Rowhouse Neighbor with Bed Bugs - Can we Improve Exclusion on Party Wall?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sorry to bring this up, but if insects are finding ways to get through your party, you may also have a big code issue in terms of fire safety. I'd call a building inspector and get it checked.

OP - OK, this is where I get to show my total ignorance of construction. There is quite a bit online, and a bit in this thread, about the risk of bed bugs moving between construction where buildings or units touch.

In older rowhouses (think 1880-1900), where there is a thick brick wall and foundation (or maybe it is a couple of walls that abut), would you under ordinary circumstances not suspect a problem? If not, maybe I can feel optimistic, do my own treatment, and expect resolution.

If it points to some kind of building repair issue I can have someone check, what am I looking for?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry to bring this up, but if insects are finding ways to get through your party, you may also have a big code issue in terms of fire safety. I'd call a building inspector and get it checked.

OP - OK, this is where I get to show my total ignorance of construction. There is quite a bit online, and a bit in this thread, about the risk of bed bugs moving between construction where buildings or units touch.

In older rowhouses (think 1880-1900), where there is a thick brick wall and foundation (or maybe it is a couple of walls that abut), would you under ordinary circumstances not suspect a problem? If not, maybe I can feel optimistic, do my own treatment, and expect resolution.

If it points to some kind of building repair issue I can have someone check, what am I looking for?

I think this advice is a bit overblown. The size of a hole that would allow a bedbug to crawl through is not at all an indicator that you have a fire safety issue. It’s not going to hurt to check it out, but bedbugs can get through just about any size space. And no home is really 100% sealed - otherwise you’d have no air left inside after a while... New homes are sometime so tightly sealed that they do require some sort of additional air circulation, but that doesn’t mean that an older home is a fire hazard just Because a bug can slip through from next-door

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry to bring this up, but if insects are finding ways to get through your party, you may also have a big code issue in terms of fire safety. I'd call a building inspector and get it checked.

OP - OK, this is where I get to show my total ignorance of construction. There is quite a bit online, and a bit in this thread, about the risk of bed bugs moving between construction where buildings or units touch.

In older rowhouses (think 1880-1900), where there is a thick brick wall and foundation (or maybe it is a couple of walls that abut), would you under ordinary circumstances not suspect a problem? If not, maybe I can feel optimistic, do my own treatment, and expect resolution.

If it points to some kind of building repair issue I can have someone check, what am I looking for?

I think this advice is a bit overblown. The size of a hole that would allow a bedbug to crawl through is not at all an indicator that you have a fire safety issue. It’s not going to hurt to check it out, but bedbugs can get through just about any size space. And no home is really 100% sealed - otherwise you’d have no air left inside after a while... New homes are sometime so tightly sealed that they do require some sort of additional air circulation, but that doesn’t mean that an older home is a fire hazard just Because a bug can slip through from next-door

Says someone who has never read the fire code. What the OP describes sounds like a code nightmare, particularly the shared attic/ceiling space among units, soft/deteriorating brick party wall, etc. You need a one-hour fire-rated wall (minimum) with continuous fire-rated materials that extends 18" above the roof, ideally. You want no through-penetrations between the walls or units.

[Anonymous]

We had bedbugs when I was pregnant. It was the FUCKING WORST. And we got it from a library book

[Anonymous]

We got bedbugs while traveling over a decade ago, and I'm still paranoid. I always walk into a hotel and pull back the sheets first thing to inspect the mattress.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry to bring this up, but if insects are finding ways to get through your party, you may also have a big code issue in terms of fire safety. I'd call a building inspector and get it checked.

OP - OK, this is where I get to show my total ignorance of construction. There is quite a bit online, and a bit in this thread, about the risk of bed bugs moving between construction where buildings or units touch.

In older rowhouses (think 1880-1900), where there is a thick brick wall and foundation (or maybe it is a couple of walls that abut), would you under ordinary circumstances not suspect a problem? If not, maybe I can feel optimistic, do my own treatment, and expect resolution.

If it points to some kind of building repair issue I can have someone check, what am I looking for?

I think this advice is a bit overblown. The size of a hole that would allow a bedbug to crawl through is not at all an indicator that you have a fire safety issue. It’s not going to hurt to check it out, but bedbugs can get through just about any size space. And no home is really 100% sealed - otherwise you’d have no air left inside after a while... New homes are sometime so tightly sealed that they do require some sort of additional air circulation, but that doesn’t mean that an older home is a fire hazard just Because a bug can slip through from next-door

Says someone who has never read the fire code. What the OP describes sounds like a code nightmare, particularly the shared attic/ceiling space among units, soft/deteriorating brick party wall, etc. You need a one-hour fire-rated wall (minimum) with continuous fire-rated materials that extends 18" above the roof, ideally. You want no through-penetrations between the walls or units.

OK, quick disclaimer here: I am OP and I, confused and paranoid OP, doesn't understand the facts that well, which is part of the reason I am asking question. I assume there is some kind of gap because a neighbor once said there is. I have no idea of the claim is true. We probably have whatever is true of circa 1880-1900 rowhouses with flat roofs in cities like DC, Baltimore, and Philadelphia. Maybe we do have a continuous up to the bottom of the roof? Anyone know?

I do know the walls are continuous brick.

I can also say that walls are exposed in our basement, and are soft, and that when I showed this to a contractor and asked if we should address this, kinda shrugged, said it was possible, that the situation was common, and that no one bothers with it. But he did give me a ballpark quote for applying a mesh and coating to the expanse.

I strongly suggest certain amount of rodent tunneling between homes possible, unless this is an urban legend related to intrusion from the outside people misdiagnose. But I know someone who claims a rat just dug into the basement one day.

I'm in Baltimore, and people love to tell stories of that kind.

