Unions

[Anonymous]

jsteele wrote:Again, however, there is no underlying law saying you have to join a union. The absence of a right to work law does not immediately lead to a situation in which all employees are forced to join unions.

The OP's original question was whether "under Obama, everyone at a unionized company would be forced to join the union even against personal choice?" Are you suggesting that the answer is anything other than "no"?

The point is that under Obama, it is very likely that there will be a sea change in our labor laws. Changes that Obama will be pushing for include removing the secret ballot election for determining whether an employee will be represented by a union and removing the law that allows employees in right-to-work states the freedom to not join a union.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

jsteele wrote:Again, however, there is no underlying law saying you have to join a union. The absence of a right to work law does not immediately lead to a situation in which all employees are forced to join unions.

The OP's original question was whether "under Obama, everyone at a unionized company would be forced to join the union even against personal choice?" Are you suggesting that the answer is anything other than "no"?

The point is that under Obama, it is very likely that there will be a sea change in our labor laws. Changes that Obama will be pushing for include removing the secret ballot election for determining whether an employee will be represented by a union and removing the law that allows employees in right-to-work states the freedom to not join a union.

Totally agree. In the 70's I saw the UAW literally run a small, profitable manufacturer out of business - and my Dad lost his job as a consequence. I look at Boeing right now and fear history repeating itself. All those orders Boeing has on the books? They will walk if they need the product and the machinists (?) stay out on strike. GM - total union issue. Did you know that the most expensive component of a new GM car is employee/retiree health insurance? (not an argument not to offer insurance, but come on guys!)

[jsteele]

Anonymous wrote:Did you know that the most expensive component of a new GM car is employee/retiree health insurance? (not an argument not to offer insurance, but come on guys!)

And, did you know that the same is not true for cars built in Canada because they have socialized (the horror) health care? Its not the union's fault that it has to negotiate benefits that are government-provided in other countries.

[Anonymous]

I'm sorry. Is anyone posting on this thread actually currently a union member?

I am, and a proud one. My union ensures that my colleagues and I have a voice and influence in our workplace. We are very much interested in the success of our industry.

A union is what its members make it.

The health care benefits that my union negotiated for in our contract ensure that I and my family can do things like go to the dentist and afford our medication. The match in my 401K plan, COLA increases, and pay scale for work actually done instead of who's the favorite were negotiated through my union in our contract.

If I screw up, I can be fired. But you better be able to prove I screwed up. It's in my union-negotiated contract.

Union-negotiated benefits and pay often set the tone for benefits throughout an industry.

So, you're welcome.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I'm sorry. Is anyone posting on this thread actually currently a union member?

I am, and a proud one. My union ensures that my colleagues and I have a voice and influence in our workplace. We are very much interested in the success of our industry.

A union is what its members make it.

The health care benefits that my union negotiated for in our contract ensure that I and my family can do things like go to the dentist and afford our medication. The match in my 401K plan, COLA increases, and pay scale for work actually done instead of who's the favorite were negotiated through my union in our contract.

If I screw up, I can be fired. But you better be able to prove I screwed up. It's in my union-negotiated contract.

Union-negotiated benefits and pay often set the tone for benefits throughout an industry.

Thank you. Seriously, I think unions are great -- in theory, and sometimes in practice. But just like anything else with power, they are subject to corruption. And when people who don't do the work are looking to gain from the negotiations or contracts, they begin to seem corrupt. Employers should be allowed to fire poor performers. But there are too many unions that fight for people who don't deserve the effort (you know, the guys who never show up, take more breaks than they should, don't work as hard as everyone else, etc, and the union backs them up, files grievances on their behalf, etc). Sometimes you have to meet in the middle, and it seems like union negotiators often are not willing to do so (which is a very different statement than union members are not willing to). Management sometimes isn't either, of course.

So, you're welcome.

[Anonymous]

I grew up in a union family. I was a college professor at a time when we tried to organize and were told by the Supreme Court that we were management because we made "management decisions" like giving students grades.

I can't dispute that unions are not perfect. However, having imperfect unions and imperfect management balancing each other is a heck of a lot better than imperfect management controlling a non-union shop.

I feel sorry for those companies who actually care about their employees, but are hurt by unions that don't, but I think that is much less of a risk than allowing unions to be squashed the way administrations like Bush's would like to.

[Anonymous]

15:43 made a very correct statement in that "unions are what the members make it", or something close, however in my experience )and yes, I have worked with union shops for quite a long time, negotiated contracts, settled arbitration, etc), the majority of union business leaders distort the majority of situations and this protects sub-par employees. This is the negative impact of the unions. There is nothing that should get in the way of proper, complete benefits for any employee, but if the entire employee base (managers and hourly employees) don't compromise during periods of need then companies go out of business - plain and simple.

In my experience, the employees are capable of negotiating their own conflicts, the trouble ensues when business agents distort the reality...