The Wisconsin Study - valid analysis?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

Teachers going back are or will soon be vaccinated. That's all the science you need.

[Anonymous]

OP, your post is so confusing. Some random person comments on the Washiington Post and you think the whole study is a lie? Did you even click through to those links? If you had, you wuold see that, in fact, they confirm that transmission rates in Wisconsin schools is lower than the community. Some random person somehow either misinterprets data or just outright spreads misinformatioin and you believe it?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

You are never going to get the Open Schools Now Neanderthals to engage you in a discussion of studies or science. They just want talking points. Of course schools are not special places where you can eat in large groups indoors and breathe the same air impervious to the virus. But they don’t care. Vaccinating teachers is essential for teachers. But doesn’t help spread among kids. They SHOULD care if they have kids over 10. They should NOT send their high schoolers into this til their kids are vaccinated. Today’s NYT survey of pediatricians has the majority saying only K-5 should open. Biden is not pushing for high schools to open. But it’s true, none of the Open Schools parents give a hoot. They think the virus goes away if they ignore it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

You are never going to get the Open Schools Now Neanderthals to engage you in a discussion of studies or science. They just want talking points. Of course schools are not special places where you can eat in large groups indoors and breathe the same air impervious to the virus. But they don’t care. Vaccinating teachers is essential for teachers. But doesn’t help spread among kids. They SHOULD care if they have kids over 10. They should NOT send their high schoolers into this til their kids are vaccinated. Today’s NYT survey of pediatricians has the majority saying only K-5 should open. Biden is not pushing for high schools to open. But it’s true, none of the Open Schools parents give a hoot. They think the virus goes away if they ignore it.

Look at the links that OP cited. Even HS students had low transmission.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

You are never going to get the Open Schools Now Neanderthals to engage you in a discussion of studies or science. They just want talking points. Of course schools are not special places where you can eat in large groups indoors and breathe the same air impervious to the virus. But they don’t care. Vaccinating teachers is essential for teachers. But doesn’t help spread among kids. They SHOULD care if they have kids over 10. They should NOT send their high schoolers into this til their kids are vaccinated. Today’s NYT survey of pediatricians has the majority saying only K-5 should open. Biden is not pushing for high schools to open. But it’s true, none of the Open Schools parents give a hoot. They think the virus goes away if they ignore it.

Look at the links that OP cited. Even HS students had low transmission.

You mean the links that come from a flawed study of a handful of small-town schools in one geographical area?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

You are never going to get the Open Schools Now Neanderthals to engage you in a discussion of studies or science. They just want talking points. Of course schools are not special places where you can eat in large groups indoors and breathe the same air impervious to the virus. But they don’t care. Vaccinating teachers is essential for teachers. But doesn’t help spread among kids. They SHOULD care if they have kids over 10. They should NOT send their high schoolers into this til their kids are vaccinated. Today’s NYT survey of pediatricians has the majority saying only K-5 should open. Biden is not pushing for high schools to open. But it’s true, none of the Open Schools parents give a hoot. They think the virus goes away if they ignore it.

Look at the links that OP cited. Even HS students had low transmission.

You mean the links that come from a flawed study of a handful of small-town schools in one geographical area?

Umm, yes, those were the ones in the study.

But what were the flaws? The OP isn't clear and doesn't cite the quote.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

You are never going to get the Open Schools Now Neanderthals to engage you in a discussion of studies or science. They just want talking points. Of course schools are not special places where you can eat in large groups indoors and breathe the same air impervious to the virus. But they don’t care. Vaccinating teachers is essential for teachers. But doesn’t help spread among kids. They SHOULD care if they have kids over 10. They should NOT send their high schoolers into this til their kids are vaccinated. Today’s NYT survey of pediatricians has the majority saying only K-5 should open. Biden is not pushing for high schools to open. But it’s true, none of the Open Schools parents give a hoot. They think the virus goes away if they ignore it.

