Sp or Ch language?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:We chose Chinese. I'm Asian. Parents and relatives live in Asia. The entire Pacific Rim and Australia is learning Mandarin. China is our #1 trading partner surpassing the U.S. I don't know anyone who speaks Spanish except a cousin and my brother who speak a little from treating patients at large teaching hospitals. I speak French in addition to English and my native language. My DH speaks French so we would prefer French as a third language for DC. We like to vacation in Asia and/or mostly French speaking countries. Like pp said, it depends on the context.

i lived 10 years in australia and did not observe that students are learning mandarin, At least not in schools. In fact, language immersion, in general is almost impossible to find (within the School system). I have done a ton of research because i would love to move back and i am trying desperately to find a mandarin language immersion program For my son. Pls let me know if you are aware of these types of schools within australia, thank you!!

Maybe you can do a search. We lived in Australia many yrs ago when I was little so unfortunately I can't be much assistance I'm afraid. From what I hear from relatives, many families send the kids off to China for summer language camp and many schools offer Mandarin in elementary schools - learning Mandarin is all the rage there.

[Anonymous]

PP again: China is Australia's largest trading partner as it is for many/most of the countries in Asia now so it's not surpring that Mandarin is popular with Asians and Aussies.

So it depends on the context... Obviously, we feel Chinese will be more useful for DC but maybe Spanish will be more useful for your DC.

[Anonymous]

I think it also depends on your resources both in time and money. I know some parents in the MoCo's College Garden's Chinese immersion and they spend a lot of money on Chinese summer camp and on weekend program in Chinese to reinforce the language. Doing the same with Spanish is just not as hard. Similarly knowing Spanish can help you with English in that it has a lot of Latin based roots. Also do you think you will stay in this area, if you are going to move the likelihood of finding an immersion Chinese program is much smaller than an immersion Spanish program.

[Anonymous]

We'd certainly go with Spanish if we didn't speak Chinese at home. We're one of the many American Born Chinese families in the city avoiding Yu Ying. We're hardly alone in thinking it ridiculous for DC charter to support an immersion school without a Chinese community behind it, due to the lack of a lottery for bilingual kids, the norm in some other US cities with Chinese-immersion schools (NYC, San Fran). The atmosphere at YY is far too strange and politically correct for the likes of us. If our kid is going to be one of the only bilingual (Chinese-English) kids in a particular school, we'd rather avoid the schlep to Brookland - our IB school is great.

[Anonymous]

My kid goes to YY and I am happy they are learning Chinese, but think that realistically he won't become anywhere close to fluent unless they decide to pursue it themselves in middle/high school/college. Maybe their time at YY sparks an interest in China/Chinese language that may take them on a career path that uses it, but I really don't have an insight if that will happen or not. I see Spanish as far more useful in day to day life--from a geographic stand point; from the fact that Spanish helps your average person build relationships with many recent immigrant arrivals, etc.

[Anonymous]

Of course Spanish is more useful than Chinese, but I think a lot of parents are attracted to the perceived academic rigor of Chinese and Yu Ying. There is no doubt that studying any second language as a child will enhance his or her ability to learn any language later in life.

It could be argued that Spanish is a relatively easy language for English speakers to learn, so a child would benefit more from early experiences with a more difficult language such as Chinese or Russian. These can be really difficult for English speakers to master later.

[Anonymous]

PP here - Meant to say that Spanish is more useful here in DC! Don't flame me.

[Anonymous]

I'll give some personal context.

I learned Japanese as student in high school. Liked it so much I went to Japan for a year. Came back reasonably fluent. Moved to DC. Didn't make Japanese friends, just happy to have the friends I made as part of regular life. Took a couple language classes, but didn't obsess over Japanese things or try to get NHK on my cable or find obscure calligraphy classes. Just lived a normal life. And surprise, surprise, most of the Japanese has been forgotten. I have no reasonable reason to use it.

On the other hand, my wife speaks Spanish. Many of my neighbors do. My kid's day care providers speak Spanish. Just talking to my wife and neighbors and taking a couple classes has been enough to make my Spanish pretty decent and I can maintain it within the course of a normal, American life. I can watch novelas or Sunday shows in Spanish on regular TV. I can talk to people at the pool.

I think if you want to have a kid that speaks Chinese, you have to expect that they would be able to have some use for it in the typical course of their life, without having to be obsessed about it, because nobody can maintain that level of obsession required to keep it up without environmental support. Think about whether you and your children live that life, and what it might mean for your child's future.

If we all lived in NYC or SF, great. But this is DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Of course Spanish is more useful than Chinese, but I think a lot of parents are attracted to the perceived academic rigor of Chinese and Yu Ying. There is no doubt that studying any second language as a child will enhance his or her ability to learn any language later in life.

It could be argued that Spanish is a relatively easy language for English speakers to learn, so a child would benefit more from early experiences with a more difficult language such as Chinese or Russian. These can be really difficult for English speakers to master later.

This was our thinking as well. It's a given that Chinese, English, and Spanish are going to be the most important languages of the future. This isn't just about economics, it's about demographics. The second most common language on the internet after English is Chinese (which is not surprising, considering that 1 in 4 people on the planet speak Chinese, and their economic impact is growing). That isn't going to change unless someone wipes China off the map (which won't be us, since they're going to be our financial overlords). That said, as an American today, it's largely more practical on the streets to speak Spanish, and that trend will only increase.

In the end, we chose Chinese. It's one of the hardest languages for English-speakers to learn, whereas Spanish is the easiest. If DS can master Mandarin, we're confident he can master Spanish. Also, now that we know all the immersion schools are working on an Immersion/International Bac MS/HS, we think he can pick up Spanish as a 3rd language easily.

