Are students unhappy at CMU?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:CMU is not unnecessarily hard. It seems hard because many universities artificially reduce courses rigor to accommodate the increased unreadiness of nowadays high school graduates. There are big portion of CMU students graduate with high honor. More importantly, CMU students are trained to get jobs done. The practicality and reliability is highly valued in work place, but disdained by many individuals as outdated qualities.

Examples? Most top colleges are still…well, really freaking hard. The difficulty of CMU just sounds like the difficulty of stem degrees. The honest question becomes why does it seem CMU’s education comes at a detriment to the college experience, while peers at other institutions can have both rigorous stem education and an amazing college experience.

Frankly everyone at top colleges “studies a lot”

Peers at other institutions with rigorous stem education don’t have “amazing” college experiences. If a program is known rigorous, the complains are similar. Though such programs can be small at many universities and thus overshadowed by the overall school experiences.

This simply isn't true. Stanford, Rice and Berkeley are very much STEM-oriented schools that no one would call "easy", yet they have plenty of happy students who have fulfilling experiences in college.

What sets CMU apart is a few factors:

1) CMU kicked off about 80% of its fraternities from 2003-2013 or so. A few have recolonized as shadows of their former selves, but without nearly a century of tradition you aren't going to get anything remotely resembling the same experience.

2) The lack of a D1 sports scene is a huge detriment. There's nothing to rally around or rejoice in on a regular basis, and school spirit is in the negatives.

3) Anecdotally, from the students I've known, CMU does not place a heavy emphasis on high school extracurriculars during the admissions process. Thus, it selects for a very one-dimensional workhorse type of student without social aptitude.

4) The amount of work CMU piles on is absolutely different than peer institutions, as is the grading scale. Professors are completely merciless in both regards.

5) The weather is godawful, which both discourages venturing outside and puts a big wet blanket over your spirits.

These aspects set CMU apart and aside from the nice surrounding city (which most CMU students will never venture more than a mile into, if that) the school basically offers nothing to counterbalance the brutal academics.

Pittsburgh resident here. Totally agree. My kid’s school sends a lot of kids to CMU each year and my kid’s stats are definitely good enough to get in and he won’t even consider applying. Former students from his school who went to CMU have universally stated that it’s a miserable place. It is just insane academics and nothing else that makes up college life and the campus sucks.

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:I graduated from CMU with a degree in Computer Engineering in 2010 with so many regrets. I literally spent at least 75 hours a week on classes and assignments. I didn't have time to develop my social skills (e.g. EQ) and hobbies during my time there. There were many hobbies that I wanted to do in those four years, but I never had the time due to academic commitments. You could say that I can follow up on those hobbies after graduation, but they were never the same after that. IMHO, I could get the same job with the same pay had I gone to UVA, Virginia Tech, or GMU as I would at CMU, and had much more time to pursue my hobbies. Time is something that I will never get back at CMU. CMU is a great school for people who have passions for academics and very much nothing else, and it was definitely not for me. YMMV.

The average CS graduate from CMU makes much more than the average UVA, VT, or GMU CS graduate.

The PP is literally telling you that wasn't the case for them. It might be for some, but in reality, it's not about where you go as much as the degree itself and a decent GPA. Fact is you don't get paid that much more (if any ) from a top school. It might be slightly easier to land a job with FAANG, but if you do, you will be working with kids from other less "hard core Schools" and making the same thing

The PP wouldn't know. They didn't attend both and have the option to compare.

The actual data shows you do get paid more from top schools. CS graduates from CMU make 56% more than UVA CS grads according to U.S. College Scorecard data.

DP. I actually have the data to compare abeit it is a small sample. I graduated from CMU and my brother graduated from UVA. I make 350K and he makes 300K. He has a much better quality of life than I do because he had time in college to develop his passion and hobbies, and I did not. That's the difference. I make a bit more than he does, but after taxes, not by much.

Exacty. I'd rather be happy in a studio apartment than miserable in a mansion. Someday we're all going to end up six feet under either way, so might as well enjoy our time here.

Thanks so much for saying this! I need more of this perspective in my life.

[Anonymous]

Very very unhappy

[Anonymous]

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Anonymous wrote:DD suffered through 4 years. She did not enjoy college and was happy to graduate. With that said, she got a job and is excelling. Most of her friends felt similarly. It’s just a really hard school and the location isn’t great. She will not make the same mistake for grad school.

I thought people live Pittsburgh? Is it CMU’s particular neighborhood that is bad?

I have a son at Pitt and will add that transportation to/from DC area isn’t great. You are either driving six hours on the Turnpike or taking train to Philly and switching (a 10 hour ordeal) or flying. And even flying isn’t always direct - he’s connected in PHL and LGA to get to DC.

??? There are cheap flights directly to DC. And there are numerous bus companies that cater to college students and will drive them directly from Pittsburgh to Montgomery Mall.

We’re in Virginia, and drive time is usually 4 1/2 hours total - I feel like you are doing it wrong.

LOL. Yeah, six hours on the PA Turnpike from Pittsburgh to DMV. Are you stopping for two hours at a diner in Breezewood?