Oh yes, Open School Now Neanderthals like these:

https://aap-ca.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/02/CA-Pedi-Safe-Reopening-press-release-2_9-2.pdf (thousands of California pediatricians)
https://globalepidemics.org/2020/12/18/schools-and-the-path-to-zero-strategies-for-pandemic-resilience-in-the-face-of-high-community-spread/ (Harvard and Brown public health experts)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/11/12/three-feet-social-distancing-schools-coronavirus/
https://www.medpagetoday.com/blogs/vinay-prasad/90658
https://www.politico.com/news/magazine/2021/02/10/reopening-schools-has-become-a-bipartisan-issue-why-isnt-biden-pushing-harder-468475
https://www.rivm.nl/en/novel-coronavirus-covid-19/children-and-covid-19
https://www.cbs8.com/article/news/health/coronavirus/school-safety-reopen-san-diego-pediatrician-vaccine-teachers-students/509-d4a32d8b-d105-496c-b19a-057d52de7e14
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.01.26.21250065v1

All these doctors and public health experts who clearly know nothing about science.

Oh, and did you know the richest districts have the most reopened public schools?
https://www.mercurynews.com/2021/02/11/coronavirus-rich-kids-head-back-to-class-others-stay-home/

All those Neanderthal rich people...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

You are never going to get the Open Schools Now Neanderthals to engage you in a discussion of studies or science. They just want talking points. Of course schools are not special places where you can eat in large groups indoors and breathe the same air impervious to the virus. But they don’t care. Vaccinating teachers is essential for teachers. But doesn’t help spread among kids. They SHOULD care if they have kids over 10. They should NOT send their high schoolers into this til their kids are vaccinated. Today’s NYT survey of pediatricians has the majority saying only K-5 should open. Biden is not pushing for high schools to open. But it’s true, none of the Open Schools parents give a hoot. They think the virus goes away if they ignore it.

Look at the links that OP cited. Even HS students had low transmission.

You mean the links that come from a flawed study of a handful of small-town schools in one geographical area?

Are you proposing we do a study, say in FCPS? I'm in. Let's open schools up just like this Wisconsin district did, and see what happens.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:No one cares about your deep thoughts. Schools are finally
opening and they aren’t shutting down again.

+1

It’s hypocritical to say that “science” says it’s safe to open schools, then refuse to address the quality of the studies that the “science” relies on.

You are never going to get the Open Schools Now Neanderthals to engage you in a discussion of studies or science. They just want talking points. Of course schools are not special places where you can eat in large groups indoors and breathe the same air impervious to the virus. But they don’t care. Vaccinating teachers is essential for teachers. But doesn’t help spread among kids. They SHOULD care if they have kids over 10. They should NOT send their high schoolers into this til their kids are vaccinated. Today’s NYT survey of pediatricians has the majority saying only K-5 should open. Biden is not pushing for high schools to open. But it’s true, none of the Open Schools parents give a hoot. They think the virus goes away if they ignore it.

Look at the links that OP cited. Even HS students had low transmission.

You mean the links that come from a flawed study of a handful of small-town schools in one geographical area?

Are you proposing we do a study, say in FCPS? I'm in. Let's open schools up just like this Wisconsin district did, and see what happens.

I actually sent an email to someone in FCPS admin (I forget who now) suggesting this. Maybe we can even get money for high quality cloth masks contributed to our study like Wisconsin did.

[Anonymous]

How about a study of 90,000 staff and students across 11 school districts? Duke has already done this and published in Pediatrics. Stop believing random commenters on WaPo and pay attention to real medical scientists.

https://today.duke.edu/2021/01/duke-study-when-schools-take-covid-safety-measures-viral-transmissions-person-schooling-are?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Duke%20study%20on%20schools&utm_campaign=Weekly_2021-01-30

"The study included data from 11 of the partner school districts that were open for all nine weeks of the first quarter and agreed to track both COVID-19 case count and secondary transmission for research purposes. From these districts, which included over 90,000 students and staff attending in-person instruction, there were 773 cases acquired from the community. In contrast, contact tracing from the state health department identified only 32 infections that were acquired within schools through secondary transmission.

