Do Colleges Adjust High School GPA based on Prior Perfornance of Graduates of that High School?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My high school had 5 kids attend Ivies, one attend Umich, One to Lehigh, and one to USC over an 11 year period. The rest were non selective schools. I doubt colleges were familiar with my high school.

Did you ever consider the opposite? That they are very familiar with it and that is what informed those decisions?

Yuck. -NP

[Anonymous]

Something I don't think anyone has mentioned yet, Caltech's app, at least before this fall, has long included the following question:

Have you taken math exams, such as the AMC 12 or AIME? If so, please list your scores and their corresponding dates.

This may be how they get around the need for SAT/ACT. This question already self-selects for top privates/publics whose students participate in math competitions, who both have the ability and are sufficiently coached (as in, a math coach) to do well.

(I know a current Caltech student from your basic competitive suburban high school who would have had such scores.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Something I don't think anyone has mentioned yet, Caltech's app, at least before this fall, has long included the following question:

Have you taken math exams, such as the AMC 12 or AIME? If so, please list your scores and their corresponding dates.

This may be how they get around the need for SAT/ACT. This question already self-selects for top privates/publics whose students participate in math competitions, who both have the ability and are sufficiently coached (as in, a math coach) to do well.

(I know a current Caltech student from your basic competitive suburban high school who would have had such scores.)

Sorry, I thought I was on the Caltech thread. Mea culpa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:For the top high schools—public magnets and prep schools—the colleges are familiar with how previous students from those schools have done, and that influences how they view new applicants.

Colleges absolutely know my high school and they have confidence that graduates from my school do well at their institutions. That’s one of the reasons why so many kids from my high school go to top colleges.

That’s nice for you.

I was just answering the question. Some high schools are absolutely known.

Well no sh*t. But there are tens of thousands of high schools in this country. If we rely only on “popular high schools” the top colleges will be 100% white and Asian. Which is the opposite effect of removing the sat!

DP here - it is not just the "popular" colleges. Admissions offices work hard to know as many HS in their territories as possible. You can call them and ask them if they know yours. You can do this, and they will not mind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My high school had 5 kids attend Ivies, one attend Umich, One to Lehigh, and one to USC over an 11 year period. The rest were non selective schools. I doubt colleges were familiar with my high school.

Did you ever consider the opposite? That they are very familiar with it and that is what informed those decisions?

Yuck. -NP

Explain?

[Anonymous]

" if it's clearly thought out, maybe a return to the early 1990s or something."

While the top 25 schools might be interested in this type of SAT, the rest aren't. That's how we got where we are today.

Most colleges and most test takers don't want or need the ability to differentiate between the fractions of the top 1%.

Even the top 25 schools completely understand that the top 0.1% do no better in their classes (because of their own grade inflation) than the next 0.9%.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:" if it's clearly thought out, maybe a return to the early 1990s or something."

While the top 25 schools might be interested in this type of SAT, the rest aren't. That's how we got where we are today.

Most colleges and most test takers don't want or need the ability to differentiate between the fractions of the top 1%.

Even the top 25 schools completely understand that the top 0.1% do no better in their classes (because of their own grade inflation) than the next 0.9%.

Of course the top schools don’t want the tests to differentiate. If the tests did, they wouldn’t be able to discriminate against certain races!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:With possible exceptions like the state flagship, which would have a lot of data, most selective colleges do not have sufficient sample sizes from a particular high school. The performance of one or two or five students per year from a high school, in a variety of majors, should in no way reflect what a new high school senior's potential is. There are far too many individual factors that would play a role, college classes/professors, who the student's high school teachers were and what their grading was like and the billion or so external reasons why some very able students might do poorly or somewhat less-able students might have top grades - this all varies widely.

I'm not saying colleges don't try to make such comparisons - I wouldn't know. I just think that it would be ridiculous and not a statistically sound approach.

To the extent that testing fades away, however, I could see this happening. Thus the attractiveness of a standardized test....

Most grocery stores have incredible amount of data on a shopper (from reward cards). They know your every move. If most selective colleges don’t keep data, that would be shocking.

[Anonymous]

Admissions doesn't care or know what happens after you get to campus. And regional admissions rep is a dead-end job people do for a year or two at most, so even if they had an idea in their head, the new rep won't. Only thing they may take into account is yield from your kid's high school, but even then, a stretch. People really overthink admissions. It's very bottom line driven, they aren't having windy esoteric debates about each freaking teen. Most of them aren't even reading the essays our kids write.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Admissions doesn't care or know what happens after you get to campus. And regional admissions rep is a dead-end job people do for a year or two at most, so even if they had an idea in their head, the new rep won't. Only thing they may take into account is yield from your kid's high school, but even then, a stretch. People really overthink admissions. It's very bottom line driven, they aren't having windy esoteric debates about each freaking teen. Most of them aren't even reading the essays our kids write.

Nearly everything you type in your post is exactly wrong.

