Going Green -- Support Iranian democracy

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:We can stand with "Neda" morally by making strong statements that basic freedoms are a given right. We can work through the UN for further sanctions. We can up the pressure and isolation on the thuggish government. Instead, hotdog diplomacy? Seriously? I could see Obama's 'plan' a month ago. However, the facts on the ground are different now. This is the first breach in this black curtain in 30 years. Is there no shame in inviting the same people who stormed our embassy to a 4th of July picnic? No 4th of July hot dogs for thugs!

What would you prefer? Serving Iranian diplomats hotdogs and forcing them to listen to speeches about American democracy (along with diplomats from other nations) or fighting a war with Iran? This is an important question because what you suggest leads directly to war. If we work to isolate Iran at this point, there will be no progress on the issue of nuclear weapons. To the contrary, Iranian hard-liners will be encouraged and weapons advances will be further justified. Netanyahu will scream bloody murder about every Iranian advance and eventually either Israel will attack Iran or the US will do it for them. At that point, both Iraq and and Afghanistan will go to hell. Are you willing to pay that price in exchange for some bluster on behalf of Obama that will yield no benefits?

BTW, Mousavi was just as close to the embassy takeover as the ruling regime members. He was also behind the bombings of the US embassy and marine barracks in Lebanon. Obama just wants to serve hotdogs, but you appear to want to make this guy president. There is no way out of this that doesn't involve working with people with blood on their hands. I stand with the protestors, but I have the luxury of following my heart. Obama has to stay focused on the bigger picture.

[Anonymous]

I said stand with Neda, not with Mousavi, but thanks for the 'newsflash' on his past activities. This is the first time in 30 years that there has been any kind of fissure apparent. Just as you say it would lead to war to make verbal gestures of support, I say that it presents an interesting opportunity that perhaps hotdog diplomacy is working with the wrong people to exploit. I did not say brandish a sword, but yes, strongly come out in both words and UN action on the side of the protesters. And I am loathe to do that since I saw the rug pulled out form under the Hungarians, Tianammen, yadda yadda, but the protesters themselves are saying impose more sanctions on Iran. That is not something we have heard before, and it is not something to ignore b/cause Obama has a bee in his head about wanting to follow through on his open hand diplomacy and now the protesters are 'ruining' his scenario--waah!
No hotdogs for thugs! Remember when the embassy was stormed, the diplomats marched to the roof and guns held to their head in little games of will, I won't I pull the trigger roulette? And you, so against 'torture'. Now for grilling hot dogs for the very same people? Ridiculous.

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:I said stand with Neda, not with Mousavi, but thanks for the 'newsflash' on his past activities. This is the first time in 30 years that there has been any kind of fissure apparent. Just as you say it would lead to war to make verbal gestures of support, I say that it presents an interesting opportunity that perhaps hotdog diplomacy is working with the wrong people to exploit. I did not say brandish a sword, but yes, strongly come out in both words and UN action on the side of the protesters. And I am loathe to do that since I saw the rug pulled out form under the Hungarians, Tianammen, yadda yadda, but the protesters themselves are saying impose more sanctions on Iran. That is not something we have heard before, and it is not something to ignore b/cause Obama has a bee in his head about wanting to follow through on his open hand diplomacy and now the protesters are 'ruining' his scenario--waah!
No hotdogs for thugs! Remember when the embassy was stormed, the diplomats marched to the roof and guns held to their head in little games of will, I won't I pull the trigger roulette? And you, so against 'torture'. Now for grilling hot dogs for the very same people? Ridiculous.

If you are not supporting Mousavi, then what is your plan for Iran? Nothing but chaos? Because other than Mousavi, the protestors have no apparent leader. It sounds like you are interested in words and fantasies that might make you feel good about yourself, but not actual results.

Can you point me to any sources which document the protestors requesting sanctions? I'd like to see exactly what they are saying.

You are very eager to attack Obama, but I think you also need to give him some credit for getting us where we are now. His "change of tone" likely has been inspirational to many of those out in the streets. They would be less willing to attack their government in an atmosphere in which they were being called part of the Axis of Evil and threatened with attack at any moment.

Obama said throughout the campaign that he would talk to the Iranians -- exactly the same Iranians who took over our embassy. You can rant all you want about that, but the American people had the chance to choose and chose the guy that would talk to the Iranians. They didn't choose the guy who would "bomb, bomb, Iran". So, yes, if Iranian diplomats want to join diplomats from other nations in celebrating US independence, I am all for it. I'm glad when anyone celebrates US independence. I think it will be great for the current Iranian leaders to hear patriotic speeches about how common people rose up to throw off the oppressive yolk of a repressive government. And, do you really think eating a hot dog is some kind of reward? Have you tried Persian food? I'll give the Iranians credit if they don't throw up.

[Anonymous]

My source is my ears; listening to the news, with calls out of Iran, many of the protesters are begging that we embargo gasoline etc. and bring this regime to its knees--even if the 'people' suffer in the process, it is something they are willing to undergo for freedom.

[Anonymous]

Obama has a bee in his head about wanting to follow through on his open hand diplomacy and now the protesters are 'ruining' his scenario--waah!

Can you step back for one moment and realize that this conflict is NOT ABOUT THE UNITED STATES! This is about Iran. This is not a referrendum on the Obama presidency. Using this to attack our own president is shameful opportunism.

