Camp Rant

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:OP, you will hear a lot of outrage at the idea that you are outraged by the price of volleyball. You are right to be outraged because the prices do not reflect in any way the costs to run those activities. Even the most expensive venue gets paid for by the first 2-3 players who sign up for the camp / clinic. They charge this much because there are enough suckers who offer their daily praises to market forces and are willing to pay. Then you have those who complain about the price, but they still pay because they don't want to be left behind.

Amazing discovery: businesses charge more than their marginal cost.

Wait until you hear about day cares, ice cream shops, dog groomers, summer camps, music lessons, restaurants, movie theaters, ski resorts, airlines, and literally every other business on Earth. None of them sit down and say, "Well, the first three customers covered our costs, so everything after that should be free." Day cares don't charge based on the hourly wage of the teacher. Ice cream shops don't price a cone based on milk and sugar costs. Dog groomers don't charge only for shampoo and 30 minutes of labor. And so on.

If the clinics are full, they're priced correctly. The fact that people keep paying while simultaneously complaining about the price is basically the entire history of consumer spending.

[Anonymous]

What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

Huh?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

This debate might pop up on more DCUM volleyball threads than Metro versus Paramount, but I don't really understand what people who believe small business shouldn't maximize their profits are suggesting. What solutions are you proposing?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

This debate might pop up on more DCUM volleyball threads than Metro versus Paramount, but I don't really understand what people who believe small business shouldn't maximize their profits are suggesting. What solutions are you proposing?

I don't really understand what people who believe small business should maximize their profits are suggesting. Stop doing the math to avoid realizing that they are shamelessly milking everyone? Stop exercising free speech? If they are allowed to charge whatever they want, we can also point out the greed. Look it up - it's called the first amendment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:You’re going to have to give up something. It sounds like you want low cost, at a time that works for you, close to you in DC and a step above rec. That’s going to cost you in time money or both, especially if you have gone out of the DC Parks and Recs system.

Volleyball is an expensive sport. Most of these coaches already have a full-time job which is why most of these camps are in the PM. The cost of these camps are on par with a lot of other specialty summer camps.

Metro timing may not be convenient based on where you live. Many of the volleyball camps are in NW. Try looking at the Sidwell Camp or the Nike camps at Maret since that may be more metro friendly

Sidwell Friends head coach:
https://megandunnvolleyball.com/elite-training-series

Nike at Maret:
https://www.ussportscamps.com/multisport/nike-2/nike-multi-sport-camp-maret-school

Other camps to consider that are somewhat metro accessible (metro + bus)

American Univ, GW Univ, Georgetown
Georgetown Day School

Sidwell Friends' head coach has a bunch of other clinics:
https://megandunnvolleyball.com/clinics

She coached MOCO 16-1 this past season.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

This debate might pop up on more DCUM volleyball threads than Metro versus Paramount, but I don't really understand what people who believe small business shouldn't maximize their profits are suggesting. What solutions are you proposing?

I don't really understand what people who believe small business should maximize their profits are suggesting. Stop doing the math to avoid realizing that they are shamelessly milking everyone? Stop exercising free speech? If they are allowed to charge whatever they want, we can also point out the greed. Look it up - it's called the first amendment.

Yes, you can call it greed. You can call it greed 100 times if you want. But repeating a word doesn’t make it true.

I’ll restate my original question: do you also complain when a popular restaurant raises prices, a daycare has a waitlist, or a tutor charges $150/hour? Somehow “greed” only becomes the explanation when it’s an activity you personally want but don’t want to pay for.

There are cheaper ways to play volleyball: park and rec, school teams, community leagues, open gyms, your backyard. What you’re upset about is that the most sought-after clubs, coaches, and clinics charge premium prices.

That’s not greed. That’s a premium product with matching demand.

It’s like walking into BLT Steak, ordering a burger, and complaining that Burger King sells one for less. Nobody is forcing you to buy the premium option.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Parent of a 12-yo beginner in DC who's taken a few rec programs and would like to get better and maybe play for her school team. Why the f%ck are so many vball camps:

* Out in the suburbs or even farther (Sterling is NOT Northern Virginia)
* In the evening (some ending at 10PM!)
* Expensive, especially for the very few in the city ($250 for ONE day?!?)

How am I supposed to do this with a rising 7th grader when none of these places are anywhere near public transportation? Thought the barrier to entry was bad for soccer. . .

