Thinking about going to law school p/t

[Anonymous]

Some general advice on getting advice about law school - when you ask "Should I go to law school?" you are going to get three types of responses - 1) irrelevant advice from people who didn't go to law school; 2) crazy, hyperbolic exaggerations about how awful it is, usually riffing on how there are no jobs or crappy jobs and how it's a soul-killing profession; 3) the "lawyer response" of "it depends." My advice to you would be to find lawyers or law grads in real life and instead ask three questions "What was your experience in the law school?" "How did you get where you are now?" and "What would you do differently?" You will get a lot more thoughtful advice that way.

That being said, the answer to your original question is "it depends." I would seriously look at the recommendations of other posters and non-law consumer protection jobs to see if that's something that can fulfill your professional aspirations. I would also go and talk to attorneys who do consumer protection and ask them how they got to that point (connect with your undergrad alumni office, they will likely be able to put you in touch with someone you can email). The reality is that the job market is tough these days and no one entering law school thinks that they're never going to find a job because, well, they're smart and they're going to do great. A lot of law grads - even ones with good, steady jobs that pay well - have a significant amount of dead that is going to follow them for years, if not decades. If you really want to go to law school, that price tag might be worth it to you - but it's also good to talk to people for whom it was NOT worth it because you might share the same values and outlook on life. Since you want to do a very specific job, you need to make sure that the odds of you achieving your goal are in your favor if you pursue a law degree - or that you are okay with falling short and have another plan.

[Anonymous]

the above is terrible advice. the odds are completely stacked against you these days. going and asking someone who went to law school 10, 20, 30 years ago "how did you get here" is going to do nothing for you.

do not go to law school.

[Anonymous]

I actually think the point is to get inside info from someone in the industry on how to get a job there - they might actually say, "So I went to law school and did X, but today we're hiring people who do Y or Z." You can probably also find someone who went to law school more recently than 10 years ago, especially in D.C....

[Anonymous]

There are a lot of consumer bank examiners who have law degrees. Who earn exactly the same amount of money as the consumer bank examiners who do not have law degrees. Does that help clarify the situation?

[Anonymous]

I would go only if you get a free ride somewhere or _maybe_ Georgetown with some kind of scholarship (Georgetown at sticker is a bad investment).

Anything else is insane these days. Law school enrollment is down to mid-1970s levels and still falling. There is talk of some of the true gutter schools (especially the free-standing law schools without a university affiliation) closing down.

The unemployment rate for new grads is "officially" about 11%, but I think they are counting people with any job (including barista at Starbucks) as "employed." I would be interested to see the stats including only jobs as an attorney, or at least jobs that require a JD (e.g., not paralegal or legal secretary gigs -- a couple years ago I worked for a solo and posted a job ad for a secretary and got 3-4 recent JDs sending me a resume. And things are worse now).

Things are bad for the legal job market, and this isn't a temporary blip.

[Anonymous]

I'm a lawyer. Even if you go to an excellent law school, I think it would be hard to do what you want to do. Even 20 years ago when the law market was good, there really weren't many jobs helping individuals with consumer protection issues. The fact is, it really isn't cost effective for an individual to pay a private sector lawyer even $200/hour for help. You can't do much in 10 hours, and few people who have these types of issues have an extra $2K sitting around to fight something. As someone said, one option is class action work, but that at best is an interesting intellectual exercise and you're not going to help anyone individually. The other options would be with legal aid or other non-profits, but then you're looking at salaries in the 40K range unless/until you reach director or supervisor level.

[Anonymous]

and, again, hordes of grads are getting out of school with a ton of debt and either cannot find a job as an attorney or are working a soul-sucking job in an awful practice area like debt collections or low-level personal injury. try servicing 90-150k in loans on a salary of 40-50k.

dismiss this as "crazy hyperbole" at your peril.

[Anonymous]

10:40 is hilarious. The part about the crazy/ghetto client totally reminds me of my experiences at legal services.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There are a lot of consumer bank examiners who have law degrees. Who earn exactly the same amount of money as the consumer bank examiners who do not have law degrees. Does that help clarify the situation?

.
definitely
I am looking into applying for this position or something similar.

[Anonymous]

and, again, hordes of grads are getting out of school with a ton of debt and either cannot find a job as an attorney or are working a soul-sucking job in an awful practice area like debt collections or low-level personal injury. try servicing 90-150k in loans on a salary of 40-50k.

dismiss this as "crazy hyperbole" at your peril.

