Lawyers--how do you know the writing is on the wall that your days are numbered?

[Anonymous]

OP here. I would add that the negative review was a combination of low hours and time management. I transitioned to a new practice area. I felt like the work and training were not there. They felt like I took too long on things for them to take the time to train me in the new area.

[Anonymous]

I know it hard but try to rate yourself objectively in the firm. If there was a draft who would draft you(what partner) and what round would you go?

[Anonymous]

If you're still junior why not take this opportunity to jump to another firm if you can and get a re-do. If you look around, many associates by fifth year have been at two firms. I know some partners who have been at five firms. It gives you a chance to expand your network. Stay friendly with the folks at your old firm. Ten years or so passes by quickly and if you are in a certain practice area like tax or energy you may very well be speaking on ABA panels with the people from your old firms in the future. They may send you work. It's part of networking.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Previous post about Big Law associate being let go, I'm curious, for those who have been let go (or anticipated it) how did you know the writing was on the wall?

I ask because I have been at my firm a year and a half, but my first review went poorly and I am not happy. I am looking for a new job, but in the meantime things are going better, so I feel less urgency. I also don't want to take a job just to take one, but want to hold out for the right opportunity. Still I fear passing up a decent opportunity, for the right one, only to be suddenly let go. I hope I'm not missing the signs that I should get out of there ASAP.

They feel like they already told you that it wasn't going to work out by giving you a bad performance review. Its going better now b/c they assume you are looking for another job and they are giving you a few months to exit stage left before they push you off the boat. Trust us. Once you get a bad review at a firm (even a first review), you are screwed there. Just trying to help you out.

They are ruthless but polite. And they talk in code. Please do not stay until the end. A bit gruesome.

[Anonymous]

Sorry a CLE panel is beyond meaningless. I got let go and I was on client pitches!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you're still junior why not take this opportunity to jump to another firm if you can and get a re-do. If you look around, many associates by fifth year have been at two firms. I know some partners who have been at five firms. It gives you a chance to expand your network. Stay friendly with the folks at your old firm. Ten years or so passes by quickly and if you are in a certain practice area like tax or energy you may very well be speaking on ABA panels with the people from your old firms in the future. They may send you work. It's part of networking.

This is great advice.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP here. I would add that the negative review was a combination of low hours and time management. I transitioned to a new practice area. I felt like the work and training were not there. They felt like I took too long on things for them to take the time to train me in the new area.

Based on this information, it is clear tome that you have been told the fit is not a good fit for you.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Sorry a CLE panel is beyond meaningless. I got let go and I was on client pitches!

My point wasn't to be on CLE panels as an associate. My point was in part that it's a surprisingly small world, and time passes quickly and you may find yourself speaking alongside the people who let you go ten years ago and they will remember you and see you've made something of yourself after leaving your first firm.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Previous post about Big Law associate being let go, I'm curious, for those who have been let go (or anticipated it) how did you know the writing was on the wall?

I ask because I have been at my firm a year and a half, but my first review went poorly and I am not happy. I am looking for a new job, but in the meantime things are going better, so I feel less urgency. I also don't want to take a job just to take one, but want to hold out for the right opportunity. Still I fear passing up a decent opportunity, for the right one, only to be suddenly let go. I hope I'm not missing the signs that I should get out of there ASAP.

They feel like they already told you that it wasn't going to work out by giving you a bad performance review. Its going better now b/c they assume you are looking for another job and they are giving you a few months to exit stage left before they push you off the boat. Trust us. Once you get a bad review at a firm (even a first review), you are screwed there. Just trying to help you out.

They are ruthless but polite. And they talk in code. Please do not stay until the end. A bit gruesome.

When I say gruesome, the damage to your sense of self worth, especially starting out your career, is very damaging. Leave before they ask you to go. And keep your relationships.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm the original poster and frankly kind of surprised by the universal sentiment that I'm dunzo. Yikes. I guess I'm more vulnerable than I realized.

One question, does it make a difference if the written review was mixed, but the oral part of the review was negative? Should I take an solace in the fact that I've been asked to participate in a firm sponsored CLE panel in a few months? What if I'm the only associate in the group? Just wondering if those facts make a difference.

I think the sentiment of these posts reminds me I should feel 100% confident in my decision to leave, and I'm also getting the message I shouldn't wait too long to leave.

Thanks!

Sorry, but it is common practice to keep the written review somewhat non-committal, even though that's stupid. I want to be clear, having been laid off in BIGLAW--your days are numbered. I'm really, really sorry, but I was blindsided (had high hours, but firm practice group drama several layers above me did me in) and can't bear to think of someone else in the position I was in.

[Anonymous]

All those who are saying he needs to leave ASAP:

What is one gets one bad review from a partner one year (who was pissed bc the associate escaped from the case) and three glowing reviews? Should that associate still try to get out ASAP?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All those who are saying he needs to leave ASAP:

What is one gets one bad review from a partner one year (who was pissed bc the associate escaped from the case) and three glowing reviews? Should that associate still try to get out ASAP?

That really depends on the situation. Are you well loved by someone who keeps you busy? I had the above happen to me with no worries at all (in fact I got a double bonus). But it was clear that I was just being used as a cheap shot in a war between my very powerful partner and one that was being squeezed out. It was ugly but in no way was it a sign of job insecurity for me.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All those who are saying he needs to leave ASAP:

What is one gets one bad review from a partner one year (who was pissed bc the associate escaped from the case) and three glowing reviews? Should that associate still try to get out ASAP?

Hard to say without knowing the relative power of the partners involved AND whether the management committee is looking to chop heads to boost PPP. Layoffs, in my experience, tend to be less review-driven than in most other industries. Law firms tend to use reviews as a signalling device to associates, rather than a true method of assessing performance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:All those who are saying he needs to leave ASAP:

What is one gets one bad review from a partner one year (who was pissed bc the associate escaped from the case) and three glowing reviews? Should that associate still try to get out ASAP?

Probably not a problem if the associate can keep his/her plate full with work from other partners, the associate will not need the support of that partner in the future and the associate can still be successful despite that partner taking shots at him/her behind closed doors. This happened to me. One partner and I had a series of misunderstands that resulted in him wanting to give me a bad review. Even though he was told his review was not consistent with the high reviews I was getting from other more established partners, he pushed ahead. It did not keep me from making partner, but eventually I knew I had to practice somewhere else because many of my backers left the firm and that partner's power in the firm grew considerably over time.