AA little league assessments

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another question slightly related: Our son did Single A last year (league age 7). Most of his teammates were also league age 7 (1st grade). The coach decided to keep their son back one more year in Single A as an 8 year old, and convinced most of the team to do so as well. Isn't that some type of anomaly? The league guidelines state that Single A is primarily for 6-7 year olds, and that any 8 year olds or advanced 5 year olds need to contact the player agent. Many of them are ready for AA; I think they're just trying to build a "super-team" of 8 year olds by red-shirting them.

I have kids that play with WSLL. I assume each league has their own age guidelines. I have a first grader who is playing single A. As I understand it, in second grade half play A and half play AA. It can go either way.

My oldest just had his first eval (AAA) which I understand is really to even out the teams. I have no idea how he did (and I don’t really care assuming they take him for AAA!). We couldn’t watch. I understand evals start at AA.

My 8 year old just had his first AAA tryout too with WSLL! Good luck to your kids this season!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Long-time Little League parent (and board member, and coach's spouse) here. I'm sorry that your first experience with assessments felt so chaotic. It's a lot of kids in a small space for a short amount of time -- our league has gone through a couple different iterations of the process and despite the best efforts of all the volunteers, it's still just something to be endured rather than enjoyed.

DO NOT worry that your child won't get picked for a team -- there will definitely be a place for him/her. The process is so that kids can be ordered for the coaches' draft, which allows for teams to be balanced with a range of abilities. This make the regular season much more fun than if there's one superstar team crushing all the others. It also allows coaches to learn about players other than the ones they've had on previous teams.

DO NOT worry that your player fumbled a catch/missed a throw/fouled off a ball. There is no expectation that kids are playing anywhere close to their best in the middle of winter -- that's what the whole "development" aspect of a good LL team is for. And the assessments aren't pass/fail. Coaches are looking for body position, range of motion, mechanics, etc. Not just "this kid caught the ball and this kid didn't."

Things will be much easier (and much more fun!) once everyone can get out on the field this spring!

Thanks for your spouse's and your volunteer work with LL!

Out of pure curiosity, can you describe how a draft works, particularly for AAA and Majors? I imagine a smoky room with lots of wheeling and dealing

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another question slightly related: Our son did Single A last year (league age 7). Most of his teammates were also league age 7 (1st grade). The coach decided to keep their son back one more year in Single A as an 8 year old, and convinced most of the team to do so as well. Isn't that some type of anomaly? The league guidelines state that Single A is primarily for 6-7 year olds, and that any 8 year olds or advanced 5 year olds need to contact the player agent. Many of them are ready for AA; I think they're just trying to build a "super-team" of 8 year olds by red-shirting them.

Ugh, some parents are just the worst. Our league had to establish very strict rules about kids playing in their age group. It had been grade based but so many parents were red shirting that we had to go back to strict age. We also ended the practice of playing up with exceptions only granted by a unanimous board vote upon recommendation of the player development coordinator, and then ONLY for majors teams. Maybe if we were a powerhouse program sending kids to LLWS every year it would be different, but that's not any program around here.

This is what is happening in our league. People cannot just let their kids play with their peers. Always trying to game it to make Janie/Johnnie the star. It's incredibly irritating. If you're special, go to travel.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Long-time Little League parent (and board member, and coach's spouse) here. I'm sorry that your first experience with assessments felt so chaotic. It's a lot of kids in a small space for a short amount of time -- our league has gone through a couple different iterations of the process and despite the best efforts of all the volunteers, it's still just something to be endured rather than enjoyed.

DO NOT worry that your child won't get picked for a team -- there will definitely be a place for him/her. The process is so that kids can be ordered for the coaches' draft, which allows for teams to be balanced with a range of abilities. This make the regular season much more fun than if there's one superstar team crushing all the others. It also allows coaches to learn about players other than the ones they've had on previous teams.

DO NOT worry that your player fumbled a catch/missed a throw/fouled off a ball. There is no expectation that kids are playing anywhere close to their best in the middle of winter -- that's what the whole "development" aspect of a good LL team is for. And the assessments aren't pass/fail. Coaches are looking for body position, range of motion, mechanics, etc. Not just "this kid caught the ball and this kid didn't."