How is Sterling not in Northern Virginia? Why wouldn't volleyball camps be in a variety of locations?

Op is clearly an idjit.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

This debate might pop up on more DCUM volleyball threads than Metro versus Paramount, but I don't really understand what people who believe small business shouldn't maximize their profits are suggesting. What solutions are you proposing?

I don't really understand what people who believe small business should maximize their profits are suggesting. Stop doing the math to avoid realizing that they are shamelessly milking everyone? Stop exercising free speech? If they are allowed to charge whatever they want, we can also point out the greed. Look it up - it's called the first amendment.

Yes, you can call it greed. You can call it greed 100 times if you want. But repeating a word doesn’t make it true.

I’ll restate my original question: do you also complain when a popular restaurant raises prices, a daycare has a waitlist, or a tutor charges $150/hour? Somehow “greed” only becomes the explanation when it’s an activity you personally want but don’t want to pay for.

There are cheaper ways to play volleyball: park and rec, school teams, community leagues, open gyms, your backyard. What you’re upset about is that the most sought-after clubs, coaches, and clinics charge premium prices.

That’s not greed. That’s a premium product with matching demand.

It’s like walking into BLT Steak, ordering a burger, and complaining that Burger King sells one for less. Nobody is forcing you to buy the premium option.

Your simile sucks big time and you know it. You are talking as if you can only buy burgers from BLT Steak or Burger King. The truth is that burgers come at multiple price points in between BLT Steak and Burger King. You can also buy cars in between a Kia Kona and a Maserati. With volleyball, your options are very limited once you are above rec (with MVSA or VolleyViet being notable exceptions). So you can claim that everyone has options until you turn blue, but you know that's not true.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

This debate might pop up on more DCUM volleyball threads than Metro versus Paramount, but I don't really understand what people who believe small business shouldn't maximize their profits are suggesting. What solutions are you proposing?

I don't really understand what people who believe small business should maximize their profits are suggesting. Stop doing the math to avoid realizing that they are shamelessly milking everyone? Stop exercising free speech? If they are allowed to charge whatever they want, we can also point out the greed. Look it up - it's called the first amendment.

Yes, you can call it greed. You can call it greed 100 times if you want. But repeating a word doesn’t make it true.

I’ll restate my original question: do you also complain when a popular restaurant raises prices, a daycare has a waitlist, or a tutor charges $150/hour? Somehow “greed” only becomes the explanation when it’s an activity you personally want but don’t want to pay for.

There are cheaper ways to play volleyball: park and rec, school teams, community leagues, open gyms, your backyard. What you’re upset about is that the most sought-after clubs, coaches, and clinics charge premium prices.

That’s not greed. That’s a premium product with matching demand.

It’s like walking into BLT Steak, ordering a burger, and complaining that Burger King sells one for less. Nobody is forcing you to buy the premium option.

Your simile sucks big time and you know it. You are talking as if you can only buy burgers from BLT Steak or Burger King. The truth is that burgers come at multiple price points in between BLT Steak and Burger King. You can also buy cars in between a Kia Kona and a Maserati. With volleyball, your options are very limited once you are above rec (with MVSA or VolleyViet being notable exceptions). So you can claim that everyone has options until you turn blue, but you know that's not true.

Wait, I thought the issue was greed.

Now the issue is that there aren’t enough options between rec and elite club.

Pick a lane.

If your argument is that the DMV needs more mid-tier volleyball programs, I might even agree with you. But that’s a supply problem, not proof that every existing club owner is some cartoon villain twirling a mustache while collecting checks.

You don’t get to call every business owner greedy simply because the product tier you want doesn’t exist at the price you want.

Who knows, maybe someone reading this will go out there to start one and make a fortune.

[Anonymous]

If your dd isn’t tall, the odds are not in her favor. Ask me how I know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

This debate might pop up on more DCUM volleyball threads than Metro versus Paramount, but I don't really understand what people who believe small business shouldn't maximize their profits are suggesting. What solutions are you proposing?

I don't really understand what people who believe small business should maximize their profits are suggesting. Stop doing the math to avoid realizing that they are shamelessly milking everyone? Stop exercising free speech? If they are allowed to charge whatever they want, we can also point out the greed. Look it up - it's called the first amendment.

