Does your school teach grammar?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Mine school teach grammer real good.

OMG!!! Love it!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Mine school teach grammer real good.

That be great. Where you school at?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn't teaching grammar just about modeling it? Kids learn from listening to others. Obviously, children in ESL or households with minimal education would need direct instruction, other than that.. is it necessary?

P.S. It's 1am in the morning, so please don't analyze my incorrect grammar.

Not necessarily. Modeling certainly helps, but I know lots of well-educated people who had well-off and well-educated parents who still make grammar mistakes, or who don't write particularly well because they don't know the rules of grammar. I spent a year diagramming sentences in sixth grade. I did not enjoy it, but it was one of the more useful parts of my education. You'll pick up a lot just from listening and reading, but there's really no substitute for learning the rules of proper sentence construction.

Certain learning issues also don't work with this idea. For example my ADHD never going to listen to you long enough to catch the pattern.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, but not in isolation, like "OK now we're going to do grammar. Get out your grammar books." It's much more integrated into the writing program. And for most kids, they are just learning the lingo for the grammar they already know through modeling and reading and then stretching it to more sophisticated forms of language use. In other words, it may come naturally, but they still need to know how to label the parts of speech and sentences, etc. There may be more targeted grammar work for students who need it, not sure, but I'd expect so. It is definitely being taught because a summer camp teacher commented that she'd never met a 10-year-old who could discuss language and writing the way mine does -- and I didn't teach that. I credit the teachers.

My son is very good at grammar (for his age) uses things like "my sister and I" (not my sister and me) and knows the difference between their, they're and there or to, too and two. We definitely didn't teach him those things specifically. He's only 4, so I'm pretty sure his teachers didn't either. Sometimes kids just pick it up from those around them or from reading. Your kid may have learned it from his teachers, or he may be due credit for working it out himself and being interested in language.

I know what you mean, but that's not what I meant by grammar. I'm talking about a 10 year old. Yes, he learned proper speech patterns from us and from reading, but he and his classmates can discuss verb tenses, and part of speech, humorous comma mistakes that change meaning, and they know the language of grammar - split infinitive, assonance, ellipses, modifier, etc. -- that's what he knows that I didn't specifically teach him. We don't sit around discussing 'subject-verb agreement,' but he can use that phrase or will say, "I'm trying to think of a better metaphor for _____." They also edit their own writing using proper editing marks (triple underlines for caps, carrots, etc.). So, that's how I know the school is teaching grammar as a part of writing - and doing it well. Although, I do wish they still used text books for this. I'm old school, I guess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, but not in isolation, like "OK now we're going to do grammar. Get out your grammar books." It's much more integrated into the writing program. And for most kids, they are just learning the lingo for the grammar they already know through modeling and reading and then stretching it to more sophisticated forms of language use. In other words, it may come naturally, but they still need to know how to label the parts of speech and sentences, etc. There may be more targeted grammar work for students who need it, not sure, but I'd expect so. It is definitely being taught because a summer camp teacher commented that she'd never met a 10-year-old who could discuss language and writing the way mine does -- and I didn't teach that. I credit the teachers.

My son is very good at grammar (for his age) uses things like "my sister and I" (not my sister and me) and knows the difference between their, they're and there or to, too and two. We definitely didn't teach him those things specifically. He's only 4, so I'm pretty sure his teachers didn't either. Sometimes kids just pick it up from those around them or from reading. Your kid may have learned it from his teachers, or he may be due credit for working it out himself and being interested in language.

I know what you mean, but that's not what I meant by grammar. I'm talking about a 10 year old. Yes, he learned proper speech patterns from us and from reading, but he and his classmates can discuss verb tenses, and part of speech, humorous comma mistakes that change meaning, and they know the language of grammar - split infinitive, assonance, ellipses, modifier, etc. -- that's what he knows that I didn't specifically teach him. We don't sit around discussing 'subject-verb agreement,' but he can use that phrase or will say, "I'm trying to think of a better metaphor for _____." They also edit their own writing using proper editing marks (triple underlines for caps, carrots, etc.). So, that's how I know the school is teaching grammar as a part of writing - and doing it well. Although, I do wish they still used text books for this. I'm old school, I guess.

Thanks for the explanation - impressive. I must admit that I never learned grammar to that extent! (And I edit for a living!) Which school is this?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn't teaching grammar just about modeling it? Kids learn from listening to others. Obviously, children in ESL or households with minimal education would need direct instruction, other than that.. is it necessary?

P.S. It's 1am in the morning, so please don't analyze my incorrect grammar.

Not necessarily. Modeling certainly helps, but I know lots of well-educated people who had well-off and well-educated parents who still make grammar mistakes, or who don't write particularly well because they don't know the rules of grammar. I spent a year diagramming sentences in sixth grade. I did not enjoy it, but it was one of the more useful parts of my education. You'll pick up a lot just from listening and reading, but there's really no substitute for learning the rules of proper sentence construction.

My firm hires only from top colleges, and many of our employees don't know grammar. They had basic grammar modeled well by their parents, so they speak intelligently. But when they write, you see how much they never learned. They dangle modifiers, they don't use parallel structure, and their subjects and verbs don't agree in complex sentences. These things have a big impact on clarity of writing, but they have to be taught.

This is shocking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn't teaching grammar just about modeling it? Kids learn from listening to others. Obviously, children in ESL or households with minimal education would need direct instruction, other than that.. is it necessary?

P.S. It's 1am in the morning, so please don't analyze my incorrect grammar.

Not necessarily. Modeling certainly helps, but I know lots of well-educated people who had well-off and well-educated parents who still make grammar mistakes, or who don't write particularly well because they don't know the rules of grammar. I spent a year diagramming sentences in sixth grade. I did not enjoy it, but it was one of the more useful parts of my education. You'll pick up a lot just from listening and reading, but there's really no substitute for learning the rules of proper sentence construction.

