does anybody have any experiences with reproductive immunology? is it legit?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, I'm a bit like you. Had 5 m/cs, all before age of 35, and have MTHFR variation. Also was lucky enough to have one healthy pregnancy in there, so I have that to be thankful for. WHen I asked my OB if I should go down the immunology path, he strongly advised against it, and actually said it was a fraud and gave women false hope. This guy has decades of experience and isn't adverse to other specialists; we've talked about PGD as my next option.

Anyhow, if you're thinking about where the best value for your budget it, my dr's rec was PGD over immunology.

What a shame that a doctor would spread that kind of misinformation.

[Anonymous]

I don't have personal experience with reproductive immunology... but I do have a coworker who had been TTC for many, many years without success. I don't know what other ART methods they'd tried, but in the end they went to a doctor, did some kind of immune-suppressing treatment, and she got pregnant with twins, who are healthy babies now.

[Anonymous]

I agree with 8:55 just because a doctor doesn't believe in it doesn't mean it doesn't work. It must be that they believe in certain aspects of reproductive immunology but not others. I don't think there are a lot of REs out there who would not put someone on blood thinners if they test positive for APS, which is autoimmune.

Give it 20 years, using treatments like G-CSF for thin lining and RPL will become mainstream. By then we will also know the conditions it treats so other doctors can run the same tests that only RIs run now. At that point some REs will eventually have to face that they were wrong and there was a lot of women they didn't help because they made a choice to exclude it in their treatment.

I'm not saying it's what everyone needs, but my DD would not be here without doctors out there like Braverman who continue to do research and push the field beyond where it would be otherwise.

[Anonymous]

Well, I have a friend who had 10 m/c's, 3 of then while working with Braverman. She quit working with him and after a few years, finally wound up getting pregnant with an embryo that stuck and is now in her second trimester. I don't know that immune treatment works. I think it's just a matter of hitting the right egg.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I agree with 8:55 just because a doctor doesn't believe in it doesn't mean it doesn't work. It must be that they believe in certain aspects of reproductive immunology but not others. I don't think there are a lot of REs out there who would not put someone on blood thinners if they test positive for APS, which is autoimmune.

Give it 20 years, using treatments like G-CSF for thin lining and RPL will become mainstream. By then we will also know the conditions it treats so other doctors can run the same tests that only RIs run now. At that point some REs will eventually have to face that they were wrong and there was a lot of women they didn't help because they made a choice to exclude it in their treatment.

I'm not saying it's what everyone needs, but my DD would not be here without doctors out there like Braverman who continue to do research and push the field beyond where it would be otherwise.

+1

[Anonymous]

thanks everyone. i'm not sure if it's bad eggs or bad luck. probably bad eggs. the pregnancy that got the furtherest (on blood thinners and progesterone) tested positive for downs and then died. i know i'm taking a risk. i did ncivf this last time and we're paying for everything out of pocket. my doc said roll the dice on the genes b/c the cost of pgd high for ncivf (horrible on hormones which is why i've gone that route). i told myself this last time was last try b/c this sucks. that's why i wondered if ri worth exploring. would like answers before i decide if this is *really* my last try. first 4 were natural. last 2 iui's. then negative ivf. maybe it's just not in my future. regardless, you've given me a lot to consider and i appreciate it.

[Anonymous]

Good luck, OP, and everyone else too. Your last post raised an the crux of the issue question that my OB couldn't totally answer: do I have bad eggs or bad luck? To be fair, he said it might be bad sperm, too, that could be contributing to chromosomal issues w/fertilized eggs, as one of my prior m/cs was a trisomy. One instance of a trisomy may indicate a greater proportion of "bad" eggs.

But he said it could just be really bad luck; that was the diagnosis I got from the Cornell Weill Ctr in NY. Both docs said that my number would eventually come up (never mind the toll it would take to get there).

Anyhow, there's a really unsatisfying black hole where I feel like there SHOULD be an answer. I find great interest in some of the posts of women who have been down this road, did PGD, and posted the proportion of good eggs/bad eggs retrieved. Does anyone ever do PGD after recurrent m/cs and get more than half "good" eggs?