- They do care what happens to you after you get to campus (it looks bad for them if they admit an inappropriate student)
- There are many dedicated career admissions professionals as all departments are headed by them. I have never met one - even a career-starter - who did not take their job very seriously. Just look at the college websites, you can’t see them and who they are.
- Yes they are about yield but much more, such as the quality and preparedness from your HS.
- Yes they are exactly having debates about bubble applicants and are pained when kids they like get voted down. You know they have “committees”, right? You can even see them on YouTube.,
- Yes they are reading your essays. Every single one.

You are so wrong I am tempted to think this was a sarcastic troll post. But if it isn’t, then you, PP, should never post about — or possibly even speak about - college admissions ever again, as you have no freaking idea.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Admissions doesn't care or know what happens after you get to campus. And regional admissions rep is a dead-end job people do for a year or two at most, so even if they had an idea in their head, the new rep won't. Only thing they may take into account is yield from your kid's high school, but even then, a stretch. People really overthink admissions. It's very bottom line driven, they aren't having windy esoteric debates about each freaking teen. Most of them aren't even reading the essays our kids write.

Nearly everything you type in your post is exactly wrong.

- They do care what happens to you after you get to campus (it looks bad for them if they admit an inappropriate student)
- There are many dedicated career admissions professionals as all departments are headed by them. I have never met one - even a career-starter - who did not take their job very seriously. Just look at the college websites, you can’t see them and who they are.
- Yes they are about yield but much more, such as the quality and preparedness from your HS.
- Yes they are exactly having debates about bubble applicants and are pained when kids they like get voted down. You know they have “committees”, right? You can even see them on YouTube.,
- Yes they are reading your essays. Every single one.

You are so wrong I am tempted to think this was a sarcastic troll post. But if it isn’t, then you, PP, should never post about — or possibly even speak about - college admissions ever again, as you have no freaking idea.

My wife works in admission office in charge of admission. She rarely reads applicants essay. So many things to do with so little time. Many of them didn't take their job seriously.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Admissions doesn't care or know what happens after you get to campus. And regional admissions rep is a dead-end job people do for a year or two at most, so even if they had an idea in their head, the new rep won't. Only thing they may take into account is yield from your kid's high school, but even then, a stretch. People really overthink admissions. It's very bottom line driven, they aren't having windy esoteric debates about each freaking teen. Most of them aren't even reading the essays our kids write.

Nearly everything you type in your post is exactly wrong.

- They do care what happens to you after you get to campus (it looks bad for them if they admit an inappropriate student)
- There are many dedicated career admissions professionals as all departments are headed by them. I have never met one - even a career-starter - who did not take their job very seriously. Just look at the college websites, you can’t see them and who they are.
- Yes they are about yield but much more, such as the quality and preparedness from your HS.
- Yes they are exactly having debates about bubble applicants and are pained when kids they like get voted down. You know they have “committees”, right? You can even see them on YouTube.,
- Yes they are reading your essays. Every single one.

You are so wrong I am tempted to think this was a sarcastic troll post. But if it isn’t, then you, PP, should never post about — or possibly even speak about - college admissions ever again, as you have no freaking idea.

My wife works in admission office in charge of admission. She rarely reads applicants essay. So many things to do with so little time. Many of them didn't take their job seriously.

Well then your wife is the exception not the rule. And she should quit if she can’t do a good job. Your post is the saddest I have read here in a long time, and it also implies that the thousands of other hard working and underpaid admissions officers are as inept as she is.

They aren’t. Don’t take my word for it, go meet some.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:With possible exceptions like the state flagship, which would have a lot of data, most selective colleges do not have sufficient sample sizes from a particular high school.

This is false.

Anonymous wrote:The performance of one or two or five students per year from a high school, in a variety of majors, should in no way reflect what a new high school senior's potential is.

And yet it is, because that's how data works.

Anonymous wrote:
I'm not saying colleges don't try to make such comparisons - I wouldn't know.

You have demonstrated that quite well.

What do you propose would be a statistically-significant sample size from a high school class of 400? How many students per year enrolled at the college x looking back how many yrs?

Over a number of years? It's easy. And remember this is not making the decision in a vacuum - it is a single data point assisting the decision process. Any amount of data is valuable and mine-able. Doesn't need to be only the state flagship. You don't think Yale does this? Or Williams? Or CMU? Or Colgate? This is how they assess college preparedness levels from different HS. It's a MUCH better predictor than a single test score.

I'll reverse the question on you: how little is NOT enough?

NP. I say, GIGO, for Garbage In, Garbage Out. You, my friend, know no statistics.

[Anonymous]

Well given the local experience with college admissions for multiple private schools, it is clear that you don't get a bump for coming from a known hs over someone from Idaho for example. Refer to the baffling rejections that multiple incredible candidates receive every year from this area. Similar stories in every major city where top hs students used to be able to pick their colleges.

Our local schools do a great job preparing kids for college, but if you expect to have a leg up in admissions, you're going to be disappointed.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Well given the local experience with college admissions for multiple private schools, it is clear that you don't get a bump for coming from a known hs over someone from Idaho for example. Refer to the baffling rejections that multiple incredible candidates receive every year from this area. Similar stories in every major city where top hs students used to be able to pick their colleges.

Our local schools do a great job preparing kids for college, but if you expect to have a leg up in admissions, you're going to be disappointed.

What? I can’t tell if you are being serious or not.