It's like a friend of mine from college (Pitt) who was from the DMV and insisted that it routinely took 3 hours to go "all the way around" the DC beltway. I suspect he was high and circled the beltway more than once.

LOL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CMU is not unnecessarily hard. It seems hard because many universities artificially reduce courses rigor to accommodate the increased unreadiness of nowadays high school graduates. There are big portion of CMU students graduate with high honor. More importantly, CMU students are trained to get jobs done. The practicality and reliability is highly valued in work place, but disdained by many individuals as outdated qualities.

Examples? Most top colleges are still…well, really freaking hard. The difficulty of CMU just sounds like the difficulty of stem degrees. The honest question becomes why does it seem CMU’s education comes at a detriment to the college experience, while peers at other institutions can have both rigorous stem education and an amazing college experience.

Frankly everyone at top colleges “studies a lot”

Peers at other institutions with rigorous stem education don’t have “amazing” college experiences. If a program is known rigorous, the complains are similar. Though such programs can be small at many universities and thus overshadowed by the overall school experiences.

Can confirm. Many ivy/+/ucb have loads of hours of work every single day

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CMU is not unnecessarily hard. It seems hard because many universities artificially reduce courses rigor to accommodate the increased unreadiness of nowadays high school graduates. There are big portion of CMU students graduate with high honor. More importantly, CMU students are trained to get jobs done. The practicality and reliability is highly valued in work place, but disdained by many individuals as outdated qualities.

Examples? Most top colleges are still…well, really freaking hard. The difficulty of CMU just sounds like the difficulty of stem degrees. The honest question becomes why does it seem CMU’s education comes at a detriment to the college experience, while peers at other institutions can have both rigorous stem education and an amazing college experience.

Frankly everyone at top colleges “studies a lot”

Peers at other institutions with rigorous stem education don’t have “amazing” college experiences. If a program is known rigorous, the complains are similar. Though such programs can be small at many universities and thus overshadowed by the overall school experiences.

Can confirm. Many ivy/+/ucb have loads of hours of work every single day

No one is saying they don't. The difference is that they also offer the enjoyable aspects of college that CMU, for the most part, does not.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I graduated from CMU with a degree in Computer Engineering in 2010 with so many regrets. I literally spent at least 75 hours a week on classes and assignments. I didn't have time to develop my social skills (e.g. EQ) and hobbies during my time there. There were many hobbies that I wanted to do in those four years, but I never had the time due to academic commitments. You could say that I can follow up on those hobbies after graduation, but they were never the same after that. IMHO, I could get the same job with the same pay had I gone to UVA, Virginia Tech, or GMU as I would at CMU, and had much more time to pursue my hobbies. Time is something that I will never get back at CMU. CMU is a great school for people who have passions for academics and very much nothing else, and it was definitely not for me. YMMV.

The average CS graduate from CMU makes much more than the average UVA, VT, or GMU CS graduate.

The PP is literally telling you that wasn't the case for them. It might be for some, but in reality, it's not about where you go as much as the degree itself and a decent GPA. Fact is you don't get paid that much more (if any ) from a top school. It might be slightly easier to land a job with FAANG, but if you do, you will be working with kids from other less "hard core Schools" and making the same thing

The PP wouldn't know. They didn't attend both and have the option to compare.

The actual data shows you do get paid more from top schools. CS graduates from CMU make 56% more than UVA CS grads according to U.S. College Scorecard data.

DP. I actually have the data to compare abeit it is a small sample. I graduated from CMU and my brother graduated from UVA. I make 350K and he makes 300K. He has a much better quality of life than I do because he had time in college to develop his passion and hobbies, and I did not. That's the difference. I make a bit more than he does, but after taxes, not by much.

You two are not the same person. The data from graduates shows a clear advantage in salary for CMU graduates.

[Anonymous]

CMU was my sons first choice for CS. We visited the campus and it was small and the dorms looked like they were about to fall down. He still applied bc he is such a serious academic. He was waitlisted and went elsewhere. He has two friends 1 in engineering and 1 in CS. It is not a balanced experience is the best way to put it. It's high pressure and they end up with very recruitable skills but if you super academic kid might benefit from broadening out in college, CMU is likely not the ticket. I am amazed at the social growth my son experienced at the school he went to which also has an excellent CS program and so for him, it was a good thing he did not get in. I think too much stress might steal a time in these kids lives where they need to both live and start to love their work. it cannot be all work and no play.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

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Anonymous wrote:just dont get why parents send their kids to places like Cornell, CMU.

all downside.. weather, hard academics, no life

because a lot of people are brand whores.

I thought the School of Drama is supposed to be legitimately top-notch?

Safe to say nobody commenting here had a kid that was at CMU for the Drama/Theatre program. I would imagine a 100% different experience.

The program is top-notch. Grads include Ethan Hawke, Ted Danson and a gazillion others. I believe Tom Cruise/Katie Holmes kid is now there in the Arts program.

The hardest admit for the school.

