How important is foreign language in middle school?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My 7th grade kid chose an instrument vs. foreign language but a recent thread indicated that several years of foreign language are important for university admissions. He doesn't want to start in 8th grade because he feels he will be the only 8th grader in a classroom of 7th graders just starting foreign language classes. If he waits till 9th grade to start - is it detrimental? Good student - advanced classes for now (but I can see dropping back to regular if it gets to intense down the road).

Does your MS only offer 1 elective? I thought most had 2. In fact my MS, would never have a kid choose between music and language. Kids choose either a language or reading and then a second elective that is neither of those...music, tech, etc

[Anonymous]

Math/Sci magnet kids at Clemente and Tacoma have only one elective.

[Anonymous]

OP here. Her other elective was chemistry. It was a tough decision choosing between instrument and FL. She does speak my husbands home language and will hopefully earn seal of biliteracy but it isn't clear if this can replace a FL requirement or it is a "nice to have".

[Anonymous]

OP - I wouldn't sweat this. If the language classes in 8th or HS turn out to be cake-walks, then who cares!? Esp if your child is taking a bunch of other high-level classes, it might be a nice break for her to have something she can phone in. And you should call MCPS to find out if her home-language can count for the Seal of Biliteracy. Good luck, and don't let all the FREAKING OUT ALL THE TIME parents on this forum get you down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We are completely destroying our kids ffs.

Agree.
My DD is in French 3 in 8th grade. Starting French in 6th was completely her choice. She got A’s in 1&2 and currently has a B in 3 - so she clearly isn’t struggling. She has told us repeatedly that she hates it and will not continue in HS. Again, 100% her choice. I will not push it based on what the top universities want. She’s old enough to make her own decisions.

Foreign Language becomes harder in level 3, and French is not an easy language to learn. She can start another language in HS or even take American Sign Language if some graduation requirement needs to be fulfilled, though I think that having 3 HS credit courses in MS has already fulfilled the requirement.

If you are not aiming for top universities then it is ok. Anyways, if a student gets B's in French 3, they should not be under undue stress.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that he will be more mortified being with the group that starts foreign language in 9th grade.

But maybe that would be a good thing as it would motivate him to not drop from advanced to regular classes later.

YMMV, our experience is in Montgomery County public schools.

This. DS started Spanish in 8th grade. He actually wishes he had started in 7th because his Spanish 2 classmates in 9th grade are either terrible language learners or just very unmotivated. So glad we didn’t have him wait to take first year Spanish in 9th.

I did not think of this before.

When my DC did Spanish 1a/b in 6th grade, the majority of students were high achieving and hard working. Being in the hardest language classes from the very beginning, resulted in a very academically oriented and serious students as cohort. My kid loved that and Spanish is one of his favorite subjects.

Another thing is that for the most rigorous classes, they are assigned the best teachers who know the content very well and are excellent in pedagogy too. Most of these teachers also appreciate the quality of students that they get in their classes and are always very understanding and accommodating.

The new policy in MCPS allows the student to drop all the grades that were earned in MS from their transcripts. I think that allows students to take these classes earlier without any downside.

No can I say No again. No "for the most rigorous classes they are assigned the best teachers" not true. As is the rest of your analysis of the language classes MCPS. My kids took honors language classes MCPS from middle through high school. Spanish & Chinese (not Asian family) and many of the teachers where flakes and awful. One in high school had zero idea who was in her class, could not use or did not want to use Edline. Would call students homes to give grades. UGH. One was a male who was too busy checking out the young ladies, and one was just clueless. Did we have some good teachers absolutely, but most were horrible.

As for grades counting towards high school gpa. That has not changed. MCPS website:Students who meet these criteria, by earning an A, B, C, or D, will receive high school credit and
will have these grades count towards their MCPS high school grade point average (GPA), with the
exception of Advanced English 8 (see below). If your child is not satisfied with the grade earned
in a HS credit class, he or she may retake the course in Grade 7, Grade 8 or high school, if it is
available.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. Her other elective was chemistry. It was a tough decision choosing between instrument and FL. She does speak my husbands home language and will hopefully earn seal of biliteracy but it isn't clear if this can replace a FL requirement or it is a "nice to have".

Even if your DC wants to change the elective now, is it even possible this far into the school year? Which school system is this? (And chemistry as MS elective - this is not MCPS, is it?)

If your DC is into humanities/languages, starting FL earlier is helpful. If DC looks at FL as just as something to fulfill graduation requirements, it is better to start in 8th or 9th, since I think - it has been a while since I had to look into this - generally speaking colleges would like to see four years of FL, and *some* colleges want them to be taken in HS. For example: https://www.udel.edu/apply/undergraduate-admissions/requirements/

[Anonymous]

Learn Chinese instead of Spanish. China is the current superpower of the world. We will be working for them and so any one who can speak Chinese will have more job opportunities.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I did not think of this before.

When my DC did Spanish 1a/b in 6th grade, the majority of students were high achieving and hard working. Being in the hardest language classes from the very beginning, resulted in a very academically oriented and serious students as cohort. My kid loved that and Spanish is one of his favorite subjects.

Another thing is that for the most rigorous classes, they are assigned the best teachers who know the content very well and are excellent in pedagogy too. Most of these teachers also appreciate the quality of students that they get in their classes and are always very understanding and accommodating.