Things will be much easier (and much more fun!) once everyone can get out on the field this spring!

Thanks for your spouse's and your volunteer work with LL!

Out of pure curiosity, can you describe how a draft works, particularly for AAA and Majors? I imagine a smoky room with lots of wheeling and dealing

From the stories I’ve heard, the Majors draft generally goes something like this:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pWgyy_rlmag

[Anonymous]

I always find the questions associated with LL seem inane. No skin in the game as my DS has graduated to HS ball and never had exposure to LL. In witnessing various levels in DC over the years, I am a little wary of the newfound popularity of LL in Montgomery county and it's affect on player development.

The no stealing thing with higher age groups is definitely lame, and so are the short mound to plate distances with mixed age groups. I must admit, I must admit however that Williamsport is way cool. Particularly the HOF.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We had assessments for our 8 year old yesterday.. have to say, it was rather chaotic. He waited in line for 45 minutes, and only got three balls thrown to him before moving on to the batting cage.

From what we saw, he did okay batting but not so much with the limited fielding assessment. Are these "assessments" purely to even out the teams, or are some kids cut? Just want to manage expectations in the event the latter happens. TIA!

That sounds pretty typical.

They fan tell the kids who are naturally adept fairly quickly. They can tell which kids are very developmental very quickly. Those are the ones they are trying to balance between teams.

The middling and average good kids are not really an issue.

They are trying to find the kids on the extremes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:LL parent again, responding to the red-shirting question. Properly managed, the assessment process should also prevent deliberate attempts to game the system. Assessed players are given an overall score, and the Powers That Be decide where the cutoffs for each level are. So if players between 750 and 800 are deemed AAA material, then a player who scored an 789 will be placed in the AAA draft pool, even if they were originally registered for t-ball.

Thanks. However, how would that work for the "redshirting" Single A team that didn't go through the assessment process? What if most of them belong in AA or beyond?

Single A teams are usually neighborhood teams.

There is no real reason to create a superteam at the A level where there are still kids picking daisies in the outfield or learning how not to climb the dugout fence...

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In our league, assessments are based on age rather than level. So all players league age 8+ must be assessed, regardless of the level at which they want to play. (Players younger than 8 who want to play up would also opt in to the assessment process.)

I thought ours was like this as well; at least the league web page indicates so. However, I know that this one team plans on having a predominately 8 year old Single A team without going through the assessment. Not sure how or why; I can see a handful of kids, but the whole team??

Leagues don't assess single A teams. There is no draft at that level.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In our league, assessments are based on age rather than level. So all players league age 8+ must be assessed, regardless of the level at which they want to play. (Players younger than 8 who want to play up would also opt in to the assessment process.)

I thought ours was like this as well; at least the league web page indicates so. However, I know that this one team plans on having a predominately 8 year old Single A team without going through the assessment. Not sure how or why; I can see a handful of kids, but the whole team??

Hmm, I wonder if you are talking about the team my DS will be on. He turns 8 this spring, and is maybe in 4% for height. We decided to keep him on the same Single A team this year so as to not be overshadowed by bigger players.

NP - that makes sense. I suspect most of the kids on the "super team" don't fit that profile, though.

You are talking about single A. They aren't even pitching yet, and hitting is almost non existent.

Don't get worked up about a non issue.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:In our league, assessments are based on age rather than level. So all players league age 8+ must be assessed, regardless of the level at which they want to play. (Players younger than 8 who want to play up would also opt in to the assessment process.)

I thought ours was like this as well; at least the league web page indicates so. However, I know that this one team plans on having a predominately 8 year old Single A team without going through the assessment. Not sure how or why; I can see a handful of kids, but the whole team??

Leagues don't assess single A teams. There is no draft at that level.