During the study timeframe, we saw significant community spread of COVID-19,” said DCRI pediatrician Dr. Danny Benjamin, co-chair of the ABC Science Collaborative. “If we’d seen the same rates of secondary transmission in the schools as we were seeing in the community, we would have expected between 800 and 900 secondary infections. However, we saw only 32. This indicates that it is possible for schools to safely remain open in communities with widespread community transmission.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How about a study of 90,000 staff and students across 11 school districts? Duke has already done this and published in Pediatrics. Stop believing random commenters on WaPo and pay attention to real medical scientists.

https://today.duke.edu/2021/01/duke-study-when-schools-take-covid-safety-measures-viral-transmissions-person-schooling-are?utm_source=newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_content=Duke%20study%20on%20schools&utm_campaign=Weekly_2021-01-30

"The study included data from 11 of the partner school districts that were open for all nine weeks of the first quarter and agreed to track both COVID-19 case count and secondary transmission for research purposes. From these districts, which included over 90,000 students and staff attending in-person instruction, there were 773 cases acquired from the community. In contrast, contact tracing from the state health department identified only 32 infections that were acquired within schools through secondary transmission.

During the study timeframe, we saw significant community spread of COVID-19,” said DCRI pediatrician Dr. Danny Benjamin, co-chair of the ABC Science Collaborative. “If we’d seen the same rates of secondary transmission in the schools as we were seeing in the community, we would have expected between 800 and 900 secondary infections. However, we saw only 32. This indicates that it is possible for schools to safely remain open in communities with widespread community transmission.”

There's clearly a single poster who, for whatever reason, decided to jump on last night and gather together whatever negative data on school reopenings they could find and blast it out there.

[Anonymous]

Clearly a disgruntled teacher.

[Anonymous]

OP, here.

Why does everyone assume a post is always an argument for or against school opening or closing? I wasn’t trying to build an evidenced based argument; in fact I wasn’t trying to build an argument at all. I was asking a question and reaching out to people who could better assess the quality of an “analysis” I encountered in the comments section of WaPo. Yeah, that is random, but I am not writing a research paper or trying to present an oral argument.

I created two threads based on this guy’s comments. Why did I feel the need to do that? Because people on this forum have been citing the “wisconsin study” and “cdc guidelines” as “supporting school opening” and this commenter’s analysis of the studies - which I admit I am too lazy undertake myself — made me feel a bit bamboozled by random DCUM posters who I had never pressed for details or explanation when they cited the “wisconsin study” or “the cdc report” as their “evidence.”

In short, I was admitting I am not a science person and examining and evaluating these studies with care would involve a lot of mental focus I need to dedicate to other projects so I was saying “Hey smart stem trained DCUM moms, is this guy’s analysis legitimate or flawed?”

I don’t know how to post a direct link to the guy’s comments but here is the link to the article he commented on. One of his posts brought up the CDC report and another the Wisconsin study:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/biden-schools-reopen/2021/02/11/3a63e3ee-6b2d-11eb-ba56-d7e2c8defa31_story.html

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, here.

Why does everyone assume a post is always an argument for or against school opening or closing? I wasn’t trying to build an evidenced based argument; in fact I wasn’t trying to build an argument at all. I was asking a question and reaching out to people who could better assess the quality of an “analysis” I encountered in the comments section of WaPo. Yeah, that is random, but I am not writing a research paper or trying to present an oral argument.

I created two threads based on this guy’s comments. Why did I feel the need to do that? Because people on this forum have been citing the “wisconsin study” and “cdc guidelines” as “supporting school opening” and this commenter’s analysis of the studies - which I admit I am too lazy undertake myself — made me feel a bit bamboozled by random DCUM posters who I had never pressed for details or explanation when they cited the “wisconsin study” or “the cdc report” as their “evidence.”

In short, I was admitting I am not a science person and examining and evaluating these studies with care would involve a lot of mental focus I need to dedicate to other projects so I was saying “Hey smart stem trained DCUM moms, is this guy’s analysis legitimate or flawed?”

I don’t know how to post a direct link to the guy’s comments but here is the link to the article he commented on. One of his posts brought up the CDC report and another the Wisconsin study:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/education/biden-schools-reopen/2021/02/11/3a63e3ee-6b2d-11eb-ba56-d7e2c8defa31_story.html

I'm not a science person either, but I could tell within seconds that the argument, with the links, made no sense whatsoever. I don't believe your intentions and believe you must be a teacher desperate to keep schools closed. This forum isn't helpful for that.

[Anonymous]

VARIANTS, people. Europe was forced to close most schools despite having been opened during most of the pandemic. Why would our crowded schools be an exception?