Again, that was our thinking. YMMV. In the end, you're better off with either Chinese or Spanish than anything else (especially including the vanilla "we-don't-care-about-globalism" English-only).

[Anonymous]

¡Español Chica!

[Anonymous]

It's not always a question of "usefulness".
I know that in California, where Spanish is practically the official language, some people chose French for their kids instead of Spanish.
French may not be as useful as Spanish in Los Angeles, but it will set these kids apart from the barios. Regardless of how one feels about these kind of decisions, they are real.
(and no, I don't live in California, although I do speak French...)

[Anonymous]

If you lived in MoCo and had more than a passing interest in Chinese language and culture, I'd recommend immersion there. But I agree with posters pointing out that Yu Ying offers a strangely sanitized version of Chinese at best. My wife, a Chinese immigrant, wasn't at all happy with the fact that our kid was really the only bilingual child in her grade. We switched to a MoCo immersion ES and the difference was night & day - Chinese administrators, droves of Chinese parents involved in the school, many other bilingual children to model the language and culture for the non-Chinese. Moreover, not many low-income kids, but the ones they took received all sorts of targetted support (including trips to China and language summer camp) so no non-immersion/second track as at YY, another aspect I like.

Very few of the YY parents seemed to care much about the situation, perhaps the most troubling aspect to my wife. So if you're fine with Chinese immersion without Chinese kids, other than in a handful of cases (don't be fooled by all the Asian-looking kids, the great majority girls adopted from China by white couples), Yu Ying rocks. You'll hear the administrators and parents arguing that there's no way around it - DC Charter won't countenance a lottery for bilingual kids. But we spoke to members of the Charter Board about the situation and they denied this - said that if YY 's PA ever lobbied for two lotteries, they'd almost certainly get two. They don't and won't.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If you lived in MoCo and had more than a passing interest in Chinese language and culture, I'd recommend immersion there. But I agree with posters pointing out that Yu Ying offers a strangely sanitized version of Chinese at best. My wife, a Chinese immigrant, wasn't at all happy with the fact that our kid was really the only bilingual child in her grade. We switched to a MoCo immersion ES and the difference was night & day - Chinese administrators, droves of Chinese parents involved in the school, many other bilingual children to model the language and culture for the non-Chinese. Moreover, not many low-income kids, but the ones they took received all sorts of targetted support (including trips to China and language summer camp) so no non-immersion/second track as at YY, another aspect I like.

Very few of the YY parents seemed to care much about the situation, perhaps the most troubling aspect to my wife. So if you're fine with Chinese immersion without Chinese kids, other than in a handful of cases (don't be fooled by all the Asian-looking kids, the great majority girls adopted from China by white couples), Yu Ying rocks. You'll hear the administrators and parents arguing that there's no way around it - DC Charter won't countenance a lottery for bilingual kids. But we spoke to members of the Charter Board about the situation and they denied this - said that if YY 's PA ever lobbied for two lotteries, they'd almost certainly get two. They don't and won't.

But, we don't live in MoCo. This is a DC forum. See, it's right there in the upper left of the page.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you lived in MoCo and had more than a passing interest in Chinese language and culture, I'd recommend immersion there. But I agree with posters pointing out that Yu Ying offers a strangely sanitized version of Chinese at best. My wife, a Chinese immigrant, wasn't at all happy with the fact that our kid was really the only bilingual child in her grade. We switched to a MoCo immersion ES and the difference was night & day - Chinese administrators, droves of Chinese parents involved in the school, many other bilingual children to model the language and culture for the non-Chinese. Moreover, not many low-income kids, but the ones they took received all sorts of targetted support (including trips to China and language summer camp) so no non-immersion/second track as at YY, another aspect I like.

Very few of the YY parents seemed to care much about the situation, perhaps the most troubling aspect to my wife. So if you're fine with Chinese immersion without Chinese kids, other than in a handful of cases (don't be fooled by all the Asian-looking kids, the great majority girls adopted from China by white couples), Yu Ying rocks. You'll hear the administrators and parents arguing that there's no way around it - DC Charter won't countenance a lottery for bilingual kids. But we spoke to members of the Charter Board about the situation and they denied this - said that if YY 's PA ever lobbied for two lotteries, they'd almost certainly get two. They don't and won't.

I find this highly doubtful. Who at the Charter Board did you speak to?

[Anonymous]

Haven't posted here yet, but am always glad to see ABCs talking back on these threads. It is absurd that YY doesn't reach out to Chinese parents, and that the concept of offering bilingual kids preferential treatment in the admissions process for the school's benefit seems anathema to the (non-Chinese) administrators, and most parents (those who would need to make the case to the DC Charter Board). It's a no brainer that a Chinese immersion school should be at least 1/3 Chinese-speaking kids, as in Rockville, preferably half, as in NYC.

We're ABCs who turned down a spot, not wanting to be fish out of water there either. Nobody running the school seemed even to have heard for our dialect, spoken by more than 100 million Chinese. There was just too big of a disconnect between Planet YY and us, with our stacks of DVDs from China, my in-laws living with us to provide childcare, our weekend Skype sessions with family in China, our month-long summer visits to HK etc. Yes, the odd English-speaking kid with an extraordinary language learning aptitude will go on to become fluent in Mandarin, but I can't see most getting v. far under the circumstances they're learning the language. China will remain a v. foreign place to the YY kids unless they live there as HS exchange students, college study abroad students or whatever.