New FCPS report cards - no letter grades?!?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First: kindergarten, first and second have always had this kind of report (although first and second have used Outstanding, good, satisfactory and needs improvement). It makes sense in the lower grades where they don't have tests and therefore, they don't have numeric scores to compare to benchmarks.

However, once kids start taking quizzes and tests, IMO, they should be given actual grades. I really hate the "always shows this skill," "sometimes shows this skill," etc. for the mid/upper elementary grades. Kids need to know that getting a "C" is not acceptable (in my house it isn't ) and they should know where they stand compared the the amount of material they were taught and expected to learn. When parents see "sometimes shows this skill" it sounds like == eh, it's probably good enough. Parents don't have a good idea of whether they need to help/push their kids more or if they are doing ok.

I've seen this even in first grade. The reports/comments are written with such positive language, that it doesn't really tell parents where their child is falling behind. I have seen kids whose reading skills were way behind. The parents probably don't know that the child is behind b/c the comments are something like "is working toward full comprehension of passages" == which sounds ok. Except, in real life, that kid is not keeping up with the benchmarks in first grade.

They take away all the worksheet and work products -- so parents don't get regular feedback on the child's work. Then they put in these fuzzy, feel-good comments that make it sound like everyone is successful, and THEN, they wonder why parents aren't helping their kids more and why the kids are behind! There is a connection.

Bring back the letter grades for the middle/upper elementary kids!

You sound like one of those hyper-competitive parents who is never satisfied and is always pushing, pushing, pushing. I really don't care what grades my kids get. Grades don't tell me how well my child has mastered the material or if he's doing his best work, giving school his best effort. You have no idea what other parents know or don't know about their kids. It's also none of your business. You should focus more on your own child and if you don't understand where your child is in terms of his learning, feel free to ask for a conference.

Whatever. I'm the one helping the kids who are FAR behind where they should be. My kid is the one who only gets to have a small group session with the teacher once a week b/c she's too busy meeting with the kids who are behind. So, it kind of IS my business if you "don't care what grades my kids get" b/c your failure to care and help YOUR child is taking instructional time away from MY child (and the other children) who are on target and whose parents must be helping them at home to get on (or above target). It's hard to be motivated to offer my time to help children who are behind when their own parents don't put in a similar effort. I'm assuming that it is not for lack of interest (on the part of the parent), but simply a lack of understanding of what they should be doing and lack of understanding that their child is behind. Frankly, I was shocked to find out how little teacher-to-student time was actually happening in the class. When I finally got my head around the reality that that's how it is in public school, then I personally took more responsibility for ensuring that my child met the benchmarks (and actually exceeded them). I believe a lot of parents haven't made that connection yet b/c they aren't in the classroom to see how little time their child actually gets in a small group with a teacher.

As for letter grades... why shouldn't a third, fourth, fifth or sixth grader be rewarded with an A if they are doing very well. I think letter grades can motivate students and can give students pride. It has nothing to do with bragging about my kid. Grades are the reward for good work.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

As for letter grades... why shouldn't a third, fourth, fifth or sixth grader be rewarded with an A if they are doing very well. I think letter grades can motivate students and can give students pride. It has nothing to do with bragging about my kid. Grades are the reward for good work.

Exactly. A student in upper elementary grades has likely heard "do your best" and "try your hardest" and you'll get good grades. This "we'll give you a number" system does very little to motivate the student.

