Can players move up after being bumped down?

[SoccerRef]

For the big clubs, it’s rare.
Once a kid goes down, they’re more likely to give someone else in the club, or an outside recruit, the chance on the higher team.

[Anonymous]

Only if they switch clubs. Player has now been identified as "b" level and stigmatized. It would be extremely rare for any upwards movement on more then an occasional basis.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I asked to move my son down because he was basically riding the bench on his higher team. On his current team (U15) he played most of every match. It made a lot more sense for us to play on the lower team because he needed match experience - no point being on the best team but not contributing anything. We only planned to do it for one year and then find either another club or try to move back up but the pandemic. This year, he was offered top teams for a number of clubs.

Lol. It made sense for usto play? Are you on the team too?

There is no need to be so snarky and critical. PP probably referred to the decision as the family decision, because the kid is a teenager.

Exactly - quit being a jerk and stick to the topic. BTW - there is an anger management topic. Go there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I asked to move my son down because he was basically riding the bench on his higher team. On his current team (U15) he played most of every match. It made a lot more sense for us to play on the lower team because he needed match experience - no point being on the best team but not contributing anything. We only planned to do it for one year and then find either another club or try to move back up but the pandemic. This year, he was offered top teams for a number of clubs.

Lol. It made sense for usto play? Are you on the team too?

Dumb a$$

[Anonymous]

My daughter plays on the B team under ECNL at a top club. Her team gets the ECNL cast-offs each try-out season. The kids are usually very happy to join as it means they get playing time. However, in 5 years I've never seen a kid move back up even though they improve with playing time and many are just as good as the current (lower 50% or so) of the club's ECNL players.

[Nova2Euro]

A lot of this can be tied to the coach, too. A players whose qualities might not be a great fit for one coach might benefit from a fresh look by a new coach.

But realistically, by the time a player is 15 or 16, unless there's a massive physical change (and these do sometimes happen later), if a club has seen them for at least a year and there's not a coaching change, you need to decide whether you're happy with the lower-level team or whether it's time to move on. But if your kid really believes in him/herself, and you believe in them and want to keep progressing in football, then go somewhere else. For so many reasons, it's better to be on the top team in the club in a lower-level league.

[Anonymous]

Yes but coaches have major biases and egos.

[Nova2Euro]

Of course coaches have biases--usually biases towards certain systems of play and the types of players that best suit them. Which is exactly the point I was making: if your kid isn't a good fit with a particular coach and his/her biases and therefore gets bumped off the team, there's not much hope of earning your way back onto the team and it's best, if you want to continue to progress in competitive football, to move on.

This is true at all levels up to professional. You will not change the coach's mind. Find a coach that values what the player brings to the field.

[Anonymous]

Nova2Euro wrote:Of course coaches have biases--usually biases towards certain systems of play and the types of players that best suit them. Which is exactly the point I was making: if your kid isn't a good fit with a particular coach and his/her biases and therefore gets bumped off the team, there's not much hope of earning your way back onto the team and it's best, if you want to continue to progress in competitive football, to move on.

This is true at all levels up to professional. You will not change the coach's mind. Find a coach that values what the player brings to the field.

Coaches are supposed to be teaching the game, but yes this proves my point. Most coaches here don't teach the game, only the way they played it.

[Anonymous]

I think it is rare for clubs to advance players internally (at least from B to A) at the older ages (maybe 1 at most probably based on need at a particular position). They seem to prefer the shiny new players from other Clubs. I think you almost have to switch clubs to advance.

I’m not sure how many players are actually bumped down but instead leave the club.

[Nova2Euro]

Anonymous wrote:

Nova2Euro wrote:Of course coaches have biases--usually biases towards certain systems of play and the types of players that best suit them. Which is exactly the point I was making: if your kid isn't a good fit with a particular coach and his/her biases and therefore gets bumped off the team, there's not much hope of earning your way back onto the team and it's best, if you want to continue to progress in competitive football, to move on.

This is true at all levels up to professional. You will not change the coach's mind. Find a coach that values what the player brings to the field.

Coaches are supposed to be teaching the game, but yes this proves my point. Most coaches here don't teach the game, only the way they played it.

Is it such a strange concept to you that some coaches work better with some players? It's the same with teachers, professors, bosses, everyone. I guess the difference is that you don't have as much control over your choice when it comes to teachers as you do with coaches. If a particular coach isn't working for your kid, count down the months and then move on.