I have friends and family in Iran, and Iranian friends and family in this country. I have yet to meet one who has anything negative to say about Obama's level of response. He has said what they needed to hear.

[Anonymous]

My heart really goes out to Iran - but what do you think Obama could possibly do to fix the situation? You are dealing with irrational leaders in a corrupt system. Has anything positive come in the past from our government meddling? If anything it has ruined the way the middle east views our foreign policy. Obama is doing exactly the right thing right now and I have much respect for him.....finally a leader that knows how to psychologically handle it. The corrupt Iranian government would absolutely love for the U.S to meddle so they can blame us for everything - they need to figure this out on their own.

[Anonymous]

And no sh** hot dogs are gross. But embassy 4th of July celebrations actually have a meaning which is far beyond hot dogs, as you well know. It has nothing to do with comparing cuisines and everything to do with honoring those to whom we open our doors. The current reps of the Iranian govt. represent a govt. which shoots women through the heart when they exercise their right to free speech. They should not be invited through our embassy doors (a piece of America) to a 4th of July celebration of all things, unless you think they will be so overcome by our little paper flags, have an epiphany and suddenly 'get it'. And again, they may individually (get it), but they are symbols of a corrupt regime and can 'get it' without means of an official 4th of July celebration invite.

Vis Obama's Cairo speech--sorry he DOES NOT get credit for going to Egypt and telling everyone how great tolerance is, and then waiting for it to 'all play out' in the West Wing while protesters are brutally slain. And as I have made clear---I do not wish for armed intervention; just using the diplomatic and sanctionary tools at our command--certainly NO hot dogs! He either is for tolerance, or isn't. He doesn't get credit when he is only when it's convenient. No Credit for him til' he follows through on his speeches. Most hilarious line of his press conference? We don't know how this will all play out. That is how he decides his foreign policy? Seriously? Did the Allies know how it would 'all play out'? Ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009/06/23/state-department-iranian-diplomats-welcome-july-parties/

Should have known where this was coming from - I googled "hotdog diplomacy." Was this on Hannity last night?

No matter what action he takes with regards to Iran, Hannity will say he should have done the opposite. Hannity could care less about the Iranian people - he only wants to bring down the Obama presidency.

[Anonymous]

just using the diplomatic and sanctionary tools at our command

So, since we have no diplomatic relations with Iran, how would you suggest that we DO anything along those lines? It's up to the International Community to DO something along those lines, right?

Why aren't you railing against Siemens and Nokia for selling Iran the technology that is allowing it to spy on its own people?

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124562668777335653.html#mod=rss_whats_news_us

The Iranian regime has developed, with the assistance of European telecommunications companies, one of the world's most sophisticated mechanisms for controlling and censoring the Internet, allowing it to examine the content of individual online communications on a massive scale.

[Anonymous]

Did not watch Hannity last night. Actually are you that paranoid? "I should have known where this was coming from...". Do you think there are 'plants' on DC URBAN MOM? Seriously? Am a woman with a mind that adds facts together and thinks. My parents were diplomats by the way. Middle of the road bureaucrats engaging and representing America abroad. They reached out to everyONE. But the thought of my dad getting 'orders' to invite Iranian diplomats representing the current murderous regime to the 4th of July bar-b-cue (many of the SAME people who stormed the Embassy 30 years ago and tortured Americans for a year) makes me think that this administration is completely tone-deaf. No hotdogs for thugs! Or shouldn't we invite the Burmese junta as well? How about Somali warlords? Let's give everyone a hot dog. These things matter folks--it is the ultimate slap to those who have died the past few days on the streets of Tehran.

[Anonymous]

Happy to rail against Siemens and Nokia by the way.

[Anonymous]

We can stand with "Neda" morally by making strong statements that basic freedoms are a given right.

And Obama did just this yestereday:

"The United States and the international community have been appalled and outraged by the threats, beatings, and imprisonments of the last few days. I strongly condemn these unjust actions, and I join with the American people in mourning each and every innocent life that is lost. I have made it clear that the United States respects the sovereignty of the Islamic Republic of Iran, and is not at all interfering in Iran’s affairs. But we must also bear witness to the courage and dignity of the Iranian people, and to a remarkable opening within Iranian society. And we deplore violence against innocent civilians anywhere that it takes place.[...]

This is not about the United States and the West; this is about the people of Iran, and the future that they – and only they – will choose."

[Anonymous]

Am a woman with a mind that adds facts together and thinks. My parents were diplomats by the way.

http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/

Trita Parsi, President of the National Iranian American Council, said: “Condemning violence is different from taking sides in Iran's election dispute. People in Iran have told NIAC’s Iranian-American membership that they don’t want the US to get itself involved in the conflict, but they do want to see the government’s use of violence condemned... Calls by Republican lawmakers to explicitly side with a specific candidate or movement in Iran can be extremely harmful to that candidate or movement. If our intention is to help, we have to first listen to the people in Iran rather than to pretend to speak for them without ever having had consulted with them,” Parsi added.


How about if you add up these facts and think.

[Anonymous]

Do the people of Iran want Obama tossing hot dogs to the people shooting at them from roof tops? How bout' you add that up for me and THINK.

[Anonymous]

Which Republican has called for the support of a specific movement or candidate BTW? I have seen calls to condemn the violence, urge the UN to impose unified sanctions on the current regime for said use of violence, and to not fire up the grill for thugs of current regime.