Let's keep the outdoor dining, the streets reserved for walking, and the new bike lanes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

So the people who don't live in the city and don't walk or ride bikes are floating in via hot air balloon?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So bikes don't belong in the category of everyone-except-cars? I see people biking on side paths and they don't seem to have a problem.

Yes, of course bicycles belong in the category of everyone-except-cars. That category is the problem. Like, here's lots of space for drivers, and over there is a narrow space for everyone else to try to share. It's not comfortable walking on a "sidepath" where lots of people are bicycling, and it's not comfortable bicycling on a "sidepath" where lots of people are walking. The only group that "sidepaths" really work for is drivers.

Just tell the truth-bikers don't like the paths because the peds slow them down so they bike on the road and slow down the cars. Got it. It has nothing to do with comfort level. It's just that common it's-all-about-me biker mentality.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

So the people who don't live in the city and don't walk or ride bikes are floating in via hot air balloon?

Rickshas of course. DC residents have such clever solutions to everything, those sneaky little devils. "Just put violence interruptors there." "Just ban cars." "Just tax it." How's that working for you

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

So the people who don't live in the city and don't walk or ride bikes are floating in via hot air balloon?

If only there were something in the DC area that's kind of like a car, only much bigger and longer, with seats for lots of people, connected to more things like itself, and the whole thing runs on tracks underground or aboveground. Or something else that's kind of like a car, only much bigger and longer, with seats for lots of people, that runs on the streets.

Your dollars may help DC, but your car does not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

Thanks for demonstrating that you do, in fact, live in an alternate reality. Probably only maximum 20% of workers in DC could feasibly live near a metro station or bike in even if we tore up and redid all of the development in VA/MD. There simply is not enough housing or even enough space for housing (in the best case scenario if we tore down all the houses and built communist style high rises around all VA/MD metro stations). I know people who commute into DC from Springfield and Gaithersburg to jobs that aren't even within walking distance of a metro. So you want them to drive half an hour to a metro station WITH THEIR BIKE, pay to park, metro in with their freaking bike, oftentimes switch a metro line, then when they're done with that bike another 10 minutes to the office? Yeah... say goodbye to your economy

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

So the people who don't live in the city and don't walk or ride bikes are floating in via hot air balloon?

If only there were something in the DC area that's kind of like a car, only much bigger and longer, with seats for lots of people, connected to more things like itself, and the whole thing runs on tracks underground or aboveground. Or something else that's kind of like a car, only much bigger and longer, with seats for lots of people, that runs on the streets.

Your dollars may help DC, but your car does not.

You haven't read the whole thread. Plus that didn't work so well last year for some reason.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So bikes don't belong in the category of everyone-except-cars? I see people biking on side paths and they don't seem to have a problem.

Yes, of course bicycles belong in the category of everyone-except-cars. That category is the problem. Like, here's lots of space for drivers, and over there is a narrow space for everyone else to try to share. It's not comfortable walking on a "sidepath" where lots of people are bicycling, and it's not comfortable bicycling on a "sidepath" where lots of people are walking. The only group that "sidepaths" really work for is drivers.

Just tell the truth-bikers don't like the paths because the peds slow them down so they bike on the road and slow down the cars. Got it. It has nothing to do with comfort level. It's just that common it's-all-about-me biker mentality.

Yes, you're right, one of the reasons I don't like bicycling on the sidewalk is that, even when I'm bicycling slowly (like 10 mph, which is a slow running pace), I'm still bicycling fast enough to make pedestrians uncomfortable. (Another reason I don't like bicycling on the sidewalk is that, on slower roads, it's less safe for me than bicycling in the road.)

In contrast, when I'm bicycling in the road, I'm not making drivers uncomfortable, though I may be annoying some drivers who don't understand that what's really slowing them down is other cars.

Regardless, the solution to both issues is bicycle infrastructure.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

Thanks for demonstrating that you do, in fact, live in an alternate reality. Probably only maximum 20% of workers in DC could feasibly live near a metro station or bike in even if we tore up and redid all of the development in VA/MD. There simply is not enough housing or even enough space for housing (in the best case scenario if we tore down all the houses and built communist style high rises around all VA/MD metro stations). I know people who commute into DC from Springfield and Gaithersburg to jobs that aren't even within walking distance of a metro. So you want them to drive half an hour to a metro station WITH THEIR BIKE, pay to park, metro in with their freaking bike, oftentimes switch a metro line, then when they're done with that bike another 10 minutes to the office? Yeah... say goodbye to your economy

So DC has to make car-commuting convenient for people who don't live in DC and find it more convenient to commute into DC by car? What's DC's incentive for that?

Also, "communist style high rises", really?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So bikes don't belong in the category of everyone-except-cars? I see people biking on side paths and they don't seem to have a problem.

