What should I look for in a Pre-K?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We arent there yet but what preschool is 100% outdoor play-----?!!!!?

OP here. Well preschool is only 3-4 hours a day. This one really is 100% outdoors except for in rain (but maybe still in light rain?). They have a large outdoor space with stations and playground. It reminded me of the Free Forest School classes we'd done. While they practice counting through play and letters in play, there's no formal instruction.

Oh, nm. I was hoping for a daycare situation that was 100% outside (hyperbolic, I know) but seriously it would be magical.

We need FT care since we work FT, although in a year or so we could stagger schedules but I dont think my husband would go for that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have no idea how to judge which pre-K is objectively best for a particular child.

But here is a non-pedagogical point to consider: having a child attend preschool at their eventual elementary school is very convenient logistically and allows the child to begin making long-term friends earlier. Plus, you often benefit from the broader resources and better facilities that a larger school has (gym, playgrounds, kitchen). And you get to meet parent friends earlier.

OP here. Elementary school starts at Kindergarten so that's not an option.

If you're looking at private schools, private elementaries often have preschool programs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We arent there yet but what preschool is 100% outdoor play-----?!!!!?

OP here. Well preschool is only 3-4 hours a day. This one really is 100% outdoors except for in rain (but maybe still in light rain?). They have a large outdoor space with stations and playground. It reminded me of the Free Forest School classes we'd done. While they practice counting through play and letters in play, there's no formal instruction.

Oh, nm. I was hoping for a daycare situation that was 100% outside (hyperbolic, I know) but seriously it would be magical.

We need FT care since we work FT, although in a year or so we could stagger schedules but I dont think my husband would go for that.

OP here. Plenty of daycares and inhome daycares run shuttles to preschools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We arent there yet but what preschool is 100% outdoor play-----?!!!!?

OP here. Well preschool is only 3-4 hours a day. This one really is 100% outdoors except for in rain (but maybe still in light rain?). They have a large outdoor space with stations and playground. It reminded me of the Free Forest School classes we'd done. While they practice counting through play and letters in play, there's no formal instruction.

Oh, nm. I was hoping for a daycare situation that was 100% outside (hyperbolic, I know) but seriously it would be magical.

We need FT care since we work FT, although in a year or so we could stagger schedules but I dont think my husband would go for that.

pp there are some that come close to this, depending on where you are located. Eastern Ridge school in Vienna is full time and has this philosophy: https://www.easternridgeschool.org/. Or Frog Pond in Alexandria http://frogpondkids.org/

There are some in MD too.

[Anonymous]

I found this really helpful OP, though she admittedly comes from a particular perspective but it aligns with what I wanted and she is very research based so I found it helpful. She has a checklist you can download (you have to give your email), but it is very detailed. Not like the checklists online.

https://yourparentingmojo.com/choosingpreschool/#

[Anonymous]

Oh woops I didn't mean to double post, I thought my first didn't go through.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've been touring a lot of Pre-Ks for my 3.5 year old for next fall. They vary drastically. Some have arts, some teach in Spanish, some are 100% outdoor play, some focus mostly on reading and math (??!). Some have little desks just like an elementary school classroom and some have no desks and tables only for art. I'm having trouble figuring out what my child needs. I've read a lot that early academics are not beneficial. My DD already reads a bit (sounds out words, knows letters/numbers) but I don't want to push it at all and don't see that as a positive. She's very smart, but a bit of a people pleaser. We'd like her to gain confidence and enjoy playing with kids her own age. She's with a nanny now and her 2 younger siblings.

Is anyone up on early child development and can tell me what I should be looking for? I'm specifically not looking for a daycare because we have the nanny and she'll drive her (although I do wish they started at 8am so I could drop her off on my way to work, but every single one starts at 9 am).

So you are looking for a half day nursery school? I AM in early childhood education, have an MA and direct a preschool program. (full day, so not what you want) Here's the thing: you want a play based program where the express goals for the school are social/emotional development (which is what you said you want - you want her to gain confidence and enjoy playing with children her age). Your instincts are right, go with those.

To do that, children have the opportunity to play with blocks, playdough, manipulatives (legos, bristle blocks, magnet tiles, trains, cars, pegs and peg boards, puzzles, etc), dress up/dramatic play, have lots of outside time, dance, paint, color, marker, glue, etc. etc. What you really want to see is that the children have these opportunities to play freely, make their own choices, and not have to "switch to a new center" every 20 minutes or whatever arbitrary time. Children should have long periods of time to engage with the materials sothey can follow their train of thought and really play (and get more social pratice) deeply. Imagine being interrupted every 30 minutes? You'd get nothing done.

