Given WW3, should we cancel Europe travel plans

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

Why would they renounce their US citizenship?? Those countries and the US allow dual citizenship.

b/c the us, unlike other countries- forces all Americans who are NOT plutocratic "job creators" to pay the insane amount of income tax with nothing to show for it- I mean you get nothing to show for taxes when resident on the US as well but its especially galling as an ex-pat.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

It sounds like these people don’t get how they are behaving like Trumpers, wanting to exploit locals and their economies as rich lords.

Well, Europe sent their poor and needy to the US for centuries. Now the chickens are coming home to roost. I don't see a problem with that. These people, for the most part, have family members that emigrated recently.

You realize the majority of Americans are descendents of Europeans, right?

That was the point I was making. Apparently poorly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:A good outcome would be locals being able to afford housing where rent and property values aren't driven up by tourists flooding Airbnbs.

Then the locals should not rent their houses via airbnb. Sounds to me like they would rather have the money than not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Even if the U.S. attacks Iran there won't be any "WW3"; nobody is coming to rescue the Iranians; the theocracy will collapse and that will be that. There is no reason whatsoever to expect European involvement in any conflict involving Iran. Iran has no reason to attack any European countries, and lacks the capacity to actually do so beyond random terror which has always been a risk with them.

But, if you'd feel more comfortable, by all means stay home and conduct civil defense drills to make sure your fallout shelter is ready.

Russia, China or North Korea might come to Iran’s rescue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

Why would they renounce their US citizenship?? Those countries and the US allow dual citizenship.

b/c the us, unlike other countries- forces all Americans who are NOT plutocratic "job creators" to pay the insane amount of income tax with nothing to show for it- I mean you get nothing to show for taxes when resident on the US as well but its especially galling as an ex-pat.

Have to wonder if anyone posting on here has ever lived outside the US.

All American citizens are required to file income tax returns every year regardless of where they live or their income. For most countries the US has tax treaties and will not double tax incomes. The Euro countries beloved by DCUM have higher tax rates than the US. You don't flee from taxes by moving to Spain or Germany or the UK. To avoid taxes you move to Dubai but only up to a certain threshold, above it you pay taxes to Uncle Sam.

I thought progressives loved taxes? Given that the T administration is planning to cut taxes in the big and beautiful bill you should be ecstatic, no? Otherwise am a bit confused by your post's implications.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:A good outcome would be locals being able to afford housing where rent and property values aren't driven up by tourists flooding Airbnbs.

Then the locals should not rent their houses via airbnb. Sounds to me like they would rather have the money than not.

Because housing is comparatively cheaper in Europe, lots of Americans, Asians, Russians, and Europeans own multiple properties in touristy areas that they rent out through AirBnB or other platforms.

When I was in Portugal to speak at an international conference on homelessness, I was the only person who stayed at a hotel. Everyone else I met at the conference stayed at an Airbnb. Interestingly, every taxi driver, waiter, and even the local housing advocates I met railed against how Airbnbs had destroyed the housing market—with foreigners owning so many properties and renting them out to tourists or just letting them sit empty.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

Why would they renounce their US citizenship?? Those countries and the US allow dual citizenship.

b/c the us, unlike other countries- forces all Americans who are NOT plutocratic "job creators" to pay the insane amount of income tax with nothing to show for it- I mean you get nothing to show for taxes when resident on the US as well but its especially galling as an ex-pat.

I would be interested on an update on these families in a few years, particularly viz. health care experiences and children’s assimilation to schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Stay away from Barcelona. Anti-tourist protests. There were similar demonstrations in other parts of Spain including Ibiza, Malaga, Palma de Mallorca, San Sebastian and Granada. Protests in Italy took place in cities including Genoa, Naples, Palermo, Milan and Venice.
We’ve worn out our welcome with bad behavior

Our bad behavior? I don’t think Americans are the worst tourists in Europe. Not even close. Plus the locals in those cities are entitled jerks. They want the tourist dollars but not the tourists. Sorry but it doesn’t work like that.

