Phonological Processing Disorder - any experience?

[Anonymous]

OP here. Thanks for the feedback. I will get a referral for a private neuropsych evaluation.

I have a question, it looks like some of you put your kids into private. Have you found it better for this issue? We looked at private schools (not SN) in first grade but their STEM offerings seemed so much weaker than the public school. As DS is very good in math and this is a source of confidence to him (and his current school is very good at challenging him in math), we decided against it, but now we're wondering if we should just suck it up and deal with the weaker STEM in exchange for the better support for reading/writing. (To be fair, we weren't looking at SN schools, though.)

Also do you know why schools don't like using the term dyslexia?

[Anonymous]

OP, I am also wondering why you do not think your child is dyslexic? What you describe sounds absolutely classic.

If I were your, I would look for someone who specializes in dyslexia to do a neuropsych or at least psycho-educational testing. In the meantime, you can also call ASDEC. They have highly trained academic therapists, who are expensive, but will teach your child the right way.

Your question... why don't public schools say dyslexia... the DSM doesn't say dyslexia either. They say "Specific Learning Disorder" and then you can parse it. I think it is much more problematic that the standard to remediate dyslexia is very low.

I am FCPS and even with a robust IEP, the expectation is that your instruction will be multi-sensory. The instruction my good friend's son gets is an absolute waste of time. He has a private tutor - times a week who does all the remediation. The school basically has agreed not to get in the way. In other ways, the school is very strong ... in STEM like you say. But they have no clue how to properly remediate language-based learning differences.

I think your choices are a school that specializes in kids with language based LDs, like Oawood, Siena, Lab, or to supplement either school with an academic therapist/tutor who specializes in dyslexia. Re: mainstream private or public, private *might* be more flexible about letting your tutor come into the school and substitute the language arts instruction -- publics won't allow that -- but I think you are less likely to get any targeted help.

[Anonymous]

15:45 here. what i meant is that public schools do not have to adhere to what experts consider "gold standard." they only have to teach with a multi-sensory approach. Even if they do everything they promise, many children will need much more

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Also do you know why schools don't like using the term dyslexia?

They don't like it because there is a clear and evidence based way to help kids with dyslexia (O-G based reading / writing) that they would then have to provide. They don't have people with the proper training or enough time to provide the kind of support and remediation necessary for a kid with dyslexia. So as long as they say it's something else, they can say they're dealing with the problem.

[Anonymous]

We kept my DC in public because of the math and science. Those are his strengths. It was also important for him be around his local peers. It was easier to supplement the reading/writing than it would have been to supplement the math and science.

We supplemented what he was getting from his IEP with a reading tutor 2-3 days a week and supplemented more at home (with guidance from his reading teacher). He received Wilson both in school and with his teacher in ES- he completed Wilson level II at the end of 6th grade. In MS he took Language! (7th) and Rewards (8th). He has profound dyslexia, dysgraphia and ADHD. He was in FCPS, dyslexia was not used as a term until he was in MS and the county made a change and started naming it. He graduatedfrom HS last year and was able to take many math and science APs. He is currently a freshman in college with a declared major in math and trying to figure out a double major (physics and ecology/biology are the current front runners). He receives most of the same accommodation in college as he did in HS (electronic/audio books, teacher notes, extra time on test with a scribe/reader or technology that does it, priority class scheduling, a calculator,).

DC has double or triple dyslexia (depending on how someone defines it- there is still contention within the community). We were able to bring his phoneme awareness up to Low Average and decoding up to Low Average, his RAN remains in the 1st percentile (there really isn’t a viable program to combat it yet). His comprehension, vocabulary, and background knowledge was always excellent. We utilized audio books (or read to him) at his cognitive level to keep up his vocabulary and increase his understanding of more complicated characters and plot structures. We also scribed for him until he was able to be profieicnt enough on his wor dprediction software (he was not fully out of scribingat home until mid-junior year). He is an outlier in the depth,complexity and severity of his dyslexia and dysgraphia- somewhat of a worst case scenario. HOwever, by also concentrating on his strength as well as his weaknesses, he was able to use his strengths to overcome his weaknesses to a point where technology works well for him. For example, our goal for spelling was to get to a point where spell check would recognize it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We kept my DC in public because of the math and science. Those are his strengths. It was also important for him be around his local peers. It was easier to supplement the reading/writing than it would have been to supplement the math and science.