So, too, with a child. When children are forced to move from center to center during the morning (couched as "time for you to leave blocks and go to art so others can have a chance at blocks and you (have to) do art" it simply means that the child and his 2 friends DIDN'T get to do these things:
-- build that huge thing with blocks,
-- try to roll the balls down the ramp they built,
--discover it won't do exactly what they want,
--so make the changes they think you should,
--try the balls again,
--discover more tweaks need to be made,
--and do those and then, success! the balls rolled the way they want
(can you all SEE the math, language, cognitive and social skills inherent with this play?)

And, yes, it means each child won't make an art thing every day, won't be in blocks every day, but over the course of days and weeks and months, most/all children will move between various areas of the room and do those.

and trying to "teach" letters, numbers, etc isn't developmentally appropriate but of course, we write their names on their papers, ask them how to spell them, say each word as we write them, and eventually when they are ready, all children want to be able to write their own names - which starts with just their first letter and then expands to some of their letters, then all of their letters but spread all over the page, and then finally to all letters, in the right order going from left to right (or right to left for a few months then going left to right) All of that happens between 3 and 5 1/2 years old, the preschool years, before they go to kindergarten. And nore pre-literacy is done through reading, singing songs, rhyming songs and nursery rhymes, math is done when setting the table for snack, simply using blocks, puzzles, etc. And so on and so forth.

so look for a truly play based program
and if they have little tables for each child and it looks like a mini elementary school, is is NOT PLAY BASED no matter what it says. You want a program where children are treated like preschoolers they are, there is plenty of time to be elementary school-ers when they are that.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you want to foster Independence, consider a Montessori program. I think it would be especially good for an obedient people pleaser, because kids in Montessori get to choose what they "work" on. They are not told what to do. So she could learn to follow what she wants vs. what others want for her.

We found a small, one-class Monetessori and with a strong community and a wonderful director, and could not be happier with our choice for our 2 kids.

ECE again here - no, I think for a child who doesn't know how to socialize with other children, you want NOT a Montessori because there is so much "independent" work being done - you want a program where kids are playing together, tumbling together, arguing over who gets to be the princess and the king, figuring it out, doing it again, building with blcoks, getting them knocked over by accident, realizing it'snot the end of the world, building again... builds social skills, resilience, how to play (give and take, standing up for yourself, etc) with other children, etc.

[Anonymous]

Wait, OP, you want a full day program so nanny doesn't need to travel? Well, you can do that, too - (I'm the ECE with the long email.. there are plenty of full day program that do the playbased I said - but there are plenty that do NOT.

At our full day program our children are outside twice a day for an hour (or more) each day. No kidding. Today they went outside, in the snow and mud and had a glorious time. They will go outside again this afternoon. they don't go outside when it's sleeting or raining really hard, or when there is a blizzard, or when the wind is so strong it will blow them off their feet, or when it's dangerous (wind chill for too cold or heat index for too hot). But basically they go outside every darn day, twice a day.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I found this really helpful OP, though she admittedly comes from a particular perspective but it aligns with what I wanted and she is very research based so I found it helpful. She has a checklist you can download (you have to give your email), but it is very detailed. Not like the checklists online.

https://yourparentingmojo.com/choosingpreschool/#

OH, I LOVE THIS (ECE here - hmmm... perhaps I want to put this on our website?) Yes to this!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've been touring a lot of Pre-Ks for my 3.5 year old for next fall. They vary drastically. Some have arts, some teach in Spanish, some are 100% outdoor play, some focus mostly on reading and math (??!). Some have little desks just like an elementary school classroom and some have no desks and tables only for art. I'm having trouble figuring out what my child needs. I've read a lot that early academics are not beneficial. My DD already reads a bit (sounds out words, knows letters/numbers) but I don't want to push it at all and don't see that as a positive. She's very smart, but a bit of a people pleaser. We'd like her to gain confidence and enjoy playing with kids her own age. She's with a nanny now and her 2 younger siblings.

Is anyone up on early child development and can tell me what I should be looking for? I'm specifically not looking for a daycare because we have the nanny and she'll drive her (although I do wish they started at 8am so I could drop her off on my way to work, but every single one starts at 9 am).

So you are looking for a half day nursery school? I AM in early childhood education, have an MA and direct a preschool program. (full day, so not what you want) Here's the thing: you want a play based program where the express goals for the school are social/emotional development (which is what you said you want - you want her to gain confidence and enjoy playing with children her age). Your instincts are right, go with those.

To do that, children have the opportunity to play with blocks, playdough, manipulatives (legos, bristle blocks, magnet tiles, trains, cars, pegs and peg boards, puzzles, etc), dress up/dramatic play, have lots of outside time, dance, paint, color, marker, glue, etc. etc. What you really want to see is that the children have these opportunities to play freely, make their own choices, and not have to "switch to a new center" every 20 minutes or whatever arbitrary time. Children should have long periods of time to engage with the materials sothey can follow their train of thought and really play (and get more social pratice) deeply. Imagine being interrupted every 30 minutes? You'd get nothing done.