Nope, the worst tourists are the Spanish and the UK chavs. We were in Turkey last year and ended up altering plans to avoid Spanish tour groups. Loud, pushy, culturally disrespectful. And the chavs in Egypt, OMG. Just stumbling drunk (in a muslim country!), making out in public, haranguing the locals over everything, shrieking conversations, etc.

You haven’t seen Russian tourists yet, especially large groups of well-to-do drunk Russians, they are all of the above and more.

Fascinating. I find them rather muted, even sheepish nowadays. Where was this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

Why would they renounce their US citizenship?? Those countries and the US allow dual citizenship.

b/c the us, unlike other countries- forces all Americans who are NOT plutocratic "job creators" to pay the insane amount of income tax with nothing to show for it- I mean you get nothing to show for taxes when resident on the US as well but its especially galling as an ex-pat.

I would be interested on an update on these families in a few years, particularly viz. health care experiences and children’s assimilation to schools.

How is that relevant and why do you think this would be interesting?

In principle, there’s an inherent contradiction in US tax policy. You tax foreign residents on their income earned here on the basis they use US services, but then you also tax Americans living overseas who use no services. I say ‘in principle’ because I think it’s frequently a ridiculous bureaucratic obligation whereby the taxpayer has to lodge a US tax return but then claims credit for the taxes paid overseas (?) effectively negating any US tax liability.

[Anonymous]

Are taxes user fees? I was unaware of that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

Why would they renounce their US citizenship?? Those countries and the US allow dual citizenship.

b/c the us, unlike other countries- forces all Americans who are NOT plutocratic "job creators" to pay the insane amount of income tax with nothing to show for it- I mean you get nothing to show for taxes when resident on the US as well but its especially galling as an ex-pat.

I would be interested on an update on these families in a few years, particularly viz. health care experiences and children’s assimilation to schools.

How is that relevant and why do you think this would be interesting?

In principle, there’s an inherent contradiction in US tax policy. You tax foreign residents on their income earned here on the basis they use US services, but then you also tax Americans living overseas who use no services. I say ‘in principle’ because I think it’s frequently a ridiculous bureaucratic obligation whereby the taxpayer has to lodge a US tax return but then claims credit for the taxes paid overseas (?) effectively negating any US tax liability.

Just interested, that’s all. I’ve heard some negative anecdotes about healthcare in Portugal and Spain, massive DCUM favorites. Schools were a surprise to someone I know and not in a good way. Grass isn’t always greener.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

Why would they renounce their US citizenship?? Those countries and the US allow dual citizenship.

b/c the us, unlike other countries- forces all Americans who are NOT plutocratic "job creators" to pay the insane amount of income tax with nothing to show for it- I mean you get nothing to show for taxes when resident on the US as well but its especially galling as an ex-pat.

I would be interested on an update on these families in a few years, particularly viz. health care experiences and children’s assimilation to schools.

How is that relevant and why do you think this would be interesting?

In principle, there’s an inherent contradiction in US tax policy. You tax foreign residents on their income earned here on the basis they use US services, but then you also tax Americans living overseas who use no services. I say ‘in principle’ because I think it’s frequently a ridiculous bureaucratic obligation whereby the taxpayer has to lodge a US tax return but then claims credit for the taxes paid overseas (?) effectively negating any US tax liability.

Just interested, that’s all. I’ve heard some negative anecdotes about healthcare in Portugal and Spain, massive DCUM favorites. Schools were a surprise to someone I know and not in a good way. Grass isn’t always greener.