Yes, that's the point being made.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another question slightly related: Our son did Single A last year (league age 7). Most of his teammates were also league age 7 (1st grade). The coach decided to keep their son back one more year in Single A as an 8 year old, and convinced most of the team to do so as well. Isn't that some type of anomaly? The league guidelines state that Single A is primarily for 6-7 year olds, and that any 8 year olds or advanced 5 year olds need to contact the player agent. Many of them are ready for AA; I think they're just trying to build a "super-team" of 8 year olds by red-shirting them.

I have kids that play with WSLL. I assume each league has their own age guidelines. I have a first grader who is playing single A. As I understand it, in second grade half play A and half play AA. It can go either way.

My oldest just had his first eval (AAA) which I understand is really to even out the teams. I have no idea how he did (and I don’t really care assuming they take him for AAA!). We couldn’t watch. I understand evals start at AA.

My 8 year old just had his first AAA tryout too with WSLL! Good luck to your kids this season!

Thanks for the nice note. I hope your kid was drafted! Mine wasn’t drafted for AAA ugh (even though he’s that age group). I feel kind of bad for him but he played t-ball in K and then didn’t play baseball again until 4th grade so that what happens... oh well.

[Anonymous]

Different format for team creation because Pony League rules. But, may be of some help.

1. Coaches kids obviously end up on their team. The league folks need to assess the kids, and in some cases that can be debatable so the league will typically have someone or ones at the mini-tryout check out those kids. That is not to say that coaches are sandbagging. If a league divides based on 2 year ages or 2 grades (pretty typical) you would typically expect that the older kids will be the pitchers. That may or may not be a coach kid.

2. The team managers will try and put an equal number of "pitchers" on each team. Depending on if there are any issues with assessment, there may be some effort to review past year's participation.

3. The team managers will try and grade out every player. We used 1-5 and graded hitting/fielding/throwing/pitching. As you can imagine -- it was really just the kids on either end that generated any sort of focus. The managers and draft supervisor(s) (helper to judge who can pitch/hit well) would then attempt to group sort every kid. It really is not that hard.

4. After dividing up the pitching and making sure kids are hopefully properly assessed, then you start dividing up the rest of the kids. Non-pitching coach kids will obviously get placed with their parents first when you get to that basic level of player. We divided up by half levels. So, for example, a coach kid who was group judged to be a 3.3 level kid would get assigned/picked "first" when the parents team's turn came for that level of player. Usually 3.0-3.5 kids. Often, but not always, coach kids were good players. It was certainly common for two parents of younger age kids to coach together, so those kids often were not rated highly when compared to the next year older kids. No big deal as long as everyone basically agreed and where there was any potential issue the "expert(s)" would decide.

By going with the group think division the idea was to avoid claims of sandbagging, and it still allowed for coaches to pick particularly good friends when their level was reached. A coach could say -- Billy M is my kid's best friend. Billy M is a kid with a 2.8 rating. When we get to the 2.5-3.0 kids Billy M could be reserved and "picked" first at that level. Other than those situations, kids were basically assigned so teams were as equal as we could make them.

Attempts to try and load a team up with friends were also discouraged. It is fine to get a friend or two on a team, but the point is to make the teams roughly competitive so everyone has a good time. And, meeting some new kids and making some new friend is okay. It will not work out perfectly of course. And, that is fine. Kids will improve at different rates. In my limited experience, the teams that do the best typically are those where the younger age kids improve and really contribute at the plate and in the field. Practice can make a big difference here.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another question slightly related: Our son did Single A last year (league age 7). Most of his teammates were also league age 7 (1st grade). The coach decided to keep their son back one more year in Single A as an 8 year old, and convinced most of the team to do so as well. Isn't that some type of anomaly? The league guidelines state that Single A is primarily for 6-7 year olds, and that any 8 year olds or advanced 5 year olds need to contact the player agent. Many of them are ready for AA; I think they're just trying to build a "super-team" of 8 year olds by red-shirting them.

I have kids that play with WSLL. I assume each league has their own age guidelines. I have a first grader who is playing single A. As I understand it, in second grade half play A and half play AA. It can go either way.

