Initial boundary options for Woodward study area are up

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought MCPS does fund students differentially according to need. Is that not accurate?

They do, but the formula is not very transparent. The weighted student funding formula provided for the State does include provisions for ESOL, Special Ed, and Economic Disadvantage.

You only need to look at the effect. Are opportunities available to one student in a district with reasonable equivalence to those available to another student in another part of the district. No? Then the district has failed on equal protections grounds.

It doesn't have to be exactly the same (one school might offer access to Japanese while another offers similar access to Arabic) or have to provide for exactly the same outcomes, though measurement of the latter can inform administrators in their management approach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I find it maddening that MCPS allows (or promotes) two disparate elements that cannot be simultaneously true:

1. The first is the claim that equal opportunities are available to every student regardless of home school. This obviously fails when the benefits of parent engagement are included. I grew up in East County, and went to Paint Branch. I now have kids in the W schools. These might as well be on a different planet.

2. Teachers are allowed significant latitude as to where they teach once they obtain tenure. I was involved on a volunteer basis for years at a school with a significant FARMS %. 2 years in and the teachers would run to either a W school or leave the county.

There is no easy answer to the 2nd issue. Teachers are human and teaching is difficult under optimal circumstances. When you are dealing with the attendant problems of poverty, it is beyond difficult. But if you're going to let them move (or not incentivize them to stay), they are never going to get better and we'll be having this discussion forever.

At least in DCPS teachers get a pay bump for teaching at a Title I school. Is it different in Moco? It might not be enough of a bump at any rate.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I thought MCPS does fund students differentially according to need. Is that not accurate?

No, individual students generally don’t get specific funding except sn. It goes into one big pot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I find it maddening that MCPS allows (or promotes) two disparate elements that cannot be simultaneously true:

1. The first is the claim that equal opportunities are available to every student regardless of home school. This obviously fails when the benefits of parent engagement are included. I grew up in East County, and went to Paint Branch. I now have kids in the W schools. These might as well be on a different planet.

2. Teachers are allowed significant latitude as to where they teach once they obtain tenure. I was involved on a volunteer basis for years at a school with a significant FARMS %. 2 years in and the teachers would run to either a W school or leave the county.

There is no easy answer to the 2nd issue. Teachers are human and teaching is difficult under optimal circumstances. When you are dealing with the attendant problems of poverty, it is beyond difficult. But if you're going to let them move (or not incentivize them to stay), they are never going to get better and we'll be having this discussion forever.

At least in DCPS teachers get a pay bump for teaching at a Title I school. Is it different in Moco? It might not be enough of a bump at any rate.

They get nothing extra.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought MCPS does fund students differentially according to need. Is that not accurate?

They do, but the formula is not very transparent. The weighted student funding formula provided for the State does include provisions for ESOL, Special Ed, and Economic Disadvantage.

You only need to look at the effect. Are opportunities available to one student in a district with reasonable equivalence to those available to another student in another part of the district. No? Then the district has failed on equal protections grounds.

It doesn't have to be exactly the same (one school might offer access to Japanese while another offers similar access to Arabic) or have to provide for exactly the same outcomes, though measurement of the latter can inform administrators in their management approach.

This. Our schools don’t have the same high level classes. We don’t have any science ap, math after calc, and most honors classes are honors for all and watered down. Not to mention lack of arts, forgiven language and other classes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Rosemary Hills illustrates the naive cruelty of option 3. Rosemary Hills already goes to a “good” school in BCC, but option 3 sends them 10 minutes further to Whitman. To what end?

If the answer is “to raise the FARMS rate at Whitman,” that’s sort of missing the forrest for the trees.

They should necessarily raise farms and remove it from other schools as those schools loose extra funding.

They should do this by punishing the very kids this should purportedly help?

They aren’t helping kids by bussing them across town. Instead strengthen their schools. Give our kids the same opportunities as yours.

Yes, those specific kids already go to BCC and get the desired same opportunities. Why send them 10 minutes farther? Who is that helping?

And the rest of the student population? If DCUM is leaning heavily into "no bussing" and "it's unjust to subject higher-poverty populations to long bus rides" then DCUM needs to get behind making enormously differential funding per stident available so that those same opportunities are offered to all. Only 3 at Northwood interested in AP Econ? A teacher for that would need to be funded if one is funded for the 25 interested at WJ -- as we know, virtual and MC don't provide a similar enough experience.

