Longfellow MS AAP overcrowding plans?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to realize that opening an AAP center at Cooper would crowd Cooper overnight, leaving more kids in trailers, etc since they don't have the capacity. The school is pretty run down as is and there are no plans for any new renovations anytime soon. Plus, it would take time for Cooper to reach Longfellow in terms of AAP rigor and extracurricular since they currently don't have those teachers in place.

I know certain school board members are chomping at the bit for this to happen, but they shouldn't just force it willy nilly and hope for the best.

FCPS shows Cooper as having being under-enrolled by 327 students this year, with the enrollment declining for at least the next four years.

If the choice is between moving AAP kids back to Cooper, or reassigning neighborhoods from Kilmer and Longfellow to Cooper to fill empty seats at Cooper, I'd prefer the former, since allowing the AAP enrollments at Kilmer and Longfellow to grow further as a percentage of the total enrollment would only aggravate issues that already exist around AAP/GenEd dynamics.

The parents at Cooper don't want a center there either, so the reason you cite above is pretty ridiculous. Having a center at a school that isn't equipped to have one is pretty stupid-plus, I don't know where you come up with those numbers of under enrollment. Both Churchill road and Spring Hill which feed to Cooper have tons of kids, as well as all of the Great Falls schools also in Langley pyramid.

Some parents at Cooper would be quite happy with a local center, and the figures regarding Cooper's current and projected under-enrollment are in the latest CIP.

I'd be interested in the results if they let the Cooper parents vote on it. Most current Cooper parents are very happy to have a non-center school for their kids. By middle school, most of us are sick to death of the whole AAP division.

[Anonymous]

Ideally, FCPS would tighten access to AAP so that Cooper doesn't shed so many kids to Kilmer and Longfellow. It has 150 fewer students than it had a decade ago, whereas Kilmer has 350 more students and Longfellow has 250 more students. Those trends simply aren't sustainable much longer.

[Anonymous]

Maybe they should institute another screening exam or process in 6th grade of the AAP kids and those that make it through can still go to the center schools if they wish. As a parent of a rising 6th grader this fall, I really would far prefer to send my kid to Longfellow and not Cooper to be the guinea pig of whatever lukewarm AAP program they come up with-but I fear with looming budget cuts we aren't going to be given that option. So now, we"ll be forced to look at crazy expensive private school options instead.

Really the fair thing to do is to "grandfather" the existing AAP students from the Cooper base and give them the option of attending a center school or Cooper-that would give Cooper some time to get their center up and running and parents could still have the choice for awhile longer driven in part by their TJ aspirations. A lot of current AAP parents at our center choose Cooper anyway to keep their kid in their neighborhood school. Just my two cents.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:People don't seem to realize that opening an AAP center at Cooper would crowd Cooper overnight, leaving more kids in trailers, etc since they don't have the capacity. The school is pretty run down as is and there are no plans for any new renovations anytime soon. Plus, it would take time for Cooper to reach Longfellow in terms of AAP rigor and extracurricular since they currently don't have those teachers in place.

I know certain school board members are chomping at the bit for this to happen, but they shouldn't just force it willy nilly and hope for the best.

FCPS shows Cooper as having being under-enrolled by 327 students this year, with the enrollment declining for at least the next four years.

If the choice is between moving AAP kids back to Cooper, or reassigning neighborhoods from Kilmer and Longfellow to Cooper to fill empty seats at Cooper, I'd prefer the former, since allowing the AAP enrollments at Kilmer and Longfellow to grow further as a percentage of the total enrollment would only aggravate issues that already exist around AAP/GenEd dynamics.

The parents at Cooper don't want a center there either, so the reason you cite above is pretty ridiculous. Having a center at a school that isn't equipped to have one is pretty stupid-plus, I don't know where you come up with those numbers of under enrollment. Both Churchill road and Spring Hill which feed to Cooper have tons of kids, as well as all of the Great Falls schools also in Langley pyramid.

Some parents at Cooper would be quite happy with a local center, and the figures regarding Cooper's current and projected under-enrollment are in the latest CIP.

I'd be interested in the results if they let the Cooper parents vote on it. Most current Cooper parents are very happy to have a non-center school for their kids. By middle school, most of us are sick to death of the whole AAP division.

As long as the Longfellow parents get to vote too, as they are also affected by housing Cooper AAP kids.