[Anonymous]

I am a teacher (MS), and I like this new system, although we aren't seeing it yet across the board in middle school (although I believe it will only be a matter of time). IMO, letter grades are often misleading and do not tell the parent if a student has a B because they are struggling with x but great at doing y...and that is what these new report cards are trying to do. Many benchmarks are covered every quarter, and just labelling your child with a B or C for all of them is misleading. Wouldn't you rather know which ones your child is struggling with, vs which ones he/she is proficient in? For the pp who stated a "c" isn't acceptable in your house, fair enough, but this way, your child will be able to work with you and the teacher on the he/she really struggles with, rather than everything that was taught that quarter or on a test. So from a teacher's viewpoint (at least this teacher), it allows us to pinpoint with better accuracy where the issues are with children. For example, if little Johnny isn't proficient in benchmark x on a test that covered benchmark x,y, and z, he only really needs to focus on x and master x, rather than being re-taught all 3 of the benchmarks. During parent conferences, I can give accurate descriptions of how your child is doing-little Johnny really excelled at understanding the differences between a plant and animal cell, but he needs to work on understanding the importance of the levels of tissue organization. Now, both of those benchmarks are including in the same unit, covered on the same test. If little Johnny got a B, I wouldn't know at a glance WHY. And as the many wonderful, involved parents are constantly asking me how their child can improve, I can literally point to what I have seen and give them concrete examples to improve upon before a re-test or a larger end of unit test.

Here is another reason why I like this: teacher and student accountablility together. Usually, tests cover multiple benchmarks, and the student is taught and given work on all of them. Then the test is given. Here is the problem-it is possible that the student will fail to be proficient on several benchmarks, but since they only make up a small percentage of the test, technically they "pass" with a D or higher. Some teachers even write tests deliberately skewed so that the more "difficult" benchmarks make up such a small percentage of tests that most of their kids will pass the test (even while failing these benchmarks). Clearly this is a distorted version of what is going on.

If you as a parent are longing for As, Bs, Cs, etc, realize that if your child shows "always demonstrates mastery" for most of the benchmarks, that is the same as an A, and even more descriptive. If they are not showing that, at least now you know which ones he/she need to work on.

FWIW, the math department in my middle school has already moved to benchmark grading, even though they still have to give letter grades. This hybrid system is actually the worst...all the teachers who are dealing with it would prefer to just have regular benchmark grading.

Food for thought!

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: You sound like one of those hyper-competitive parents who is never satisfied and is always pushing, pushing, pushing. I really don't care what grades my kids get. Grades don't tell me how well my child has mastered the material or if he's doing his best work, giving school his best effort. You have no idea what other parents know or don't know about their kids. It's also none of your business. You should focus more on your own child and if you don't understand where your child is in terms of his learning, feel free to ask for a conference.

Whatever. I'm the one helping the kids who are FAR behind where they should be. My kid is the one who only gets to have a small group session with the teacher once a week b/c she's too busy meeting with the kids who are behind. So, it kind of IS my business if you "don't care what grades my kids get" b/c your failure to care and help YOUR child is taking instructional time away from MY child (and the other children) who are on target and whose parents must be helping them at home to get on (or above target). It's hard to be motivated to offer my time to help children who are behind when their own parents don't put in a similar effort. I'm assuming that it is not for lack of interest (on the part of the parent), but simply a lack of understanding of what they should be doing and lack of understanding that their child is behind. Frankly, I was shocked to find out how little teacher-to-student time was actually happening in the class. When I finally got my head around the reality that that's how it is in public school, then I personally took more responsibility for ensuring that my child met the benchmarks (and actually exceeded them). I believe a lot of parents haven't made that connection yet b/c they aren't in the classroom to see how little time their child actually gets in a small group with a teacher.

As for letter grades... why shouldn't a third, fourth, fifth or sixth grader be rewarded with an A if they are doing very well. I think letter grades can motivate students and can give students pride. It has nothing to do with bragging about my kid. Grades are the reward for good work.

How condescending you are. There are a lot of reasons why kids don't meet benchmarks (or actually exceed them as you so proudly state). You assume we're aren't doing what you're doing, we don't care or that we just don't 'get it'. You couldn't be more wrong - which is the problem with assuming. Two of my kids have learning disabilities and I don't need someone like you to point out they are behind or to tell me what I should be doing at home. That's not your job and it's certainly none of your business. If you feel your child is being negatively impacted by this, you need to have a conversation with the teacher about YOUR child, not mine.