We supplemented what he was getting from his IEP with a reading tutor 2-3 days a week and supplemented more at home (with guidance from his reading teacher). He received Wilson both in school and with his teacher in ES- he completed Wilson level II at the end of 6th grade. In MS he took Language! (7th) and Rewards (8th). He has profound dyslexia, dysgraphia and ADHD. He was in FCPS, dyslexia was not used as a term until he was in MS and the county made a change and started naming it. He graduatedfrom HS last year and was able to take many math and science APs. He is currently a freshman in college with a declared major in math and trying to figure out a double major (physics and ecology/biology are the current front runners). He receives most of the same accommodation in college as he did in HS (electronic/audio books, teacher notes, extra time on test with a scribe/reader or technology that does it, priority class scheduling, a calculator,).

DC has double or triple dyslexia (depending on how someone defines it- there is still contention within the community). We were able to bring his phoneme awareness up to Low Average and decoding up to Low Average, his RAN remains in the 1st percentile (there really isn’t a viable program to combat it yet). His comprehension, vocabulary, and background knowledge was always excellent. We utilized audio books (or read to him) at his cognitive level to keep up his vocabulary and increase his understanding of more complicated characters and plot structures. We also scribed for him until he was able to be profieicnt enough on his wor dprediction software (he was not fully out of scribingat home until mid-junior year). He is an outlier in the depth,complexity and severity of his dyslexia and dysgraphia- somewhat of a worst case scenario. HOwever, by also concentrating on his strength as well as his weaknesses, he was able to use his strengths to overcome his weaknesses to a point where technology works well for him. For example, our goal for spelling was to get to a point where spell check would recognize it.

NP here. Thank you for sharing this! My child is quite similar, except for the math and science part. (Medium level attention executive functioning issues. Not major barriers.) We have yet to find specific strengths - he's 13 - to leverage against his triple deficit LDs. Very high verbal comprehension and emotional intelligence/social skills. He's a natural performer and improviser, but has zero interest in being on stage. He is consistently inconsistent. Even the experts at his LD school aren't quite sure where he goes from here. Same for the private evaluations and public school psychologist.

Do you mind sharing where you child went to HS and college? Any other advice on specialists or tools would be great. We've been narrating and scribing for years. He's just starting with speech-to-text for writing, but it's tough to get more than 3 sentences out of him. He's pretty good with audio content. But everything else is exhausting for him and for us.

FWIW, I'm hyperlexic, fast reader and typer. He knows I get frustrated and that I'm not the best tutor. I'm grasping at straws for anything that will help him feel confident and independent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Also do you know why schools don't like using the term dyslexia?

They don't like it because there is a clear and evidence based way to help kids with dyslexia (O-G based reading / writing) that they would then have to provide. They don't have people with the proper training or enough time to provide the kind of support and remediation necessary for a kid with dyslexia. So as long as they say it's something else, they can say they're dealing with the problem.

You parents should get together one day and have your own screaming protest in front of the school administrative building. We give tons of money each year for the school system to educate all of the children appropriately. This needs to be fixed!

[Anonymous]

I don’t want to hijack this thread but I’m wondering if phonological processing disorder is the same as phonological disorder. My son is now in 8th but was diagnosed with phonological disorder in preschool by an SLP. He did years of speech therapy. We suspected dyslexia when he was in 1st-2nd grade. He couldn’t sound out words and was a very poor speller (still is). School said he didn’t have dyslexia. Later he had a private neuropsych that diagnosed dysgraphia but not dyslexia. We have always assumed he didn’t have dyslexia as a result. But this post has me wondering.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DD is 8 and has this exact same issue. Her teachers at school insist she isn’t dyslexic bc she is on grade level in make ways except decoding, phonemic processing and spelling. We went to children’s for neuropsychological testing and the tester said she is a clear cut case of dyslexia.