And that might mean even higher class sizes at Whitman.

And/or higher taxes.

Or the populations can be evened out, but that generally means...bussing.

Pick your poison.

The strategy is to reject all efforts to increase equity.

"We can't do bussing, it's not MCPS's problem to address housing segregation"

"A multifamily building does not fit in with the character of my neighborhood! This is a developer giveaway by the corrupt County Council"

and finally

"We pay the most in taxes, and we reject a tax increase for schools in lower income areas, not my problem, the real problem is the parents, they are terrible parents and that's why they have all those problems and we can't fix them"

and then everything stays the same/gets worse

Mcps is one of the highest funded school systems. They have a spending an accountability issue. They spend millions on useless studies and attorneys.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maximizing walkers is the low hanging fruit. It doesn't cost extra money, it's (usually) popular with the neighboring areas, and it's good for sustainability. Obviously some schools' walk zones will need to be larger or smaller than others, based on the building capacity, nearby highways or other barriers considered hazardous, etc. But I would really like to see them come up with new options with this as a foundational goal, and show their work.

Increasing walking zones won’t help lower the absentee rate. Kids already skip school when it is actually raining or when it’s predicted to rain on their walk home.

+1
Also, how many kids at the 1.9.mile mark actually walk to school, especially inexpensive areas? I'd wager most carpool.

Carpooling only works if parents or other kids can drive them. I know many who walk that far. Or, bike or scooter.

What issue are you raising wrt the boundary studies?

Read the previous post. Hs kids only get a bus if it’s past two miles. Some of the walks are dangerous. We don’t have sidewalks and busy streets.

That's not a hard and fast rule. Some closer neighborhoods get bus service if the kids would have to cross a highway for example.

No, our kids pass conn, Georgia and university. We have no sidewalks on most streets. No bus.

It depends. Students that would have to cross the beltway or 270 often will get a bus.

That’s because they literally cannot cross it. But, they don’t for other unsafe situations.

Wrong. You can pass 270 via walking on old Georgetown road or Rockledge, for example. People under 2 miles get a bus to WJ from the other side. I’m 1.2 miles and get a bus.

Again, then you are showing the inequity. Our kids have to cross dangerous roads and have been hit by cars and it’s a minimum of two miles. We are at the two mile mark exactly and no bus near us.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought MCPS does fund students differentially according to need. Is that not accurate?

No, individual students generally don’t get specific funding except sn. It goes into one big pot.

But schools get more dollars per pupil if they have a higher percentage of higher-needs kids.

[Anonymous]

I would love to learn more about how Title 1 funding is allocated. Personally would love to see more of those funds helping high poverty schools directly, rather than indirectly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought MCPS does fund students differentially according to need. Is that not accurate?

No, individual students generally don’t get specific funding except sn. It goes into one big pot.

But schools get more dollars per pupil if they have a higher percentage of higher-needs kids.

They get extra money for low income if they have the designation but busing kids out means they lose status and those funds are used to support the struggling students which there are more of.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought MCPS does fund students differentially according to need. Is that not accurate?

No, individual students generally don’t get specific funding except sn. It goes into one big pot.

But schools get more dollars per pupil if they have a higher percentage of higher-needs kids.

They get extra money for low income if they have the designation but busing kids out means they lose status and those funds are used to support the struggling students which there are more of.

Whether some schools get more $/student is not the issue. Whether it is enough to provide reasonably similar educational experiences across schools is the issue. Evident from the desire of some to stick with "good" schools and the desire of others to escape "bad" schools is that it is, at present, not enough.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I thought MCPS does fund students differentially according to need. Is that not accurate?

No, individual students generally don’t get specific funding except sn. It goes into one big pot.

But schools get more dollars per pupil if they have a higher percentage of higher-needs kids.

They get extra money for low income if they have the designation but busing kids out means they lose status and those funds are used to support the struggling students which there are more of.

I think but may be wrong that Title I means FARMS over 50%, and then MCPS still does a per pupil funding with greater amounts for students with higher needs even if the school is not Title I.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Rosemary Hills illustrates the naive cruelty of option 3. Rosemary Hills already goes to a “good” school in BCC, but option 3 sends them 10 minutes further to Whitman. To what end?