My firm hires only from top colleges, and many of our employees don't know grammar. They had basic grammar modeled well by their parents, so they speak intelligently. But when they write, you see how much they never learned. They dangle modifiers, they don't use parallel structure, and their subjects and verbs don't agree in complex sentences. These things have a big impact on clarity of writing, but they have to be taught.

This is shocking.

Actually, it doesn't surprise me at all. Our DC went through HRCS and Deal and has had essentially no formal writing instruction that involves grammar, and certainly nothing like the sentence diagramming of my youth. She's a very strong reader and writes a lot but I think her critical writing is definitely weaker for the lack of formal instruction. It's part of why we are considering private for our second child, who seems even farther behind.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Isn't teaching grammar just about modeling it? Kids learn from listening to others. Obviously, children in ESL or households with minimal education would need direct instruction, other than that.. is it necessary?

P.S. It's 1am in the morning, so please don't analyze my incorrect grammar.

Not necessarily. Modeling certainly helps, but I know lots of well-educated people who had well-off and well-educated parents who still make grammar mistakes, or who don't write particularly well because they don't know the rules of grammar. I spent a year diagramming sentences in sixth grade. I did not enjoy it, but it was one of the more useful parts of my education. You'll pick up a lot just from listening and reading, but there's really no substitute for learning the rules of proper sentence construction.

My firm hires only from top colleges, and many of our employees don't know grammar. They had basic grammar modeled well by their parents, so they speak intelligently. But when they write, you see how much they never learned. They dangle modifiers, they don't use parallel structure, and their subjects and verbs don't agree in complex sentences. These things have a big impact on clarity of writing, but they have to be taught.

This is shocking.

Actually, it doesn't surprise me at all. Our DC went through HRCS and Deal and has had essentially no formal writing instruction that involves grammar, and certainly nothing like the sentence diagramming of my youth. She's a very strong reader and writes a lot but I think her critical writing is definitely weaker for the lack of formal instruction. It's part of why we are considering private for our second child, who seems even farther behind.

I'm the PP who posted about top college alums not knowing grammar, and I would not assume private schools teach it.

I think one of the reasons it isn't taught much anymore is that it's viewed as too rule-based and uncreative. Grammar is often taught as a set of rules with little context, which makes it boring to teach and to learn. It's so much more engaging when taught in context, demonstrating how good grammar makes writing clearer and more powerful.

[Anonymous]

How could most DCPS even consider grammar? The majority of kids at most DCPS schools are below average. If a kid is reading three grade levels behind it hard to prioritize grammar. And yet all the kids are grouped together to keep things equal. I will never understand why so many educated parents are ok with such low standards for their children.

[Anonymous]

Yeah boyee!!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How could most DCPS even consider grammar? The majority of kids at most DCPS schools are below average. If a kid is reading three grade levels behind it hard to prioritize grammar. And yet all the kids are grouped together to keep things equal. I will never understand why so many educated parents are ok with such low standards for their children.

The children of educated parents are more likely to be reading at or above grade level in DC. You clearly have no knowledge of what is actually happening in DCPS. Yes, many children in DC are reading below grade level, but those are not children of educated parents. Additionally, many schools, not just WOTP schools, provide differentiated teaching.

[Anonymous]

Wait, what??!!! Please tell me DCPS is at least teaching kids things like the difference between a noun and a verb or an adjective and adverb?? And they discuss subject/verb agreement etc?

[Anonymous]

THis is not a DCPS issue--it's an everywhere issue. Grammar instruction has been in decline for decades, nationwide.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, but not in isolation, like "OK now we're going to do grammar. Get out your grammar books." It's much more integrated into the writing program. And for most kids, they are just learning the lingo for the grammar they already know through modeling and reading and then stretching it to more sophisticated forms of language use. In other words, it may come naturally, but they still need to know how to label the parts of speech and sentences, etc. There may be more targeted grammar work for students who need it, not sure, but I'd expect so. It is definitely being taught because a summer camp teacher commented that she'd never met a 10-year-old who could discuss language and writing the way mine does -- and I didn't teach that. I credit the teachers.

My son is very good at grammar (for his age) uses things like "my sister and I" (not my sister and me) and knows the difference between their, they're and there or to, too and two. We definitely didn't teach him those things specifically. He's only 4, so I'm pretty sure his teachers didn't either. Sometimes kids just pick it up from those around them or from reading. Your kid may have learned it from his teachers, or he may be due credit for working it out himself and being interested in language.

Well "my sister and me" is correct sometimes.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Yes, but not in isolation, like "OK now we're going to do grammar. Get out your grammar books." It's much more integrated into the writing program. And for most kids, they are just learning the lingo for the grammar they already know through modeling and reading and then stretching it to more sophisticated forms of language use. In other words, it may come naturally, but they still need to know how to label the parts of speech and sentences, etc. There may be more targeted grammar work for students who need it, not sure, but I'd expect so. It is definitely being taught because a summer camp teacher commented that she'd never met a 10-year-old who could discuss language and writing the way mine does -- and I didn't teach that. I credit the teachers.

My son is very good at grammar (for his age) uses things like "my sister and I" (not my sister and me) and knows the difference between their, they're and there or to, too and two. We definitely didn't teach him those things specifically. He's only 4, so I'm pretty sure his teachers didn't either. Sometimes kids just pick it up from those around them or from reading. Your kid may have learned it from his teachers, or he may be due credit for working it out himself and being interested in language.

Well "my sister and me" is correct sometimes.

Yup. And to know when "I" is correct and when "me" is correct, PP's 4 yo would need a grammatically based lesson in the difference between subject and object. It's the sort of thing many, many highly educated adults do not know.