Parents of 5th and 6th graders ES students - FCPS - can you please ask your child what are the

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 3rd grader didn't know what a noun or verb was this spring.

FYI- they call them nouns and predicates now just to complicate things. I prefer verb since it goes with adverb. And since I have a dysgraphic child I can agree that most schools have atrocious reading and writing instruction.

Where have you seen curriculum that teaches nouns and predicates in that way?

There are nouns and verbs. Sentences are divided into a subject (which always has a noun or a pronoun, although that could be understood) and a predicate that includes a verb.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a pretty successful adult and I would have to google the 8 parts of speech. I don't have a job that would require that at all. I bet there are very few jobs that would require that. Why is that something you are worried about? I get wanting to make sure my kid can write well, but I would argue you can learn to write well without knowing exactly what each part is called.

Don't you think learning grammar (and that is pretty basic grammar) helps you to write well/better? I get that you don't know now, but I bet at one point in your life you learned it and incorporated that knowledge into your writing.

My experience as a high school teacher is that the kids coming from environments that emphasize grammar in elementary are the reluctant writers. They often have beautiful handwriting, but their sentences are short, because they're afraid to take a risk on words that they can't spell or sentence structures they don't remember how to use. The kids coming from public are much more fluent, their writing is better organized, and they have better voice. Then in middle school, they learn the parts of speech easily in the first year of foreign language, and editing becomes a focus in English. They enter high school as better writers.

Ok, so they ARE taught at some point in PS? Like, systematically and not just by reading/writing and "organically?" Is that FCPS by any chance?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What the f are the 8 parts of speech? I have a phd and write research papers for living.

Of course you learned it at some point. noun, verb, adjective, adverb, pronoun, preposition, conjunction and interjection.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My 3rd grader didn't know what a noun or verb was this spring.

FYI- they call them nouns and predicates now just to complicate things. I prefer verb since it goes with adverb. And since I have a dysgraphic child I can agree that most schools have atrocious reading and writing instruction.

Where have you seen curriculum that teaches nouns and predicates in that way?

There are nouns and verbs. Sentences are divided into a subject (which always has a noun or a pronoun, although that could be understood) and a predicate that includes a verb.

5th grade writing curriculum something from Lucy Calkins Writer’s Workshop as that is the larger curriculum. We had a nice long discussion about how that was not structured or sequential enough to support my child’s IEP. Calkins is a disaster, but it is rare to find something good for writing.

Read the Writing Revolution.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm a pretty successful adult and I would have to google the 8 parts of speech. I don't have a job that would require that at all. I bet there are very few jobs that would require that. Why is that something you are worried about? I get wanting to make sure my kid can write well, but I would argue you can learn to write well without knowing exactly what each part is called.

Don't you think learning grammar (and that is pretty basic grammar) helps you to write well/better? I get that you don't know now, but I bet at one point in your life you learned it and incorporated that knowledge into your writing.

My experience as a high school teacher is that the kids coming from environments that emphasize grammar in elementary are the reluctant writers. They often have beautiful handwriting, but their sentences are short, because they're afraid to take a risk on words that they can't spell or sentence structures they don't remember how to use. The kids coming from public are much more fluent, their writing is better organized, and they have better voice. Then in middle school, they learn the parts of speech easily in the first year of foreign language, and editing becomes a focus in English. They enter high school as better writers.

Ok, so they ARE taught at some point in PS? Like, systematically and not just by reading/writing and "organically?" Is that FCPS by any chance?

We live in MoCo, and I teach in DC, so I can't speak specifically to VA, but teaching it in middle school is pretty common. To me, as a teacher, it makes sense. We have a tendency to waste an enormous amount of time in the early grades teaching kids things that they'll get so easily if we wait. Grammar is one thing that we've actually moved in the correct direction.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the f are the 8 parts of speech? I have a phd and write research papers for living.

Of course you learned it at some point. noun, verb, adjective, adverb, pronoun, preposition, conjunction and interjection.

Or you watched Schoolhouse Rock

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:8 parts of speech or even what an adjective is?

Something in another thread came up and I am curious if not knowing that by the end of 4th grade is a student problem, a school problem or a county wide problem.

If you please could answer and age/grade of your child. I would prefer to get answers only from students who go to public schools and not have extracurricular help (tutors, AoPS classes in LA, CTY, etc). AAP students answers are appreciated as well.

Thanks!

8 the end of 7th grade, I asked my kid this very question. Not only could DC not (a straight A-student, btw), none of DC's friends could, either.

Shameful.

[Anonymous]

AAP rising 5th grader. He named 7 and defined them (well enough). He missed interjection, which I did, too. But he knew what it was when I told him he’d missed it.

[Anonymous]

Why does it matter knowing the names of the parts of speech if the kid can compose sentences and paragraphs well according to grade level? Just knowing that “boat” is a noun and “jump” is a verb isn’t going to make them be able to write well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why does it matter knowing the names of the parts of speech if the kid can compose sentences and paragraphs well according to grade level? Just knowing that “boat” is a noun and “jump” is a verb isn’t going to make them be able to write well.

I understand that and agree with you. The issue is that there are grammar rules that build on that knowledge. And no, I don't think most adults even remember what are the 8 parts of speech, but at one point they are important to learn some rules and ultimately, to write better and more clear.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Why does it matter knowing the names of the parts of speech if the kid can compose sentences and paragraphs well according to grade level? Just knowing that “boat” is a noun and “jump” is a verb isn’t going to make them be able to write well.

It matters if they want to take German in high school because they have to know what words (the nouns) to capitalize.

It matters when their English teacher asks them "Which adjective in line 5 of the poem best describes how the author is feeling about the flower?"

It matters when they're learning about FANBOYS and how to combine sentences.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What the f are the 8 parts of speech? I have a phd and write research papers for living.

Of course you learned it at some point. noun, verb, adjective, adverb, pronoun, preposition, conjunction and interjection.

Or you watched Schoolhouse Rock

That's how I recalled it now. I listed off the Schoolhouse Rock videos I remembered. I'm sure I learned what each element was and how to use it, but I dont recall a teacher listing them all as Eight Parts of Speech.

[Anonymous]

My rising 5th grader (not AAP...am I allowed to confess to that on DCUM?) does not know them. And has not been taught at school. Time for me to pull out some MadLibs.

[Anonymous]

Thank you to the person that listed them! I'm a writer and was trying to figure out what the eight were ... But I can tell you my daughter going into 6th grade couldn't list them either.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why does it matter knowing the names of the parts of speech if the kid can compose sentences and paragraphs well according to grade level? Just knowing that “boat” is a noun and “jump” is a verb isn’t going to make them be able to write well.

I understand that and agree with you. The issue is that there are grammar rules that build on that knowledge. And no, I don't think most adults even remember what are the 8 parts of speech, but at one point they are important to learn some rules and ultimately, to write better and more clear.

I agree with the first poster as well that knowing the names of the parts of speech is unimportant in the long run. However, I agree with the second poster that it is important to know what each part of speech does in both the short and long runs. There is a significant difference between a noun and a verb, and knowing what each is helps a person speak/write more clearly and accurately. I also am a big proponent of sentence diagraming, which is no longer taught. Good writers understand how to use the parts of speech effectively, and part of that can be seen through a sentence diagram. It is a good learning tool.