What you are describing is DYSLEXIA to a T. The schools refuse to use the name for whatever reason.

We took the children’s report and advocated for an IEP and DD qualified.

Even her own teacher voted against the IEP bc she is technically on grade level in reading.

There are many forms of dyslexia. You are doing your child a disservice by not getting a fulsome private evaluation by someone who has no prejudices or motives unlike the schools.

I feel like I could have written this post. We are struggling with the same. It's really killing me. Our otherwise helpful FCPS school is pushing back hard because she's on grade level, but it's clear that phonological/phonemic awareness is a huge component of her challenges (the other being attention). The neuropsych wasn't willing to name the disorder, only to point it out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DS has been going through a series of evaluations and tests for a few years now for something that seems dyslexia-like but isn't exactly dyslexia (or at least isn't what is classically considered dyslexia). At our most recent IEP meeting, the school raised the possibility of a phonological processing disorder and recommended services for that.

Out of all the various language-related issues I've encountered so far (and it's been a few because of the way my DS presents), this feels like it's getting closer: if you ask him, for instance, to break a word down into its component parts, he can't. If you ask him to pull a letter out of a word and say the remainder, he can't do it. ("Take the word 'tree' and remove the 'r' -- what word sound is left?"). He is a terrible speller. Mostly he can't seem to hear or individuate individual letter sounds.

What I've seen online about this is mostly associated with speech, though. DS doesn't have speech problems, but struggles enormously with reading and writing. Does anybody have a child here with this diagnosis? Did getting support for phonological processing disorder help with reading and writing issues, not only speech?

It doesn't feel off, but when I've tried to read more about this online, I am finding all the resources associated with speech therapy, but DS's issues are not speech (everybody agrees his speech is fine). So, I would love to learn more about this in the written word context.

TIA.

Phonological processing, more frequently called phonemic awareness, is the key weakness for the vast majority of kids with the dyslexia diagnosis. I'm curious why the diagnostician is saying your child doesn't have dyslexia. Is this a school based psychologist making the comment, because generally dyslexia isn't a term that is used by school staff, because it doesn't align with the way kids are classified under IDEA.

I think you're probably googling and getting information on an Phonological Disorder, which is a different condition that impacts speech, but often overlaps with difficulties with phonemic awareness.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I don’t want to hijack this thread but I’m wondering if phonological processing disorder is the same as phonological disorder. My son is now in 8th but was diagnosed with phonological disorder in preschool by an SLP. He did years of speech therapy. We suspected dyslexia when he was in 1st-2nd grade. He couldn’t sound out words and was a very poor speller (still is). School said he didn’t have dyslexia. Later he had a private neuropsych that diagnosed dysgraphia but not dyslexia. We have always assumed he didn’t have dyslexia as a result. But this post has me wondering.

Its possible that your child would have been diagnosed with dyslexia if he had the neuropsych when he was younger, before he bootstrapped himself into learning to read well enough that it didn't pop up in the testing. I've come to think of dyslexia as a brain type, but one that has variations between people, rather than a set of fixed weaknesses. I am dyslexic and I am a speed reader, but I was very late to read and didn't learn to spell well enough to be understood until my 30's. But I have the same core weaknesses and core strengths as many dyslexics. You might read one of the books on dyselxia (I like the Dyslexia Empowerment Plan) to see if there are suggestions that might help your kid thrive. One of my favorites that I use with my dyslexic kid is always, always, building on strengths rather than hyperfocusing on improving the weaknesses. Yes, we have to do tutoring. But tutoring is never allowed to get in the way of sports, strange as that sounds, because sport is my child's source of pride and joy. If his joy was theater or computer coding or drawing we'd focus there.