My oldest just had his first eval (AAA) which I understand is really to even out the teams. I have no idea how he did (and I don’t really care assuming they take him for AAA!). We couldn’t watch. I understand evals start at AA.

My 8 year old just had his first AAA tryout too with WSLL! Good luck to your kids this season!

Thanks for the nice note. I hope your kid was drafted! Mine wasn’t drafted for AAA ugh (even though he’s that age group). I feel kind of bad for him but he played t-ball in K and then didn’t play baseball again until 4th grade so that what happens... oh well.

That happens, but it can often end being a good thing as they get more time to develop their baseline skills and get to play the role of leader on the lower level team.

I assume you are one of the WSLL people who posted earlier.

In WSLL, they draft majors first. Once kids make majors, they stay on that team until they age out. Last year, they had a lot of majors kids aging out (I think my kid's team had 7/12 aging out) along with several military kids who moved away.

So the returning majors kids already have their spots out of the 12 kid rosters. I am just guessing, but based off the 6th and 7th graders who aged out, there were probably around 40 to 50 available spots between National and American league this season. I think there were around 90 kids total on the try out roster for those spots, so around half +/- of the 10 to 12 year olds trying out for majors did not make it. My kid did not, so he and those other kids drop into the AAA draft. There were some very strong players in the 10 to 11 year old range who did not get drafted (happens every year). Every year, there are a handful of 12 year olds who do not get drafted into majors. They automatically get a spot on a AAA team. I believe the 11 year olds who do not get drafted for majors automatically get a spot on a AAA team too.

So of the 120 spots for AAA, probably around 1/4 or more were already allocated to 11 and 12 year olds not drafted to majors, and another chunk will go to the 9 and 10 year olds not drafted to majors who played AAA last season

So that leaves half or a little more than half of the remaining spots for those kids who are either returning from AAA (were not strong enough to try out for majors) or moving up from AA.

The AAA tryout group is always huge, far bigger than their are spots for. A big portion of those kids will end up on AA teams.

Your kid might have been great or had a decent try out, but especially if he was on the younger end or coming out of A or AA, then the odds were against him getting drafter his first go around.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another question slightly related: Our son did Single A last year (league age 7). Most of his teammates were also league age 7 (1st grade). The coach decided to keep their son back one more year in Single A as an 8 year old, and convinced most of the team to do so as well. Isn't that some type of anomaly? The league guidelines state that Single A is primarily for 6-7 year olds, and that any 8 year olds or advanced 5 year olds need to contact the player agent. Many of them are ready for AA; I think they're just trying to build a "super-team" of 8 year olds by red-shirting them.

I have kids that play with WSLL. I assume each league has their own age guidelines. I have a first grader who is playing single A. As I understand it, in second grade half play A and half play AA. It can go either way.

My oldest just had his first eval (AAA) which I understand is really to even out the teams. I have no idea how he did (and I don’t really care assuming they take him for AAA!). We couldn’t watch. I understand evals start at AA.

My 8 year old just had his first AAA tryout too with WSLL! Good luck to your kids this season!

Thanks for the nice note. I hope your kid was drafted! Mine wasn’t drafted for AAA ugh (even though he’s that age group). I feel kind of bad for him but he played t-ball in K and then didn’t play baseball again until 4th grade so that what happens... oh well.

That happens, but it can often end being a good thing as they get more time to develop their baseline skills and get to play the role of leader on the lower level team.

I assume you are one of the WSLL people who posted earlier.

In WSLL, they draft majors first. Once kids make majors, they stay on that team until they age out. Last year, they had a lot of majors kids aging out (I think my kid's team had 7/12 aging out) along with several military kids who moved away.

So the returning majors kids already have their spots out of the 12 kid rosters. I am just guessing, but based off the 6th and 7th graders who aged out, there were probably around 40 to 50 available spots between National and American league this season. I think there were around 90 kids total on the try out roster for those spots, so around half +/- of the 10 to 12 year olds trying out for majors did not make it. My kid did not, so he and those other kids drop into the AAA draft. There were some very strong players in the 10 to 11 year old range who did not get drafted (happens every year). Every year, there are a handful of 12 year olds who do not get drafted into majors. They automatically get a spot on a AAA team. I believe the 11 year olds who do not get drafted for majors automatically get a spot on a AAA team too.