[Anonymous]

I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

So it's fair to all of a sudden overcrowd Cooper overnight and force kids into trailers when Longfellow just undertook a nice renovation to increase capacity (I can't comment on Kilmer since I know nothing about their building or future renovation plans).

[Anonymous]

Or shunt the GF kids in centers to Cooper and let the AAP kids from Churchill and Franklin Sherman go to Longfellow.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

So it's fair to all of a sudden overcrowd Cooper overnight and force kids into trailers when Longfellow just undertook a nice renovation to increase capacity (I can't comment on Kilmer since I know nothing about their building or future renovation plans).

Longfellow is at capacity even with its Reno. It is slated to go over capacity shortly. People are not saying to do it over night. This has been talked about for at least a year and Cooper is slated to be under capacity. I don't think it is fair for Cooper parents to continue to deny AAP to their neighborhood children and require them to be bussed all the way across town to Longfellow. I also don't think it is fair for Cooper parents to say they don't want their AAP students but that they perfectly fine for them to be overwhelming another school's resources. Cooper should take care of its own students - all of them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

So it's fair to all of a sudden overcrowd Cooper overnight and force kids into trailers when Longfellow just undertook a nice renovation to increase capacity (I can't comment on Kilmer since I know nothing about their building or future renovation plans).

If you don't know the facts about Kilmer, you can't comment sensibly on the topic.

Kilmer was renovated about a decade ago. It got a nice renovation, but it's not due to be renovated any time soon. It's currently about 150 students over capacity, and is projected to be 400 students over capacity in a few years.

Longfellow was renovated a few years ago, and its capacity was expanded as part of the renovation. But it's still projected to be 200 students over capacity in a few years.

Cooper, in comparison, has a declining enrollment, due to two things: (1) the neighborhoods that feed into Cooper are aging and expensive; and (2) it exports a large number of AAP kids to Kilmer (from Great Falls) and Longfellow (from McLean). It is currently 350 students below its stated capacity, and projected to be almost 400 students under capacity in a few years.

With those dynamics, particularly at Kilmer, FCPS really can't permit Cooper to become a school with around 700 students when Kilmer and Longfellow would have twice as many students and would be seriously overcrowded. There are only a few ways to deal with the issue: (1) add AAP at Cooper, (2) tighten standards for AAP or (3) change the base boundaries. Doing nothing won't be an option, and changing the base boundaries would increase the ratio of AAP to non-AAP students at Kilmer and Longfellow at a time when there's already concern about how non-AAP students feel at those schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

PP here-I believe I already stated that I wasn't qualified to comment on Kilmer, so the above snotty comment wasn't necessary.

I really don't get why the school board feels it makes sense to have AAP in all middle achools. In Cluster 1, it makes most sense for Longfellow to be THE center for middle school. They clearly have the teaching resources and extracurricular infrastructure already in place as well as the renovated building. It would also solve the problems of critical mass and AAP vs Non AAP populations. If transportation is the issue do limited or no bussing. I would gladly drive my kid for an advanced education in an established center-and I'm sure others feel the same, since clearly the main issue here is money (or lack thereof in FCPS) driving these decisions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

PP here-I believe I already stated that I wasn't qualified to comment on Kilmer, so the above snotty comment wasn't necessary.

I really don't get why the school board feels it makes sense to have AAP in all middle achools. In Cluster 1, it makes most sense for Longfellow to be THE center for middle school. They clearly have the teaching resources and extracurricular infrastructure already in place as well as the renovated building. It would also solve the problems of critical mass and AAP vs Non AAP populations. If transportation is the issue do limited or no bussing. I would gladly drive my kid for an advanced education in an established center-and I'm sure others feel the same, since clearly the main issue here is money (or lack thereof in FCPS) driving these decisions.

It wasn't intended as a snotty comment. But expressing an opinion about what should or should not be done at Cooper vis-a-vis Longfellow is besides the point when it's the projected overcrowding at Kilmer, due in large part to AAP kids coming from Cooper, that will force the issue because the overcrowding is going to be a major problem at Kilmer.

However, I don't think you have a grasp of the numbers. Longfellow currently has its own AAP kids and 1/2 the AAP kids zoned for Cooper, and it's still looking at being overcrowded in a few years even with expanded capacity. What you're suggesting would make a bad situation far worse, since you're proposing to send the remaining AAP kids from Cooper now at Kilmer and the AAP kids from Herndon (also in Cluster 1) now at Hughes to Longfellow as well. Longfellow does not have the resources or space for this. Longfellow would also end up at least 65% AAP students, which would leave GenEd parents there furious, and rightfully so.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

PP here-I believe I already stated that I wasn't qualified to comment on Kilmer, so the above snotty comment wasn't necessary.