I might be insane. But in all seriousness, I figure we might as well look at everything carefully and at the very least if there things to foam , caulk or treat. Or inspect, if that's really a concern.

I really wish I understood the structure better, but I just don't.

[Anonymous]

Oh wow - typing the above on my phone didn't go well. I am sorry about the errors. Please look past them.

[Anonymous]

Sue them

[Anonymous]

I am late to the party but what happened with this? We found out our neighbors (2 tenants) had a massive infestation which came through the walls into our house. We discovered this on Christmas eve. I had our house heat treated on 12-27. We kept seeing them and didn't find out it was the neighbors until February. I paid to have the apartments heat treated (landlord was MIA) and am now going after the landlord to get my money back. It is torture. We are still seeing them! Now we are tearing down drywall and sealing the brick wall underneath & replacing bedroom carpet with laminate flooring. I really would like to know how your situation worked out. Moving seems like a great option.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sorry to bring this up, but if insects are finding ways to get through your party, you may also have a big code issue in terms of fire safety. I'd call a building inspector and get it checked.

There is nothing in any code that says a party wall has to be impenetrable to a bug. You can always pay a building inspector, but for what? What then. A building inspector's report is useless. It will say to consult a licensed professional bug company.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Sorry to bring this up, but if insects are finding ways to get through your party, you may also have a big code issue in terms of fire safety. I'd call a building inspector and get it checked.

OP - OK, this is where I get to show my total ignorance of construction. There is quite a bit online, and a bit in this thread, about the risk of bed bugs moving between construction where buildings or units touch.

In older rowhouses (think 1880-1900), where there is a thick brick wall and foundation (or maybe it is a couple of walls that abut), would you under ordinary circumstances not suspect a problem? If not, maybe I can feel optimistic, do my own treatment, and expect resolution.

If it points to some kind of building repair issue I can have someone check, what am I looking for?

I think this advice is a bit overblown. The size of a hole that would allow a bedbug to crawl through is not at all an indicator that you have a fire safety issue. It’s not going to hurt to check it out, but bedbugs can get through just about any size space. And no home is really 100% sealed - otherwise you’d have no air left inside after a while... New homes are sometime so tightly sealed that they do require some sort of additional air circulation, but that doesn’t mean that an older home is a fire hazard just Because a bug can slip through from next-door

Says someone who has never read the fire code. What the OP describes sounds like a code nightmare, particularly the shared attic/ceiling space among units, soft/deteriorating brick party wall, etc. You need a one-hour fire-rated wall (minimum) with continuous fire-rated materials that extends 18" above the roof, ideally. You want no through-penetrations between the walls or units.

OK, quick disclaimer here: I am OP and I, confused and paranoid OP, doesn't understand the facts that well, which is part of the reason I am asking question. I assume there is some kind of gap because a neighbor once said there is. I have no idea of the claim is true. We probably have whatever is true of circa 1880-1900 rowhouses with flat roofs in cities like DC, Baltimore, and Philadelphia. Maybe we do have a continuous up to the bottom of the roof? Anyone know?

I do know the walls are continuous brick.

I can also say that walls are exposed in our basement, and are soft, and that when I showed this to a contractor and asked if we should address this, kinda shrugged, said it was possible, that the situation was common, and that no one bothers with it. But he did give me a ballpark quote for applying a mesh and coating to the expanse.

I strongly suggest certain amount of rodent tunneling between homes possible, unless this is an urban legend related to intrusion from the outside people misdiagnose. But I know someone who claims a rat just dug into the basement one day.

I'm in Baltimore, and people love to tell stories of that kind.

I might be insane. But in all seriousness, I figure we might as well look at everything carefully and at the very least if there things to foam , caulk or treat. Or inspect, if that's really a concern.

I really wish I understood the structure better, but I just don't.

The rowhouses from that era have much thicker walls than anything built today. Soft brick doesn't mean bugs are crawling through the brick.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:We got bedbugs while traveling over a decade ago, and I'm still paranoid. I always walk into a hotel and pull back the sheets first thing to inspect the mattress.

My family is annoyed at how diligent I am at checking the beds the moment we get to a hotel room but it sounds like it's a huge chore and very expensive to get rid of them if you end up bringing them home. And once I did find a bedbug when I did my check and we changed rooms immediately. So my family can't complain but I suspect they're still annoyed with me.

[Anonymous]

And this is why I will never live in a home with any shared walls of any sort. Bedbugs and cockroaches. Nope nope nope.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I am late to the party but what happened with this? We found out our neighbors (2 tenants) had a massive infestation which came through the walls into our house. We discovered this on Christmas eve. I had our house heat treated on 12-27. We kept seeing them and didn't find out it was the neighbors until February. I paid to have the apartments heat treated (landlord was MIA) and am now going after the landlord to get my money back. It is torture. We are still seeing them! Now we are tearing down drywall and sealing the brick wall underneath & replacing bedroom carpet with laminate flooring. I really would like to know how your situation worked out. Moving seems like a great option.

If you see this, please let me know how it worked out. We're in this situation right now and it's awful. I feel so trapped -- we can't sell like this! The neighbors are interested in treating but don't seem to feel a real sense of urgency, and I'm not sure how capable/committed they are to the long and arduous process of eliminating them. I know it's not the end of the world, but sometimes it feels like that.

[Anonymous]

We dealt with a similar issue from a neighbor with cockroaches and looked into sealing our walls during a renovation. You'd really have to rip open quite a lot including your ceilings and baseboards as there are quite likely holes not only in the brick, but also consider that you may have overlapping joists in your walls where part of their joist is visible inside your home and vice versa, with bugs able to travel along the joists supporting the floors, ceilings, roof, etc. It would be a huge job and possibly unattainable. Though perhaps if you seal up the rooms where their infestation is, you can be successful.