😂😂😂😂😂😂 yeah no. theater is not a harder admit than CS

A number of the theater programs have a 2% acceptance rate. I believe that is lower than CS…of course the programs are tiny…only 12-14 kids per year for say the musical theatre program.

That does NOT make theater “the hardest admit for the school.” It makes it an insignificant program.

[Anonymous]

Friend ‘s DD seems to be happy there, graduating early in December, she is very smart though

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:just dont get why parents send their kids to places like Cornell, CMU.

all downside.. weather, hard academics, no life

because a lot of people are brand whores.

I thought the School of Drama is supposed to be legitimately top-notch?

Safe to say nobody commenting here had a kid that was at CMU for the Drama/Theatre program. I would imagine a 100% different experience.

The program is top-notch. Grads include Ethan Hawke, Ted Danson and a gazillion others. I believe Tom Cruise/Katie Holmes kid is now there in the Arts program.

The hardest admit for the school.

😂😂😂😂😂😂 yeah no. theater is not a harder admit than CS

A number of the theater programs have a 2% acceptance rate. I believe that is lower than CS…of course the programs are tiny…only 12-14 kids per year for say the musical theatre program.

That does NOT make theater “the hardest admit for the school.” It makes it an insignificant program.

Insane take. CMU has one of the top drama/MT programs in the country.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:CMU is not unnecessarily hard. It seems hard because many universities artificially reduce courses rigor to accommodate the increased unreadiness of nowadays high school graduates. There are big portion of CMU students graduate with high honor. More importantly, CMU students are trained to get jobs done. The practicality and reliability is highly valued in work place, but disdained by many individuals as outdated qualities.

Examples? Most top colleges are still…well, really freaking hard. The difficulty of CMU just sounds like the difficulty of stem degrees. The honest question becomes why does it seem CMU’s education comes at a detriment to the college experience, while peers at other institutions can have both rigorous stem education and an amazing college experience.

Frankly everyone at top colleges “studies a lot”

Peers at other institutions with rigorous stem education don’t have “amazing” college experiences. If a program is known rigorous, the complains are similar. Though such programs can be small at many universities and thus overshadowed by the overall school experiences.

Can confirm. Many ivy/+/ucb have loads of hours of work every single day

Other than Princeton, where STEM is a miserable grind and they have something like 6 suicides in 3 years, this simply isn’t true of the other Ivies. Massive grade inflation saves them, even if the social scene isn’t the best.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:just dont get why parents send their kids to places like Cornell, CMU.

all downside.. weather, hard academics, no life

because a lot of people are brand whores.

I thought the School of Drama is supposed to be legitimately top-notch?

Safe to say nobody commenting here had a kid that was at CMU for the Drama/Theatre program. I would imagine a 100% different experience.

The program is top-notch. Grads include Ethan Hawke, Ted Danson and a gazillion others. I believe Tom Cruise/Katie Holmes kid is now there in the Arts program.

The hardest admit for the school.

😂😂😂😂😂😂 yeah no. theater is not a harder admit than CS

A number of the theater programs have a 2% acceptance rate. I believe that is lower than CS…of course the programs are tiny…only 12-14 kids per year for say the musical theatre program.

That does NOT make theater “the hardest admit for the school.” It makes it an insignificant program.

Insane take. CMU has one of the top drama/MT programs in the country.

It is still not “the hardest admit” for CMU. Get over yourself.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:just dont get why parents send their kids to places like Cornell, CMU.

all downside.. weather, hard academics, no life

because a lot of people are brand whores.

I thought the School of Drama is supposed to be legitimately top-notch?

Safe to say nobody commenting here had a kid that was at CMU for the Drama/Theatre program. I would imagine a 100% different experience.

The program is top-notch. Grads include Ethan Hawke, Ted Danson and a gazillion others. I believe Tom Cruise/Katie Holmes kid is now there in the Arts program.

The hardest admit for the school.

😂😂😂😂😂😂 yeah no. theater is not a harder admit than CS

A number of the theater programs have a 2% acceptance rate. I believe that is lower than CS…of course the programs are tiny…only 12-14 kids per year for say the musical theatre program.

That does NOT make theater “the hardest admit for the school.” It makes it an insignificant program.

Insane take. CMU has one of the top drama/MT programs in the country.

Most grads from CMU drama/MT programs are jobless after graduation, or are working at Starbucks. My DD, a CMU grad, happens to be one of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:CMU was my sons first choice for CS. We visited the campus and it was small and the dorms looked like they were about to fall down. He still applied bc he is such a serious academic. He was waitlisted and went elsewhere. He has two friends 1 in engineering and 1 in CS. It is not a balanced experience is the best way to put it. It's high pressure and they end up with very recruitable skills but if you super academic kid might benefit from broadening out in college, CMU is likely not the ticket. I am amazed at the social growth my son experienced at the school he went to which also has an excellent CS program and so for him, it was a good thing he did not get in. I think too much stress might steal a time in these kids lives where they need to both live and start to love their work. it cannot be all work and no play.

+1 ditto My kid went to the state flagship, and his social life is much improved from HS. He's a serious academic, but I think if he ended up at CMU, like he thought he wanted, he would not have been able to socialize as much.