[Anonymous]

Nova2Euro wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nova2Euro wrote:Of course coaches have biases--usually biases towards certain systems of play and the types of players that best suit them. Which is exactly the point I was making: if your kid isn't a good fit with a particular coach and his/her biases and therefore gets bumped off the team, there's not much hope of earning your way back onto the team and it's best, if you want to continue to progress in competitive football, to move on.

This is true at all levels up to professional. You will not change the coach's mind. Find a coach that values what the player brings to the field.

Coaches are supposed to be teaching the game, but yes this proves my point. Most coaches here don't teach the game, only the way they played it.

Is it such a strange concept to you that some coaches work better with some players? It's the same with teachers, professors, bosses, everyone. I guess the difference is that you don't have as much control over your choice when it comes to teachers as you do with coaches. If a particular coach isn't working for your kid, count down the months and then move on.

Not the pp but I have seen good soccer players demoted for not so good soccer players. The thing is the not so good soccer player fits the coach’s or club’s system. You see this a lot at big clubs that lock players in positions early- ie u10/11 you are locked in at defender and will only play that position. The demoted player is a good player but at the wrong club with the wrong coach and maybe the wrong position. You should always look for a new club if you are demoted or feel your kid does not fit the system or style of play. There are a lot of kids who do not fit one club but would be a great fit at another.

Also remember a lot of the parents telling you this coach or club is great is because the coach and club picked their kid. So always make your own evaluation and if you have misgivings move on down the road to the next club.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Only if they switch clubs. Player has now been identified as "b" level and stigmatized. It would be extremely rare for any upwards movement on more then an occasional basis.

. Yea would agree… Leaving is generally the only way to get an independent look. The coaches label a kid and will generally watch the new kids for outside clubs.

[Anonymous]

Nova2Euro wrote:A lot of this can be tied to the coach, too. A players whose qualities might not be a great fit for one coach might benefit from a fresh look by a new coach.

But realistically, by the time a player is 15 or 16, unless there's a massive physical change (and these do sometimes happen later), if a club has seen them for at least a year and there's not a coaching change, you need to decide whether you're happy with the lower-level team or whether it's time to move on. But if your kid really believes in him/herself, and you believe in them and want to keep progressing in football, then go somewhere else. For so many reasons, it's better to be on the top team in the club in a lower-level league.

Many, many boys don’t even start growing until age 15 (which is U16 with late Fall bdays). None in my family, including my two sons. They all grow 10 inches-foot in high school. And what sucks are how tight the rosters are by U16/17. You have to be exceptionally above the best players on the team to crack it because kids at your level or even a bit lower will not be cut to make room.

The late growth thing (not even necessarily related to birth month) is a huge obstacle.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Nova2Euro wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Nova2Euro wrote:Of course coaches have biases--usually biases towards certain systems of play and the types of players that best suit them. Which is exactly the point I was making: if your kid isn't a good fit with a particular coach and his/her biases and therefore gets bumped off the team, there's not much hope of earning your way back onto the team and it's best, if you want to continue to progress in competitive football, to move on.

This is true at all levels up to professional. You will not change the coach's mind. Find a coach that values what the player brings to the field.

Coaches are supposed to be teaching the game, but yes this proves my point. Most coaches here don't teach the game, only the way they played it.

Is it such a strange concept to you that some coaches work better with some players? It's the same with teachers, professors, bosses, everyone. I guess the difference is that you don't have as much control over your choice when it comes to teachers as you do with coaches. If a particular coach isn't working for your kid, count down the months and then move on.

Not the pp but I have seen good soccer players demoted for not so good soccer players. The thing is the not so good soccer player fits the coach’s or club’s system. You see this a lot at big clubs that lock players in positions early- ie u10/11 you are locked in at defender and will only play that position. The demoted player is a good player but at the wrong club with the wrong coach and maybe the wrong position. You should always look for a new club if you are demoted or feel your kid does not fit the system or style of play. There are a lot of kids who do not fit one club but would be a great fit at another.

Also remember a lot of the parents telling you this coach or club is great is because the coach and club picked their kid. So always make your own evaluation and if you have misgivings move on down the road to the next club.

For example, pulling in Kyle Beckerman instead of... anyone else.