So of the 120 spots for AAA, probably around 1/4 or more were already allocated to 11 and 12 year olds not drafted to majors, and another chunk will go to the 9 and 10 year olds not drafted to majors who played AAA last season

So that leaves half or a little more than half of the remaining spots for those kids who are either returning from AAA (were not strong enough to try out for majors) or moving up from AA.

The AAA tryout group is always huge, far bigger than their are spots for. A big portion of those kids will end up on AA teams.

Your kid might have been great or had a decent try out, but especially if he was on the younger end or coming out of A or AA, then the odds were against him getting drafter his first go around.

Also, I am not a coach and have never been part of the draft. These are just my observations after having gone through this process as a parent for 6 years.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Another question slightly related: Our son did Single A last year (league age 7). Most of his teammates were also league age 7 (1st grade). The coach decided to keep their son back one more year in Single A as an 8 year old, and convinced most of the team to do so as well. Isn't that some type of anomaly? The league guidelines state that Single A is primarily for 6-7 year olds, and that any 8 year olds or advanced 5 year olds need to contact the player agent. Many of them are ready for AA; I think they're just trying to build a "super-team" of 8 year olds by red-shirting them.

I have kids that play with WSLL. I assume each league has their own age guidelines. I have a first grader who is playing single A. As I understand it, in second grade half play A and half play AA. It can go either way.

My oldest just had his first eval (AAA) which I understand is really to even out the teams. I have no idea how he did (and I don’t really care assuming they take him for AAA!). We couldn’t watch. I understand evals start at AA.

My 8 year old just had his first AAA tryout too with WSLL! Good luck to your kids this season!

Thanks for the nice note. I hope your kid was drafted! Mine wasn’t drafted for AAA ugh (even though he’s that age group). I feel kind of bad for him but he played t-ball in K and then didn’t play baseball again until 4th grade so that what happens... oh well.

That happens, but it can often end being a good thing as they get more time to develop their baseline skills and get to play the role of leader on the lower level team.

I assume you are one of the WSLL people who posted earlier.

In WSLL, they draft majors first. Once kids make majors, they stay on that team until they age out. Last year, they had a lot of majors kids aging out (I think my kid's team had 7/12 aging out) along with several military kids who moved away.

So the returning majors kids already have their spots out of the 12 kid rosters. I am just guessing, but based off the 6th and 7th graders who aged out, there were probably around 40 to 50 available spots between National and American league this season. I think there were around 90 kids total on the try out roster for those spots, so around half +/- of the 10 to 12 year olds trying out for majors did not make it. My kid did not, so he and those other kids drop into the AAA draft. There were some very strong players in the 10 to 11 year old range who did not get drafted (happens every year). Every year, there are a handful of 12 year olds who do not get drafted into majors. They automatically get a spot on a AAA team. I believe the 11 year olds who do not get drafted for majors automatically get a spot on a AAA team too.

So of the 120 spots for AAA, probably around 1/4 or more were already allocated to 11 and 12 year olds not drafted to majors, and another chunk will go to the 9 and 10 year olds not drafted to majors who played AAA last season

So that leaves half or a little more than half of the remaining spots for those kids who are either returning from AAA (were not strong enough to try out for majors) or moving up from AA.

The AAA tryout group is always huge, far bigger than their are spots for. A big portion of those kids will end up on AA teams.

Your kid might have been great or had a decent try out, but especially if he was on the younger end or coming out of A or AA, then the odds were against him getting drafter his first go around.

Also, I am not a coach and have never been part of the draft. These are just my observations after having gone through this process as a parent for 6 years.

Thank you and thanks, 14:11. That was very insightful. So it seems there could be age-appropriate kids who never make Majors?

My kid was drafted into AAA- he is 8 and tall but when we’ve seen AAA kids, they all seem so big and strong. Intimidating!