You can certainly celebrate letter grades but we don't. We reward effort. It's a lot harder for my kids to master the curricula and if we rewarded grades alone, there would be nothing to celebrate. How motivating is that? I also don't care if my kid brings home a "C". A letter grade doesn't tell the whole story and, frankly, 'average' is okay by me. I would much rather have a kid who works his butt off for a C and develops a love of learning and the pride of working through a challenge than a kid who gets an A but doesn't enjoy the journey.

I know I'm not going to convince you. I don't care. But, you really do need to mind your own business and stop assuming things about other kids and other parents.

[Anonymous]

Again.... whatever. I like the letter grades better, although I would like to see more personalized comments. Good luck to you and your student.

And, by the way, the kids I'm referring to are not designated "learning disabled."

[Anonymous]

How would you know? That is completely confidential. Someone really needs to mind her own beeswax. And if your special snowflake is being held back by the unwashed masses, go to private school. You'll fit right in there.

[Anonymous]

I like and prefer this system. I think grades at the elementary level are meaningless anyway and create a great deal of stress for some kids. My DD was in 4th last year and while she got mostly As and a few Bs she was worried all the time. I wish our school was one of the field test schools, but I think we are going to continue to get letter grades this year.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:How would you know? That is completely confidential. Someone really needs to mind her own beeswax. And if your special snowflake is being held back by the unwashed masses, go to private school. You'll fit right in there.

Snippy, snippy. You've got a lot of hate and anger going on... maybe you should calm down.

It's a fact that the teacher spends more time with the kids who are behind. Those who are on target or ahead get less time.

I made no comments about the "unwashed masses" --- that's your issues coming up.

And no, it's not "confidential" which kids are getting attention from the special ed resources, ESOL or other resources. The teacher would not have me, an average parent, work with a child who needed special teaching strategies.

The issue on this thread is whether the new report cards are good. I'm not a fan as of yet. Maybe they will turn out great. I'm pleased with any additional communication that helps parents know where their child is at and gives them a true picture so that they can get involved or help the child as necessary so that every child is meeting grade expectations and fulfilling their potential.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:How would you know? That is completely confidential. Someone really needs to mind her own beeswax. And if your special snowflake is being held back by the unwashed masses, go to private school. You'll fit right in there.

Snippy, snippy. You've got a lot of hate and anger going on... maybe you should calm down.

It's a fact that the teacher spends more time with the kids who are behind. Those who are on target or ahead get less time.

I made no comments about the "unwashed masses" --- that's your issues coming up.

And no, it's not "confidential" which kids are getting attention from the special ed resources, ESOL or other resources. The teacher would not have me, an average parent, work with a child who needed special teaching strategies.

The issue on this thread is whether the new report cards are good. I'm not a fan as of yet. Maybe they will turn out great. I'm pleased with any additional communication that helps parents know where their child is at and gives them a true picture so that they can get involved or help the child as necessary so that every child is meeting grade expectations and fulfilling their potential.

As much as you might like to think so, you have no idea which kids have learning disabilities and which ones don't. Not all of them get pull out or other services or are even identified in the early elementary years. The in-class resource teachers work with all kids, not just those with LD or IEPs. LD kids don't require special in-class teaching strategies, the strategies that work with LD kids work as well with 'normal' kids, in fact, they're often called 'best practices'.

You also need to revise your expectation of the schools. They're goal is not to help every child meet their potential, it's to provide them with an appropriate education. If you want your child to meet her full potential, you should go private.

[Anonymous]

zzzzzz

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First: kindergarten, first and second have always had this kind of report (although first and second have used Outstanding, good, satisfactory and needs improvement). It makes sense in the lower grades where they don't have tests and therefore, they don't have numeric scores to compare to benchmarks.

However, once kids start taking quizzes and tests, IMO, they should be given actual grades. I really hate the "always shows this skill," "sometimes shows this skill," etc. for the mid/upper elementary grades. Kids need to know that getting a "C" is not acceptable (in my house it isn't ) and they should know where they stand compared the the amount of material they were taught and expected to learn. When parents see "sometimes shows this skill" it sounds like == eh, it's probably good enough. Parents don't have a good idea of whether they need to help/push their kids more or if they are doing ok.