There are always negative anecdotes in both directions, ie foreigners not happy with schools or healthcare here and Americans not happy with them in other countries. But they are just anecdotes and often reflect the circumstances and expectations of those particular people. I guess the test is whether people decide to stay in whatever country they are in. For example, there have been various threads here before disparaging British healthcare and yet there are almost 250,000 Americans living there. They wouldn’t stay if, on balance, they didn’t prefer it there.

estimated about 10,000 Americans live in Portugal and about 40,000 in Spain, where is almost 250,000 live in the UK.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Stay away from Barcelona. Anti-tourist protests. There were similar demonstrations in other parts of Spain including Ibiza, Malaga, Palma de Mallorca, San Sebastian and Granada. Protests in Italy took place in cities including Genoa, Naples, Palermo, Milan and Venice.
We’ve worn out our welcome with bad behavior

Those people taking it out on the tourists are bullies. They should go after their politicians and pass laws prohibiting foreigners and corporations buying up residential properties. Ban AirBnB while at it too, but that is a small bucket compared with corperate owned units. Without tourists, a lot of people would not be able to make a living. Don't know about other areas but in Andalusia, the unemployment rate is 20%. They can't afford housing even without tourists.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Stay away from Barcelona. Anti-tourist protests. There were similar demonstrations in other parts of Spain including Ibiza, Malaga, Palma de Mallorca, San Sebastian and Granada. Protests in Italy took place in cities including Genoa, Naples, Palermo, Milan and Venice.
We’ve worn out our welcome with bad behavior

Those people taking it out on the tourists are bullies. They should go after their politicians and pass laws prohibiting foreigners and corporations buying up residential properties. Ban AirBnB while at it too, but that is a small bucket compared with corperate owned units. Without tourists, a lot of people would not be able to make a living. Don't know about other areas but in Andalusia, the unemployment rate is 20%. They can't afford housing even without tourists.

I was in Venice a couple of weeks ago, no issues. The natives were happy to take our money.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:It's not airbnbs - US has a ton of them. It's that Americans are moving entirely to Europe and buying up property only Americans can afford, away from locals.

The airbnbs often are owned by locals and a source of income - it's business there just like it is in the US.

It's really that Americans are leveraging lax immigration systems and moving to Europe and taking advantage of their way of life because the US has gotten out of control with costs, culture and the slimeball running the show here. That is what is ruining Europe for everyone except Americans.

I know 3 families that will be relo to Europe before end of yr and renouncing American citizenship without a second thought. They are going to Portugal, Spain and France. All have family ties/hate Trump and realize there's only more pain to come in the US. Europe isn't perfect but it is def a simpler lifestyle and there is a freedom there now that you really are seeing less of in the US.

Why would they renounce their US citizenship?? Those countries and the US allow dual citizenship.

b/c the us, unlike other countries- forces all Americans who are NOT plutocratic "job creators" to pay the insane amount of income tax with nothing to show for it- I mean you get nothing to show for taxes when resident on the US as well but its especially galling as an ex-pat.

I would be interested on an update on these families in a few years, particularly viz. health care experiences and children’s assimilation to schools.

How is that relevant and why do you think this would be interesting?

In principle, there’s an inherent contradiction in US tax policy. You tax foreign residents on their income earned here on the basis they use US services, but then you also tax Americans living overseas who use no services. I say ‘in principle’ because I think it’s frequently a ridiculous bureaucratic obligation whereby the taxpayer has to lodge a US tax return but then claims credit for the taxes paid overseas (?) effectively negating any US tax liability.

Just interested, that’s all. I’ve heard some negative anecdotes about healthcare in Portugal and Spain, massive DCUM favorites. Schools were a surprise to someone I know and not in a good way. Grass isn’t always greener.

There are always negative anecdotes in both directions, ie foreigners not happy with schools or healthcare here and Americans not happy with them in other countries. But they are just anecdotes and often reflect the circumstances and expectations of those particular people. I guess the test is whether people decide to stay in whatever country they are in. For example, there have been various threads here before disparaging British healthcare and yet there are almost 250,000 Americans living there. They wouldn’t stay if, on balance, they didn’t prefer it there.

estimated about 10,000 Americans live in Portugal and about 40,000 in Spain, where is almost 250,000 live in the UK.

Yeah, they don’t use the NHS, go private pay and they also fly back home for treatment. DUH