[Anonymous]

If possible you really should try to have testing done post-miscarriage. If you're miscarrying normal embryos that would be a pretty sure sign that something other than "bad eggs" is to blame.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:thanks everyone. i'm not sure if it's bad eggs or bad luck. probably bad eggs. the pregnancy that got the furtherest (on blood thinners and progesterone) tested positive for downs and then died. i know i'm taking a risk. i did ncivf this last time and we're paying for everything out of pocket. my doc said roll the dice on the genes b/c the cost of pgd high for ncivf (horrible on hormones which is why i've gone that route). i told myself this last time was last try b/c this sucks. that's why i wondered if ri worth exploring. would like answers before i decide if this is *really* my last try. first 4 were natural. last 2 iui's. then negative ivf. maybe it's just not in my future. regardless, you've given me a lot to consider and i appreciate it.

6:55 again. My doctor told me something similar in the beginning. And it is true that it is more cost effective to keeping getting pg and miscarrying than it is to shell out $5000 for PGD. But, seriously, how many miscarriages are you expected to endure??? Honestly, this advice is so infuriating. The psychological consequences of enduring multiple miscarriages are very serious side effects and it makes me so mad that doctors treat that so lightly. More than worth it to avoid them if at all possible. I cannot tell you the peace I found after I saw those PGD results. It's going to take us two more years to pay for that round but it's worth very penny.

And btw, there should be no difference for PGD between medicated and unmedicated cycles. The embryos are tested on day 5 after retrieval and fertilization. You are pretty much out of it at that point. Not sure why it should matter if ncivf or not. Do they not do 5-day transfers with ncivf or something? Are you in the DC area? Can you do a consult at GW? GW does PGD and they also do ncivf. Ask them if they can do both together.

[Anonymous]

Has OP done the microarray sperm testing? It's only a few hundred dollars.

[Anonymous]

we've done all the infertility testing. no problems with my man or any genetic stuff, only the factor 2 and folate discovered. 6:55..you're right. i don't know how many miscarriages i'm supposed to endure.
they all seem very cheerful about it happening at some point. but it's eaten up four years. *really* want a kid and would love for it to be our kid. but it takes me months to recover from each one. i've been going to dominion and dr d seems positive it'll happen at some point. if i do it again, pgd will be part of it. it would answer a lot of questions and would make me feel like i've done everything i can.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:thanks everyone. i'm not sure if it's bad eggs or bad luck. probably bad eggs. the pregnancy that got the furtherest (on blood thinners and progesterone) tested positive for downs and then died. i know i'm taking a risk. i did ncivf this last time and we're paying for everything out of pocket. my doc said roll the dice on the genes b/c the cost of pgd high for ncivf (horrible on hormones which is why i've gone that route). i told myself this last time was last try b/c this sucks. that's why i wondered if ri worth exploring. would like answers before i decide if this is *really* my last try. first 4 were natural. last 2 iui's. then negative ivf. maybe it's just not in my future. regardless, you've given me a lot to consider and i appreciate it.

6:55 again. My doctor told me something similar in the beginning. And it is true that it is more cost effective to keeping getting pg and miscarrying than it is to shell out $5000 for PGD. But, seriously, how many miscarriages are you expected to endure??? Honestly, this advice is so infuriating. The psychological consequences of enduring multiple miscarriages are very serious side effects and it makes me so mad that doctors treat that so lightly. More than worth it to avoid them if at all possible. I cannot tell you the peace I found after I saw those PGD results. It's going to take us two more years to pay for that round but it's worth very penny.

And btw, there should be no difference for PGD between medicated and unmedicated cycles. The embryos are tested on day 5 after retrieval and fertilization. You are pretty much out of it at that point. Not sure why it should matter if ncivf or not. Do they not do 5-day transfers with ncivf or something? Are you in the DC area? Can you do a consult at GW? GW does PGD and they also do ncivf. Ask them if they can do both together.

PGD would definitely not be worth it with NCIVF, because you will get one or two eggs and that is not definitive enough--one egg being bad would not mean all your eggs are bad--and the cost of testing one is the same as of testing many.

I think an RPL specialist, a trusted one, is the best bet.

[Anonymous]

what does rpl mean? new to forums and not familiar with all the acronyms. thanks.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:what does rpl mean? new to forums and not familiar with all the acronyms. thanks.

Recurrent pregnancy loss

[Anonymous]

Also, this is the test I posted about the other day:

https://www.scsadiagnostics.com/home

It is not part of the standard genetic testing or sperm analysis. It tests the DNA fragmentation in the sperm.