If the answer is “to raise the FARMS rate at Whitman,” that’s sort of missing the forrest for the trees.

They should necessarily raise farms and remove it from other schools as those schools loose extra funding.

They should do this by punishing the very kids this should purportedly help?

They aren’t helping kids by bussing them across town. Instead strengthen their schools. Give our kids the same opportunities as yours.

Yes, those specific kids already go to BCC and get the desired same opportunities. Why send them 10 minutes farther? Who is that helping?

And the rest of the student population? If DCUM is leaning heavily into "no bussing" and "it's unjust to subject higher-poverty populations to long bus rides" then DCUM needs to get behind making enormously differential funding per stident available so that those same opportunities are offered to all. Only 3 at Northwood interested in AP Econ? A teacher for that would need to be funded if one is funded for the 25 interested at WJ -- as we know, virtual and MC don't provide a similar enough experience.

And that might mean even higher class sizes at Whitman.

And/or higher taxes.

Or the populations can be evened out, but that generally means...bussing.

Pick your poison.

The strategy is to reject all efforts to increase equity.

"We can't do bussing, it's not MCPS's problem to address housing segregation"

"A multifamily building does not fit in with the character of my neighborhood! This is a developer giveaway by the corrupt County Council"

and finally

"We pay the most in taxes, and we reject a tax increase for schools in lower income areas, not my problem, the real problem is the parents, they are terrible parents and that's why they have all those problems and we can't fix them"

and then everything stays the same/gets worse

Mcps is one of the highest funded school systems. They have a spending an accountability issue. They spend millions on useless studies and attorneys.

It may be the case that MCPS wastes $. Many large enterprises are inefficient, and organizations of all sorts can be prone to graft. That's not even counting differential financial burden that might be taken on in the pursuit of certain policies.

If we cut the budget instead of increase it, though, MCPS would have to cut proportionately more from currently better schools to provide the necessary reasonable equivalence of education services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Maximizing walkers is the low hanging fruit. It doesn't cost extra money, it's (usually) popular with the neighboring areas, and it's good for sustainability. Obviously some schools' walk zones will need to be larger or smaller than others, based on the building capacity, nearby highways or other barriers considered hazardous, etc. But I would really like to see them come up with new options with this as a foundational goal, and show their work.

Increasing walking zones won’t help lower the absentee rate. Kids already skip school when it is actually raining or when it’s predicted to rain on their walk home.

+1
Also, how many kids at the 1.9.mile mark actually walk to school, especially inexpensive areas? I'd wager most carpool.

Carpooling only works if parents or other kids can drive them. I know many who walk that far. Or, bike or scooter.

What issue are you raising wrt the boundary studies?

Read the previous post. Hs kids only get a bus if it’s past two miles. Some of the walks are dangerous. We don’t have sidewalks and busy streets.

That's not a hard and fast rule. Some closer neighborhoods get bus service if the kids would have to cross a highway for example.

No, our kids pass conn, Georgia and university. We have no sidewalks on most streets. No bus.

It depends. Students that would have to cross the beltway or 270 often will get a bus.

That’s because they literally cannot cross it. But, they don’t for other unsafe situations.

Wrong. You can pass 270 via walking on old Georgetown road or Rockledge, for example. People under 2 miles get a bus to WJ from the other side. I’m 1.2 miles and get a bus.

Again, then you are showing the inequity. Our kids have to cross dangerous roads and have been hit by cars and it’s a minimum of two miles. We are at the two mile mark exactly and no bus near us.

False. The regulation clearly states "Transportation may be provided to students who live within the prescribed distances established by the Board if the director of DOT determines that an appropriate walking route does not exist."

https://ww2.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/policy/pdf/eeara.pdf

Now, it is certainly true that the director of DOT may have made inconsistent determinations of walking routes around the county. But there is no rule saying that it's a minimum of two miles.

[Anonymous]

People need to be realistic about the potential increases to property taxes due to increases in the budget. MCPS already has a huge budget with increases coming for compensation and benefits. Are they planning to spend that on buses instead? It’s just not realistic to view and consider these options without a price rage attached to them.

Just like Congress does (or is supposed to do).

Our property taxes have gone up so much in the time we’ve lived here. It’s too much honestly.