While I certainly think that law school is a huge risk these days, I think part of why a PP called it crazy hyperbole is that there is virtually no career path where your financial and time investment will necessarily pan out in this economy. However, depending on your situation and goals, even in this overglutted market, law school CAN make sense for some people. There are certain things you can only do with a law degree, or even if the law degree is not strictly necessary, will get your foot in the door. When your earning potential and career mobility is stagnating , sometimes you have to make the call over whether or not it is worth it to get more education. It's a risk that can pay off.

Although I understand there are serious problems with the debt burden law school entails and with the job market out there, I think part of the negativity comes from the fact that the legal market is huge in DC so lawyers are overrepresented on this forum. People don't know how much just about every professional job market sucks right now--they just know their corner of the universe.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DO NOT GO TO LAW SCHOOL

the job market is shit. whatever inspired you to go to school (environmental law, sports law, consumer protection) is almost definitely NOT what you will be doing when you graduate.

most likely, when you graduate you will take a job making 45k at a shitshop "firm," where you may even be paid as a 1099 (which means you have to pay all your employment taxes). the owner of the firm will have coffee stains on his JC penney shirt and will throw on his rumpled ass jacket when it's time to go to court on that trip and fall case he took. the client, shaniqua, will have called him 37 times "axing" where her money be.

either that, or you will do doc review at $25 an hour. mind-numbing horseshit that with no job security, and you are treated like a second-class citizen by "real" big firm associates supervising the project.

if you go to georgetown and do well, you have about a 40% shot at a biglaw/decent govt gig, which will allow you to at least service your debt. if you go to any of the other schools mentioned here, your chances vary from 5-12%. the alternative, for the most part, is as outlined above.

in any event, you will not "help people" when you graduate. whatever it is you went to law school for, you will not be doing that.

I wish more people knew this. This country needs LESS lawyers!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

and, again, hordes of grads are getting out of school with a ton of debt and either cannot find a job as an attorney or are working a soul-sucking job in an awful practice area like debt collections or low-level personal injury. try servicing 90-150k in loans on a salary of 40-50k.

dismiss this as "crazy hyperbole" at your peril.

While I certainly think that law school is a huge risk these days, I think part of why a PP called it crazy hyperbole is that there is virtually no career path where your financial and time investment will necessarily pan out in this economy. However, depending on your situation and goals, even in this overglutted market, law school CAN make sense for some people. There are certain things you can only do with a law degree, or even if the law degree is not strictly necessary, will get your foot in the door. When your earning potential and career mobility is stagnating , sometimes you have to make the call over whether or not it is worth it to get more education. It's a risk that can pay off.

Although I understand there are serious problems with the debt burden law school entails and with the job market out there, I think part of the negativity comes from the fact that the legal market is huge in DC so lawyers are overrepresented on this forum. People don't know how much just about every professional job market sucks right now--they just know their corner of the universe.

so would it be "crazy hyperbole" to tell someone that it's stupid to borrow $150k, take it to vegas and put it all on black? unless you go to a truly elite school, you seriously have about a 70% chance of fucking your life up and having little to no real career prospects. this is not a corner of any universe. it is the legal job market in the US, and it is here to stay.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

and, again, hordes of grads are getting out of school with a ton of debt and either cannot find a job as an attorney or are working a soul-sucking job in an awful practice area like debt collections or low-level personal injury. try servicing 90-150k in loans on a salary of 40-50k.

dismiss this as "crazy hyperbole" at your peril.

There are certain things you can only do with a law degree, or even if the law degree is not strictly necessary, will get your foot in the door.

the "law degree is versatile and can open other doors" thing is a laughable myth. if anything, it holds you back. an employer thinks you are either insane for not wanting to be an associate making six figures or thinks you will be out the door the second one of those jobs open up (not knowing that such a job will never open up for your TTT ass).

[Anonymous]

I would look around at jobs you think you'd like and go talk to them-- maybe they are local consumer protection agencies, or federal agencies, or places like Public Citizen, but see if someone will take a few minutes to give you advice.

[Anonymous]

On getting involved on the regulatory side -- if you already have strong analytical, writing, and communication skills, law school will not add much to your ability to do those jobs. Having financial analysis experience/certifications generally help, and MBAs have often been the traditional educational path to those jobs rather than law. That said, many have made it in policy or supervisory functions without advanced degrees, although many have Masters in something financial/economic. I also know someone who works in financial education in Florida -- that's another avenue, although limited.