TJHSST Admissions Revised Proposal to be sent on 10/6

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:It's embarrassing to watch this working session. FCPS doesn't even calculate middle school GPA. So this 3.5 GPA doesn't exist. FCPS has no idea how many will be in the pool. There is no way they can be sure more URMs will be in this pool.

FCPS doesn't collect data on why students don't apply to TJ. They don't collect data on why accepted students reject their offers. The only data they seem to have is too many Asians are in the semi-finalist round and the final round.

Bingo.

[Anonymous]

Where are you watching? Can someone post a link?

[Anonymous]

It’s on channel 99. https://www.fcps.edu/tv/ch99?fbclid=IwAR3--KUbjzXC391tHbq1hORf9WrdikG4oWcl6MgNpIw43UPOyCn8mTozMJw

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:So has the SB or Braband explained or discussed what is the key cause that led to such lack of diversity at TJ?

Is it the test prep culture?
Is it the pipeline that is not diverse enough?
Is it that admission decisions are racially biased?
Is it that the pressure-cooker culture at TJ is non desired by some students and families?

Not a FX resident and am just watching this from the sideline and wondering if these basic questions have been explored and answered before such a solution (aka lottery, partial or full) is proposed.

1. The test prep culture thing is a bit of a red herring. It’s a screener for the semi-final pool. And if you can’t make that cut without test prep, you won’t survive TJ. In the finalist round, there are always kids with very high tests who don’t get in and much more average ones that do. No one knows the secret sauce, but the proctored essays and problem solving essay plus teacher reds seem to play large roles.

2. The Pipeline definitely isn’t diverse enough. But that is partly an SES issue. They want AA kids at TJ. Great. But FCPS is only 9% AA, and those students are disproportionately low SES. Hispanic kids are disproportionately low SES and ELL. If FCPS can figure out how to bring kids who are at a disadvantage starting with poorer pre-natal nutrition and hearing fewer words as a baby up to speed with kids who get every advantage, they will be the first ones to do so. I think we aren’t being honest enough about the fact that some kids start on third base, and some start on the third string. It’s less of a pipeline issue than a pre-pipeline issue. Although, the kids who get summer enrichment, private supports for LDs, tutors, music lessons, museum visits, great nutrition and a family value on education will always be ahead.

3. No. When admissions views files, they don’t have names and there is no indication of race or gender. Which is how we get such a lopsided result. It is worth me tuning, although no one does, that girls and boys apply is about equal numbers, but the acceptance rate is usually 60% male.

4. Definitely yes. TJ isn’t for anyone, and families should be honest about what they are getting into academically. It’s very intense, and takes the whole family to support the kid. On one hand, I can see why no AA kids want to go because no AA kids are there. OTOH, am AA kid with TJ level credential in NOVA will have multiple free ride offers are the top pro are schools, who also have to show doversity. And these schools are actually more racially diverse and will get them to an Ivy with a lot more balanced HS experience. Which is why I doubt TJ will ever get significantly higher numbers of AAs. Unless they are true STEM nerds, they have better options.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So has the SB or Braband explained or discussed what is the key cause that led to such lack of diversity at TJ?

Is it the test prep culture?
Is it the pipeline that is not diverse enough?
Is it that admission decisions are racially biased?
Is it that the pressure-cooker culture at TJ is non desired by some students and families?

Not a FX resident and am just watching this from the sideline and wondering if these basic questions have been explored and answered before such a solution (aka lottery, partial or full) is proposed.

1. The test prep culture thing is a bit of a red herring. It’s a screener for the semi-final pool. And if you can’t make that cut without test prep, you won’t survive TJ. In the finalist round, there are always kids with very high tests who don’t get in and much more average ones that do. No one knows the secret sauce, but the proctored essays and problem solving essay plus teacher recs seem to play large roles.

2. The Pipeline definitely isn’t diverse enough. But that is partly an SES issue. They want AA kids at TJ. Great. But FCPS is only 9% AA, and those students are disproportionately low SES. Hispanic kids are disproportionately low SES and ELL. If FCPS can figure out how to bring kids who are at a disadvantage starting with poorer pre-natal nutrition and hearing fewer words as a baby up to speed with kids who get every advantage, they will be the first ones to do so. I think we aren’t being honest enough about the fact that some kids start on third base, and some start on the third string. It’s less of a pipeline issue than a pre-pipeline issue. Although, the kids who get summer enrichment, private supports for LDs, tutors, music lessons, museum visits, great nutrition and a family value on education will always be ahead.

3. No. When admissions views files, they don’t have names and there is no indication of race or gender. Which is how we get such a lopsided result. It is worth me noting, although no one does, that girls and boys apply is about equal numbers, but the acceptance rate is usually 60% male.