So, too, with a child. When children are forced to move from center to center during the morning (couched as "time for you to leave blocks and go to art so others can have a chance at blocks and you (have to) do art" it simply means that the child and his 2 friends DIDN'T get to do these things:
-- build that huge thing with blocks,
-- try to roll the balls down the ramp they built,
--discover it won't do exactly what they want,
--so make the changes they think you should,
--try the balls again,
--discover more tweaks need to be made,
--and do those and then, success! the balls rolled the way they want
(can you all SEE the math, language, cognitive and social skills inherent with this play?)

And, yes, it means each child won't make an art thing every day, won't be in blocks every day, but over the course of days and weeks and months, most/all children will move between various areas of the room and do those.

and trying to "teach" letters, numbers, etc isn't developmentally appropriate but of course, we write their names on their papers, ask them how to spell them, say each word as we write them, and eventually when they are ready, all children want to be able to write their own names - which starts with just their first letter and then expands to some of their letters, then all of their letters but spread all over the page, and then finally to all letters, in the right order going from left to right (or right to left for a few months then going left to right) All of that happens between 3 and 5 1/2 years old, the preschool years, before they go to kindergarten. And nore pre-literacy is done through reading, singing songs, rhyming songs and nursery rhymes, math is done when setting the table for snack, simply using blocks, puzzles, etc. And so on and so forth.

so look for a truly play based program
and if they have little tables for each child and it looks like a mini elementary school, is is NOT PLAY BASED no matter what it says. You want a program where children are treated like preschoolers they are, there is plenty of time to be elementary school-ers when they are that.

Not the op but just wanted to thank you for taking the time to post this. It really helped things “click” for me about why the unstructured nature is so important - not just the play, but that they really get to be engrossed in the play and not moved between centers. I’m going to ask this question of the play based program we are considering. Thank you again!

[Anonymous]

I’m the pp who posted the your parenting mojo link and the one that just posted thanking you for posting! So we are on the same wavelength. Your parenting mojo would probably be a great resource for your parents who want to understand a little bit more about how you all approach the classroom. It’s really great. Her podcast is her main mode of info.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wait, OP, you want a full day program so nanny doesn't need to travel? Well, you can do that, too - (I'm the ECE with the long email.. there are plenty of full day program that do the playbased I said - but there are plenty that do NOT.

At our full day program our children are outside twice a day for an hour (or more) each day. No kidding. Today they went outside, in the snow and mud and had a glorious time. They will go outside again this afternoon. they don't go outside when it's sleeting or raining really hard, or when there is a blizzard, or when the wind is so strong it will blow them off their feet, or when it's dangerous (wind chill for too cold or heat index for too hot). But basically they go outside every darn day, twice a day.

OP here. No I don't want a full day. Nanny has no issue transporting her to Pre-K (in fact, nanny thinks it's best that my DD goes to Pre-K). I just meant that I'd like to drop her off, but it doesn't seem possible with the short Pre-K schedules.

DD is a bit too "clean" so outdoor time would be great. She really doesn't like being outdoors or getting messy and would prefer puzzles or reading indoors.

ECE thanks so much for your help! I liked reading your suggestions in the long post!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:As a parent with older kids these are some other the things I would look for (if doing it over).

Safe, loving, respectful appropriate language. [I like concepts of responsive classroom - but no "Red Yellow Green" behavior management.]

Teach how to hold a pencil / crayon the correct way. Practice cutting and other functional items to build hand strength.

Lots of play for sharing - and story telling.

Things that are OT related - dressing up, cutting, tracing, balance and developing core strength for sitting.

Trying things and failing - and having fun - and laughing.

The STEM and Math and language will all come later

+1

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
I adore my DD, but I really want to build her confidence. She easily gets bullied and she does exactly what we tell her to do always (which is amazing for us as parents, but I would like to raise her to be more independent too). Instead of playing with other children, she loves playing with adults.

There are about 15 Pre-Ks in a 5 minute radius and it's hard to tour them all and figure it out.

Since you know this is a priority, I would screen for it. Basically, your questions are about their social and emotional learning program/philosophy.

What you're looking for is not confidence-building via overpraise; it's teachers who intentionally provide training and social scaffolding to enable a kid to become more comfortable and fluent speaking up for him/herself.

We got this from an early childhood education center that used the Conscious Discipline curriculum. It has some really specific techniques that teachers use to help kids who may otherwise be bowled over by other kids. It was fantastic for our kid. I'm sure there are others like it that are also great.