I really don't get why the school board feels it makes sense to have AAP in all middle achools. In Cluster 1, it makes most sense for Longfellow to be THE center for middle school. They clearly have the teaching resources and extracurricular infrastructure already in place as well as the renovated building. It would also solve the problems of critical mass and AAP vs Non AAP populations. If transportation is the issue do limited or no bussing. I would gladly drive my kid for an advanced education in an established center-and I'm sure others feel the same, since clearly the main issue here is money (or lack thereof in FCPS) driving these decisions.

It doesn't make sense when Cooper is under capacity because they send AAP students to Longfeloow and Longfellow is over capacity becasue of those same students. There are plenty of AAP students in the Cooper district for a robust AAp program. I would also send half the expereince AAP teachers at Longfellow to Cooper so they can benefit from the experienced teacher resources. The extracurricular stuff could easily be done at Cooper now. I don't know why they don't do it currently. The issue isn't money (as it wouldn't save all that much), it is space and the fact that the over large AAP population at Longfellow adversely affects the Gen- Ed population at Longfellow.

[Anonymous]

I'm saying have Longfellow be CENTER ONLY-GE kids from that district would go to Cooper.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

PP here-I believe I already stated that I wasn't qualified to comment on Kilmer, so the above snotty comment wasn't necessary.

I really don't get why the school board feels it makes sense to have AAP in all middle achools. In Cluster 1, it makes most sense for Longfellow to be THE center for middle school. They clearly have the teaching resources and extracurricular infrastructure already in place as well as the renovated building. It would also solve the problems of critical mass and AAP vs Non AAP populations. If transportation is the issue do limited or no bussing. I would gladly drive my kid for an advanced education in an established center-and I'm sure others feel the same, since clearly the main issue here is money (or lack thereof in FCPS) driving these decisions.

It doesn't make sense when Cooper is under capacity because they send AAP students to Longfeloow and Longfellow is over capacity becasue of those same students. There are plenty of AAP students in the Cooper district for a robust AAp program. I would also send half the expereince AAP teachers at Longfellow to Cooper so they can benefit from the experienced teacher resources. The extracurricular stuff could easily be done at Cooper now. I don't know why they don't do it currently. The issue isn't money (as it wouldn't save all that much), it is space and the fact that the over large AAP population at Longfellow adversely affects the Gen- Ed population at Longfellow.

Therein lies the problem-none of the Longfellow teachers would be willing to come over to Cooper to get a new center up and running-if there were, I'm sure parents at Churchill and Spring Hill would feel differently about allowing their kids to be a "guinea pig" for a new center. It takes time and energy as well as appropriate, qualified center teachers to lead a new center-and despite all of the recent talk on the subject, Cooper seems to be doing nothing in the meantime to make itself more attractive to kids currently at the Churchill Road Center or Spring Hill local level IV.

I sure as heck don't want my 5th grader to be part of the pseudo-center at Cooper they keep talking about creating, and I doubt many would-and given property taxes I pay to live in the Langley pyramid, it should be my choice to do what's best for my kid.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'll just point out again that it's not Longfellow enrollment trends that will force changes at Cooper. It's the declining enrollment at Cooper and the overcrowding at Kilmer, which gets the Cooper AAP kids from Great Falls.

So it's fair to all of a sudden overcrowd Cooper overnight and force kids into trailers when Longfellow just undertook a nice renovation to increase capacity (I can't comment on Kilmer since I know nothing about their building or future renovation plans).

Longfellow is at capacity even with its Reno. It is slated to go over capacity shortly. People are not saying to do it over night. This has been talked about for at least a year and Cooper is slated to be under capacity. I don't think it is fair for Cooper parents to continue to deny AAP to their neighborhood children and require them to be bussed all the way across town to Longfellow. I also don't think it is fair for Cooper parents to say they don't want their AAP students but that they perfectly fine for them to be overwhelming another school's resources. Cooper should take care of its own students - all of them.

I remember you parents from the Haycock AAP redistricting last year. Longfellow is not even over capacity yet (as many other schools are) and you're complaining and pushing kids out already.