loans, mortgage on a modest house, insurances, daily living expenses, it all quickly goes. Our luxuries are we get to spend 10k on traveling, eat out 1-2x a week, max out 401ks, and contribute 24k/yr to 529s, but that's really it.

the bolded part really says it all.

I wanted to respond similarly, but I just can't type that well with my head exploding.

I still don't think it's as much as people make it out to be. To me, it's higher end of middle class because saving for 529 and retirement really shouldn't be counted as luxuries. We save on a modest house, cheap clothes, old but functional cars to travel and eat out a bit more. I'm not sure why you people think that's so much. What are your expectations for a middle class family?

But they are luxuries, especially when you are saving to the tune of 100k per year. You make 8X as much as the national median income. EIGHT! And don't use the DC area as an excuse, it was only 64k during the last census. You are the biggest dolt I've ran into on DCUM, and that is saying something.

You should just come out and say, I care more about saving 100k a year than I do about sending my kids to private school. There is nothing wrong with that decision, unless of course you whine that 400k is middle class and that you deserve a private school subsidy.

I agree they are luxuries that the majority are unable to afford.

I think it is interesting that your head is exploding when they are describing a middle class lifestyle. What your grandparents took for granted in the 1950s.

That's exactly the point - the middle class' financial situation has greatly deteriorated in the past 60 or 7o years. Did you miss the memo about stagnating wages and needing two parents to work to support a family, versus one full time working parent back then?

the lifestyle the poster describes (making 400k) is sooooo much more than my grandparents had.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm saying they should select the situation they can afford. The Sister Wives kids can go to public school if they can't afford private, and so should the $400k family.

Again, your position is that private school should per se exclude certain people based solely on financial criteria. That's a perfectly acceptable position to take, but I don't see why it's so difficult for people to entertain an opposing framework.

Just because you don't want to pay what someone charges you doesn't mean they are excluding you if they don't lower their price.

+1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:An annual household income of $400,000 would put this hypothetical financial aid-receiving family of four in the top 3 percent of household income in the D.C. area.

But aid for the top 3 percent does seem like a reasonable proposition when the only alternative is to force them to save less than $100,000 a year.

ROFLMAO

You can't possibly be serious.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:You think Harvard is giving financial aid to families that make $400k/year? And that families who make $2m/year pay more? Okie dokie.

Up to $180K.

Last time I checked, $400k was more than double $180k. I can see a scenario where a family with a HHI of $180k gets a little financial aid at a private school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Private school is a luxury. Not a need. You are off your rocker.

This is a different debate. Again, I understand that most support a system that only allows the very wealthy to attend private school, sprinkled with some lower SES students for diversity purposes, but I don't agree with perpetuating that classist system.

Why don't you just work to make the public schools better, instead of trying to work out a system to give everyone aid to attend private or parochial or charter or whatever?

Why not do both?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If they choose to send four children to expensive private schools and thus can't save any money, that's up to them

Agreed, but that applies as well to someone at a lower income level. If someone makes $50k and has four kids, should they be denied financial aid because they chose to have four kids instead of one? If they chose not to study hard and that's why they make $50k now (or they want a 40 hour a week job instead of one that requires 60 hours), should they be denied financial aid?

No school takes the position that families on financial aid should be asked to spend every available dollar of disposable income on tuition to the extent of not saving a penny for retirement, so I'm not sure why that would change just because a family has a higher HHI.

Either financial aid should aim to give every family a chance to rationally afford it, or it shouldn't. If it should, then there's clearly some very outlying and rare circumstances where a $400k HHI would need some level of aid.

In any event, I have to go back to generating my $400k now...

[Anonymous]

hilarious trolljob by the poster advocating for govt assistance for people who earn 400k and can "only" save around 100k per year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they choose to send four children to expensive private schools and thus can't save any money, that's up to them

Agreed, but that applies as well to someone at a lower income level. If someone makes $50k and has four kids, should they be denied financial aid because they chose to have four kids instead of one? If they chose not to study hard and that's why they make $50k now (or they want a 40 hour a week job instead of one that requires 60 hours), should they be denied financial aid?

No school takes the position that families on financial aid should be asked to spend every available dollar of disposable income on tuition to the extent of not saving a penny for retirement, so I'm not sure why that would change just because a family has a higher HHI.

Either financial aid should aim to give every family a chance to rationally afford it, or it shouldn't. If it should, then there's clearly some very outlying and rare circumstances where a $400k HHI would need some level of aid.

In any event, I have to go back to generating my $400k now...

You think people are lower income because they chose not to study hard? Nice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:hilarious trolljob by the poster advocating for govt assistance for people who earn 400k and can "only" save around 100k per year.

The sad part is, I don't think it is a troll. I think someone genuinely thinks this. SMH.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If they choose to send four children to expensive private schools and thus can't save any money, that's up to them

Agreed, but that applies as well to someone at a lower income level. If someone makes $50k and has four kids, should they be denied financial aid because they chose to have four kids instead of one? If they chose not to study hard and that's why they make $50k now (or they want a 40 hour a week job instead of one that requires 60 hours), should they be denied financial aid?

No school takes the position that families on financial aid should be asked to spend every available dollar of disposable income on tuition to the extent of not saving a penny for retirement, so I'm not sure why that would change just because a family has a higher HHI.

Either financial aid should aim to give every family a chance to rationally afford it, or it shouldn't. If it should, then there's clearly some very outlying and rare circumstances where a $400k HHI would need some level of aid.

In any event, I have to go back to generating my $400k now...

The phrase "rationally afford" is doing a whole lot of work here...