Yes, you can call it greed. You can call it greed 100 times if you want. But repeating a word doesn’t make it true.

I’ll restate my original question: do you also complain when a popular restaurant raises prices, a daycare has a waitlist, or a tutor charges $150/hour? Somehow “greed” only becomes the explanation when it’s an activity you personally want but don’t want to pay for.

There are cheaper ways to play volleyball: park and rec, school teams, community leagues, open gyms, your backyard. What you’re upset about is that the most sought-after clubs, coaches, and clinics charge premium prices.

That’s not greed. That’s a premium product with matching demand.

It’s like walking into BLT Steak, ordering a burger, and complaining that Burger King sells one for less. Nobody is forcing you to buy the premium option.

Your simile sucks big time and you know it. You are talking as if you can only buy burgers from BLT Steak or Burger King. The truth is that burgers come at multiple price points in between BLT Steak and Burger King. You can also buy cars in between a Kia Kona and a Maserati. With volleyball, your options are very limited once you are above rec (with MVSA or VolleyViet being notable exceptions). So you can claim that everyone has options until you turn blue, but you know that's not true.

NP and you lost us here because there are plenty of options in between but you might have to drive and they might be at inconvenient times. As the PP pointed out, it’s all about supply and demand. Land is expensive here. Volleyball takes up space and there are only so many coaches.

Those of us who have been around a while have known many who have thought about trying to open up something but none of us have done it. So we are either still driving, paying lots or our kids have stopped playing by now. This is going to be true for many sports in this area, not only volleyball.

[Anonymous]

OP, if your kid does sports you will need a car to get them back and forth to games in HS.

[Anonymous]

Club volleyball is a total grift. After you shell out the bucks, your child may never get any playtime. And then you have to sit there and not complain or even speak to the coach. You have been warned.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What a surprise! People praising the free markets, the greed, the offer and demand! Who could have guessed?

This debate might pop up on more DCUM volleyball threads than Metro versus Paramount, but I don't really understand what people who believe small business shouldn't maximize their profits are suggesting. What solutions are you proposing?

I don't really understand what people who believe small business should maximize their profits are suggesting. Stop doing the math to avoid realizing that they are shamelessly milking everyone? Stop exercising free speech? If they are allowed to charge whatever they want, we can also point out the greed. Look it up - it's called the first amendment.

Yes, you can call it greed. You can call it greed 100 times if you want. But repeating a word doesn’t make it true.

I’ll restate my original question: do you also complain when a popular restaurant raises prices, a daycare has a waitlist, or a tutor charges $150/hour? Somehow “greed” only becomes the explanation when it’s an activity you personally want but don’t want to pay for.

There are cheaper ways to play volleyball: park and rec, school teams, community leagues, open gyms, your backyard. What you’re upset about is that the most sought-after clubs, coaches, and clinics charge premium prices.

That’s not greed. That’s a premium product with matching demand.

It’s like walking into BLT Steak, ordering a burger, and complaining that Burger King sells one for less. Nobody is forcing you to buy the premium option.

Your simile sucks big time and you know it. You are talking as if you can only buy burgers from BLT Steak or Burger King. The truth is that burgers come at multiple price points in between BLT Steak and Burger King. You can also buy cars in between a Kia Kona and a Maserati. With volleyball, your options are very limited once you are above rec (with MVSA or VolleyViet being notable exceptions). So you can claim that everyone has options until you turn blue, but you know that's not true.

NP and you lost us here because there are plenty of options in between but you might have to drive and they might be at inconvenient times. As the PP pointed out, it’s all about supply and demand. Land is expensive here. Volleyball takes up space and there are only so many coaches.

Those of us who have been around a while have known many who have thought about trying to open up something but none of us have done it. So we are either still driving, paying lots or our kids have stopped playing by now. This is going to be true for many sports in this area, not only volleyball.

I wander what you mean by "plenty of options" because I've been around for a while and I call BS. The bolded part simply shows that there aren't really that many options. Stop the smokescreen about the land being expensive. Do the math and figure out for yourself: renting a gym is not as expensive as it sounds. At least the PP admitted that the volleyball clubs are trying to maximize profits. I can respect that line of reasoning because that's what they are doing. Let's stop pretending that the land value has anything to do with the cost of club volleyball. Maybe indirectly: expensive land means rich homeowners who are likely to pay.