I've seen this even in first grade. The reports/comments are written with such positive language, that it doesn't really tell parents where their child is falling behind. I have seen kids whose reading skills were way behind. The parents probably don't know that the child is behind b/c the comments are something like "is working toward full comprehension of passages" == which sounds ok. Except, in real life, that kid is not keeping up with the benchmarks in first grade.

They take away all the worksheet and work products -- so parents don't get regular feedback on the child's work. Then they put in these fuzzy, feel-good comments that make it sound like everyone is successful, and THEN, they wonder why parents aren't helping their kids more and why the kids are behind! There is a connection.

Bring back the letter grades for the middle/upper elementary kids!

You sound like one of those hyper-competitive parents who is never satisfied and is always pushing, pushing, pushing. I really don't care what grades my kids get. Grades don't tell me how well my child has mastered the material or if he's doing his best work, giving school his best effort. You have no idea what other parents know or don't know about their kids. It's also none of your business. You should focus more on your own child and if you don't understand where your child is in terms of his learning, feel free to ask for a conference.

Whatever. I'm the one helping the kids who are FAR behind where they should be. My kid is the one who only gets to have a small group session with the teacher once a week b/c she's too busy meeting with the kids who are behind. So, it kind of IS my business if you "don't care what grades my kids get" b/c your failure to care and help YOUR child is taking instructional time away from MY child (and the other children) who are on target and whose parents must be helping them at home to get on (or above target). It's hard to be motivated to offer my time to help children who are behind when their own parents don't put in a similar effort. I'm assuming that it is not for lack of interest (on the part of the parent), but simply a lack of understanding of what they should be doing and lack of understanding that their child is behind. Frankly, I was shocked to find out how little teacher-to-student time was actually happening in the class. When I finally got my head around the reality that that's how it is in public school, then I personally took more responsibility for ensuring that my child met the benchmarks (and actually exceeded them). I believe a lot of parents haven't made that connection yet b/c they aren't in the classroom to see how little time their child actually gets in a small group with a teacher.

As for letter grades... why shouldn't a third, fourth, fifth or sixth grader be rewarded with an A if they are doing very well. I think letter grades can motivate students and can give students pride. It has nothing to do with bragging about my kid. Grades are the reward for good work.

Please DON'T help my child! I HATE that they allow other parents to "volunteer" in the classroom. I would gladly pay double the taxes to get paid more professionals in the classroom rather than having catty, nosey parents working with my child (who isn't behind, btw). Why do they allow that? I can see volunteers working in the "stations, " the computer lab, supervising recess and helping get things ready. But other parents should not know which children are "behind," which are "advanced," etc.

I'd love to hear a teacher's perspective on this. Why does FCPS allow other parents to have access to this sort of information?

[Anonymous]

Please DON'T help my child! I HATE that they allow other parents to "volunteer" in the classroom. I would gladly pay double the taxes to get paid more professionals in the classroom rather than having catty, nosey parents working with my child (who isn't behind, btw). Why do they allow that? I can see volunteers working in the "stations, " the computer lab, supervising recess and helping get things ready. But other parents should not know which children are "behind," which are "advanced," etc.

I'd love to hear a teacher's perspective on this. Why does FCPS allow other parents to have access to this sort of information?

Although there may be isolated cases of a teacher inappriopriately sharing information with someone, it's not typical. Parents like the PP like to think they know, but they don't. School staff know all about parents like the PP and while schools may appeciate volunteers, they know that no good comes of sharing that kind of information, even if they were allowed to.