4. Definitely yes. TJ isn’t for anyone, and families should be honest about what they are getting into academically. It’s very intense, and takes the whole family to support the kid. On one hand, I can see why no AA kids want to go because no AA kids are there. OTOH, am AA kid with TJ level credentials in NOVA will have multiple free ride offers are the top private schools, who also have to show diversity. And these schools are actually more racially diverse and will get them to an Ivy with a lot more balanced HS experience. Which is why I doubt TJ will ever get significantly higher numbers of AAs. Unless they are true STEM nerds, they have better options.

Sorry for typos. iPhone. Late. I cleaned it up a little.

[Anonymous]

SB voted unanimously to get rid of the Quant-Q test - good. I hope they do use some sort of test though, as tests are still the most objective way of comparing everyone with the same ruler.

No mention of the ACT Aspire test. Is that assumed gone?

[Anonymous]

They agreed to take all those first level tests away. The ones that used to determine semifinalist status.

[Anonymous]

But it was troubling that some didn’t even seem to know the ACT Aspire was given.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They agreed to take all those first level tests away. The ones that used to determine semifinalist status.

Sucks to beTJ and teachers. . That always weeded out kids who could BP never succeed at TJ. Now, they will have to read and score essays and LORs for everyone. And teachers will have to write twice as many LORs.

[Anonymous]

Thank you, Rachna, for acknowledging all the tj and asian bashing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They agreed to take all those first level tests away. The ones that used to determine semifinalist status.

Sucks to beTJ and teachers. . That always weeded out kids who could BP never succeed at TJ. Now, they will have to read and score essays and LORs for everyone. And teachers will have to write twice as many LORs.

Nope, they don’t want teacher recs. Apparently they are biased, too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:So has the SB or Braband explained or discussed what is the key cause that led to such lack of diversity at TJ?

Is it the test prep culture?
Is it the pipeline that is not diverse enough?
Is it that admission decisions are racially biased?
Is it that the pressure-cooker culture at TJ is non desired by some students and families?

Not a FX resident and am just watching this from the sideline and wondering if these basic questions have been explored and answered before such a solution (aka lottery, partial or full) is proposed.

1. The test prep culture thing is a bit of a red herring. It’s a screener for the semi-final pool. And if you can’t make that cut without test prep, you won’t survive TJ. In the finalist round, there are always kids with very high tests who don’t get in and much more average ones that do. No one knows the secret sauce, but the proctored essays and problem solving essay plus teacher recs seem to play large roles.

2. The Pipeline definitely isn’t diverse enough. But that is partly an SES issue. They want AA kids at TJ. Great. But FCPS is only 9% AA, and those students are disproportionately low SES. Hispanic kids are disproportionately low SES and ELL. If FCPS can figure out how to bring kids who are at a disadvantage starting with poorer pre-natal nutrition and hearing fewer words as a baby up to speed with kids who get every advantage, they will be the first ones to do so. I think we aren’t being honest enough about the fact that some kids start on third base, and some start on the third string. It’s less of a pipeline issue than a pre-pipeline issue. Although, the kids who get summer enrichment, private supports for LDs, tutors, music lessons, museum visits, great nutrition and a family value on education will always be ahead.

3. No. When admissions views files, they don’t have names and there is no indication of race or gender. Which is how we get such a lopsided result. It is worth me noting, although no one does, that girls and boys apply is about equal numbers, but the acceptance rate is usually 60% male.

4. Definitely yes. TJ isn’t for anyone, and families should be honest about what they are getting into academically. It’s very intense, and takes the whole family to support the kid. On one hand, I can see why no AA kids want to go because no AA kids are there. OTOH, am AA kid with TJ level credentials in NOVA will have multiple free ride offers are the top private schools, who also have to show diversity. And these schools are actually more racially diverse and will get them to an Ivy with a lot more balanced HS experience. Which is why I doubt TJ will ever get significantly higher numbers of AAs. Unless they are true STEM nerds, they have better options.

Sorry for typos. iPhone. Late. I cleaned it up a little.

+1

I don't understand why the test is a barrier to diversity. The cut from the applicant pool to the semi-finalist round is not deep. I think 60-70% made the first cut. Why don't the SB admit every URM in the second round? Problem solved. Honestly if you can't make it to the second round, I am not sure you even want to go to TJ.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thank you, Rachna, for acknowledging all the tj and asian bashing.

She seems to be the only one who is making some sense. But she also voted for getting rid of the test without an alternative for measuring math and science aptitude.

[Anonymous]

I think Rachna, Corbett Sanders, Derenak Kaufax and Tholen support actually assessing merit and are hoping the problem solving essay will address that. It’s not enough, imo, but it’s better than Brabrand’s lottery alone.

[Anonymous]

Once we, the community, demand transparency in the process,p along with data,p they might realize that using some form of a test, paid for by them, is probably the easiest way. They should really test for non-verbal IQ type tests, if they want to catch the naturally bright URM kids. Just test all 7th graders or 8th graders