Yes, of course bicycles belong in the category of everyone-except-cars. That category is the problem. Like, here's lots of space for drivers, and over there is a narrow space for everyone else to try to share. It's not comfortable walking on a "sidepath" where lots of people are bicycling, and it's not comfortable bicycling on a "sidepath" where lots of people are walking. The only group that "sidepaths" really work for is drivers.

Just tell the truth-bikers don't like the paths because the peds slow them down so they bike on the road and slow down the cars. Got it. It has nothing to do with comfort level. It's just that common it's-all-about-me biker mentality.

Yes, you're right, one of the reasons I don't like bicycling on the sidewalk is that, even when I'm bicycling slowly (like 10 mph, which is a slow running pace), I'm still bicycling fast enough to make pedestrians uncomfortable. (Another reason I don't like bicycling on the sidewalk is that, on slower roads, it's less safe for me than bicycling in the road.)

In contrast, when I'm bicycling in the road, I'm not making drivers uncomfortable, though I may be annoying some drivers who don't understand that what's really slowing them down is other cars.

Regardless, the solution to both issues is bicycle infrastructure.

Other cars are able to maintain the speed limit. Bikers are not. You are not very bright.

[Anonymous]

And what does building more bike infrastructure have to do with banning cars? Sounds like you don't want to peacefully co-exist.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So bikes don't belong in the category of everyone-except-cars? I see people biking on side paths and they don't seem to have a problem.

Yes, of course bicycles belong in the category of everyone-except-cars. That category is the problem. Like, here's lots of space for drivers, and over there is a narrow space for everyone else to try to share. It's not comfortable walking on a "sidepath" where lots of people are bicycling, and it's not comfortable bicycling on a "sidepath" where lots of people are walking. The only group that "sidepaths" really work for is drivers.

Just tell the truth-bikers don't like the paths because the peds slow them down so they bike on the road and slow down the cars. Got it. It has nothing to do with comfort level. It's just that common it's-all-about-me biker mentality.

Yes, you're right, one of the reasons I don't like bicycling on the sidewalk is that, even when I'm bicycling slowly (like 10 mph, which is a slow running pace), I'm still bicycling fast enough to make pedestrians uncomfortable. (Another reason I don't like bicycling on the sidewalk is that, on slower roads, it's less safe for me than bicycling in the road.)

In contrast, when I'm bicycling in the road, I'm not making drivers uncomfortable, though I may be annoying some drivers who don't understand that what's really slowing them down is other cars.

Regardless, the solution to both issues is bicycle infrastructure.

Other cars are able to maintain the speed limit. Bikers are not. You are not very bright.

The speed limit is the maximum legal speed, not the target speed. Bicyclists have a legal right to use the road. If you don't want bicyclists using the road, then you should support building good bicycle infrastructure everywhere.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

So? The commuters aren’t returning in any meaningful numbers. Ever. Businesses start and fail everyday. Those that were once tied to the commuter crowd now have an unsustainable model. Other businesses will rise to fill vacancies to take advantage of new opportunities. The District is much more pleasant now and I’m sure the suburbanites don’t mind either, doing wfh and enjoying their McMansions. Your Henny Penny post is over the top.

[Anonymous]

Real blasé attitudes about economic development. Clearly people that haven’t lived in the area for a long time. It’s important to always remember that what giveth can also be taken away.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:To all the NIMBYs saying we should just keep cars out of the city and do WFH forever, you guys are living in an economic fantasy world. The population of DC DOUBLES during the day with the influx of workers (historically). Did you really think that your residential population can support all these restaurants, coffee shops, etc.? No freaking way. Your businesses will shutter without all the terrible "commuters." Your sales tax revenues will plummet. The commuters keep your city alive

Yes, the people do. The cars don't.

Thanks for demonstrating that you do, in fact, live in an alternate reality. Probably only maximum 20% of workers in DC could feasibly live near a metro station or bike in even if we tore up and redid all of the development in VA/MD. There simply is not enough housing or even enough space for housing (in the best case scenario if we tore down all the houses and built communist style high rises around all VA/MD metro stations). I know people who commute into DC from Springfield and Gaithersburg to jobs that aren't even within walking distance of a metro. So you want them to drive half an hour to a metro station WITH THEIR BIKE, pay to park, metro in with their freaking bike, oftentimes switch a metro line, then when they're done with that bike another 10 minutes to the office? Yeah... say goodbye to your economy

So DC has to make car-commuting convenient for people who don't live in DC and find it more convenient to commute into DC by car? What's DC's incentive for that?

Also, "communist style high rises", really?

DC doesn't HAVE to do anything. My point was only that if you don't, your economy will dramatically suffer. As another PP said, perhaps it will anyway if commuters aren't returning regardless of street availability. Communist style high rises refers to actual communist style high rises. If you haven't traveled in eastern europe, russia, and china then perhaps you don't know what this means. They are huge buildings that are almost mini-cities. My point was that even doing this would not give enough people access to walkable metro stations to allow DC to function without most people still commuting in via car.