I had one parent volunteer talk to me about the occupational therapist helping a child in our classroom. She assumed it was for the boy in the wheelchair - it was really for my DS who has difficulty holding a pencil and scissors correctly. The boy in the wheelchair may have had physical disabilities but could cut and color just fine - his mother and I are friends and talk about the busybodies who assume in-class resource staff are for her DS just because he has physical disabilities. The busybodies also assume her DS is LD. Best just to ignore them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:First: kindergarten, first and second have always had this kind of report (although first and second have used Outstanding, good, satisfactory and needs improvement). It makes sense in the lower grades where they don't have tests and therefore, they don't have numeric scores to compare to benchmarks.

However, once kids start taking quizzes and tests, IMO, they should be given actual grades. I really hate the "always shows this skill," "sometimes shows this skill," etc. for the mid/upper elementary grades. Kids need to know that getting a "C" is not acceptable (in my house it isn't ) and they should know where they stand compared the the amount of material they were taught and expected to learn. When parents see "sometimes shows this skill" it sounds like == eh, it's probably good enough. Parents don't have a good idea of whether they need to help/push their kids more or if they are doing ok.

I've seen this even in first grade. The reports/comments are written with such positive language, that it doesn't really tell parents where their child is falling behind. I have seen kids whose reading skills were way behind. The parents probably don't know that the child is behind b/c the comments are something like "is working toward full comprehension of passages" == which sounds ok. Except, in real life, that kid is not keeping up with the benchmarks in first grade.

They take away all the worksheet and work products -- so parents don't get regular feedback on the child's work. Then they put in these fuzzy, feel-good comments that make it sound like everyone is successful, and THEN, they wonder why parents aren't helping their kids more and why the kids are behind! There is a connection.

Bring back the letter grades for the middle/upper elementary kids!

You sound like one of those hyper-competitive parents who is never satisfied and is always pushing, pushing, pushing. I really don't care what grades my kids get. Grades don't tell me how well my child has mastered the material or if he's doing his best work, giving school his best effort. You have no idea what other parents know or don't know about their kids. It's also none of your business. You should focus more on your own child and if you don't understand where your child is in terms of his learning, feel free to ask for a conference.

If the child gets all the math problems correct then why not give an A? there is no reason grade 1 can't have tests. Objective measurement.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Please DON'T help my child! I HATE that they allow other parents to "volunteer" in the classroom. I would gladly pay double the taxes to get paid more professionals in the classroom rather than having catty, nosey parents working with my child (who isn't behind, btw). Why do they allow that? I can see volunteers working in the "stations, " the computer lab, supervising recess and helping get things ready. But other parents should not know which children are "behind," which are "advanced," etc.

I'd love to hear a teacher's perspective on this. Why does FCPS allow other parents to have access to this sort of information?

Although there may be isolated cases of a teacher inappriopriately sharing information with someone, it's not typical. Parents like the PP like to think they know, but they don't. School staff know all about parents like the PP and while schools may appeciate volunteers, they know that no good comes of sharing that kind of information, even if they were allowed to.

I had one parent volunteer talk to me about the occupational therapist helping a child in our classroom. She assumed it was for the boy in the wheelchair - it was really for my DS who has difficulty holding a pencil and scissors correctly. The boy in the wheelchair may have had physical disabilities but could cut and color just fine - his mother and I are friends and talk about the busybodies who assume in-class resource staff are for her DS just because he has physical disabilities. The busybodies also assume her DS is LD. Best just to ignore them.

Thanks! I'm the poster you quoted. I just want my kids to be able to do what they do without being judged or evaluated by the other parents. I hate the competition withe some of the moms. I work with my child and she does as well as she can. I don't other parents butting in to that and making me (or her) feel bad or inferior about who she is and what she is capable of. She is in OT and ST (although not through the school) and may or may not have an LD, but it's none of anyone's business.

[Anonymous]

If you are working with kids at math or reading, you are going to be able to tell who is getting it and who isn't. The teachers don't have to "share" info. for a volunteer to figure it out.

If your child is doing his/her best, then be comfortable with that. It doesn't matter what other people's opinions are. Volunteers are going to have opinions based on what they see. True, it isn't a complete picture. But, everyone is entitled to their own opinions and they don't have to get your permission to have an opinion about kids/grades/schools.