The new policy in MCPS allows the student to drop all the grades that were earned in MS from their transcripts. I think that allows students to take these classes earlier without any downside.

No can I say No again. No "for the most rigorous classes they are assigned the best teachers" not true. As is the rest of your analysis of the language classes MCPS. My kids took honors language classes MCPS from middle through high school. Spanish & Chinese (not Asian family) and many of the teachers where flakes and awful. One in high school had zero idea who was in her class, could not use or did not want to use Edline. Would call students homes to give grades. UGH. One was a male who was too busy checking out the young ladies, and one was just clueless. Did we have some good teachers absolutely, but most were horrible.

As for grades counting towards high school gpa. That has not changed. MCPS website:Students who meet these criteria, by earning an A, B, C, or D, will receive high school credit and will have these grades count towards their MCPS high school grade point average (GPA), with the exception of Advanced English 8 (see below). If your child is not satisfied with the grade earned in a HS credit class, he or she may retake the course in Grade 7, Grade 8 or high school, if it is available.

Oh no. What MS and HS was this? Our experience has been very good, except a Spanish 1a/b teacher. I was told by an ex-administrator (who was himself terrible but thankfully is now in Baltimore County) that MCPS has a chronic shortage of good Math, FL and STEM teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My guess is that he will be more mortified being with the group that starts foreign language in 9th grade.

But maybe that would be a good thing as it would motivate him to not drop from advanced to regular classes later.

YMMV, our experience is in Montgomery County public schools.

This. DS started Spanish in 8th grade. He actually wishes he had started in 7th because his Spanish 2 classmates in 9th grade are either terrible language learners or just very unmotivated. So glad we didn’t have him wait to take first year Spanish in 9th.

I did not think of this before.

When my DC did Spanish 1a/b in 6th grade, the majority of students were high achieving and hard working. Being in the hardest language classes from the very beginning, resulted in a very academically oriented and serious students as cohort. My kid loved that and Spanish is one of his favorite subjects.

Another thing is that for the most rigorous classes, they are assigned the best teachers who know the content very well and are excellent in pedagogy too. Most of these teachers also appreciate the quality of students that they get in their classes and are always very understanding and accommodating.

The new policy in MCPS allows the student to drop all the grades that were earned in MS from their transcripts. I think that allows students to take these classes earlier without any downside.

No can I say No again. No "for the most rigorous classes they are assigned the best teachers" not true. As is the rest of your analysis of the language classes MCPS. My kids took honors language classes MCPS from middle through high school. Spanish & Chinese (not Asian family) and many of the teachers where flakes and awful. One in high school had zero idea who was in her class, could not use or did not want to use Edline. Would call students homes to give grades. UGH. One was a male who was too busy checking out the young ladies, and one was just clueless. Did we have some good teachers absolutely, but most were horrible.

As for grades counting towards high school gpa. That has not changed. MCPS website:Students who meet these criteria, by earning an A, B, C, or D, will receive high school credit and
will have these grades count towards their MCPS high school grade point average (GPA), with the
exception of Advanced English 8 (see below). If your child is not satisfied with the grade earned
in a HS credit class, he or she may retake the course in Grade 7, Grade 8 or high school, if it is
available.

No, the grades will still go on the transcript, but will be excluded from the GPA by default. This is the new regulation: https://www.montgomeryschoolsmd.org/departments/policy/pdf/ikcra.pdf

GPA and WGPA Computations
1. In order to receive credit for high school courses completed while in middle school,
middle school students must meet the same requirements as high school students and earn a final
grade of A, B, C, or D.

a) For students who entered Grade 6 prior to the 2018-2019 school year, the final
grade and credit for high school courses successfully
completed in middle school are reported on the high school transcript and included in the
calculation of the student’s cumulative GPA.

b) For students who enter Grade 6 during or after the 2018-2019 school year, the final
grade and credit earned for high school courses successfully completed while in middle
school will be reported on the high school transcript, but will not be calculated into
the cumulative GPA unless requested by the parent/guardian or the student if 18
years old or married (eligible student). Students/parents/guardians will be notified
annually of procedures r to include such courses in their cumulative GPA.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Learn Chinese instead of Spanish. China is the current superpower of the world. We will be working for them and so any one who can speak Chinese will have more job opportunities.

Chinese is way harder than Spanish. It is hard for kids to start in MS/HS without some out of school exposure. If your kid is really into/good at languages, go for it, but it’s hard and especially hard to fulfill a 4 year language requirement at it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Learn Chinese instead of Spanish. China is the current superpower of the world. We will be working for them and so any one who can speak Chinese will have more job opportunities.

Chinese is way harder than Spanish. It is hard for kids to start in MS/HS without some out of school exposure. If your kid is really into/good at languages, go for it, but it’s hard and especially hard to fulfill a 4 year language requirement at it.

This.
I'm sure PP babbling about 'learning Chinese' rather than 'easy' Spanish, can't speak either.
DC has a friend whose parents are Chinese, speak Chinese at home and send the kid to a Sunday school. The child can understand and speak Chinese but is having significant trouble reading and writing (obviously, one class per week is not enough to master the hard language).