Music performance as double (second) major

[Anonymous]

College Confidential's Music Major forum would be a good place to pose this question. Tons of useful information and very engaged music school community over there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DS (rising senior) is interested in a music performance major in addition to a math/physics major. While he will probably get credit for many of AP and DE math courses that he has taken, we realize that the music major will be intensive and time-consuming. A quick ChatGPT consult shows most of the prospective classes would be music ones, which would limit any research or upper level courses that can be taken. Another possibility is to just do music as a minor (which would in turn limit access to performances, recitals and instruction compared to music majors).

Any advice from parents of kids who have successfully navigated something like this, either at conservatory-type schools (Rice, NW, Rochester, IU) or schools that just have a school of music (e.g. Penn State, UMD)?

We looked into this for DC for a music performance and math double degree. DC really likes Rice, but the school of music explicitly told us they do not support double degrees. So DC didn't apply. JHU + Peabody have a double degree arrangement, but the audition is very tough, and 1st year double degree students are required to stay at Peabody's dorm, rather than the main campus, which is not appealing to DC. UVA supports double degrees, but the music department is not as rigorous. At the end, the best option is UMD, which has a very reputable school of music that supports double degrees, and the math department is very good too. DC went through the 20 minute live audition in their concert hall and was offer admission with a small music scholarship. Quite happy. DC was also admitted to Penn State and Santa Barbara. Both of these schools support double degree. But DC does not think they are any better than UMD.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DS (rising senior) is interested in a music performance major in addition to a math/physics major. While he will probably get credit for many of AP and DE math courses that he has taken, we realize that the music major will be intensive and time-consuming. A quick ChatGPT consult shows most of the prospective classes would be music ones, which would limit any research or upper level courses that can be taken. Another possibility is to just do music as a minor (which would in turn limit access to performances, recitals and instruction compared to music majors).

Any advice from parents of kids who have successfully navigated something like this, either at conservatory-type schools (Rice, NW, Rochester, IU) or schools that just have a school of music (e.g. Penn State, UMD)?

We looked into this for DC for a music performance and math double degree. DC really likes Rice, but the school of music explicitly told us they do not support double degrees. So DC didn't apply. JHU + Peabody have a double degree arrangement, but the audition is very tough, and 1st year double degree students are required to stay at Peabody's dorm, rather than the main campus, which is not appealing to DC. UVA supports double degrees, but the music department is not as rigorous. At the end, the best option is UMD, which has a very reputable school of music that supports double degrees, and the math department is very good too. DC went through the 20 minute live audition in their concert hall and was offer admission with a small music scholarship. Quite happy. DC was also admitted to Penn State and Santa Barbara. Both of these schools support double degree. But DC does not think they are any better than UMD.

No offense to Maryland but if my kid is more focused on the academic side than the music side, and had the grades to go to Rice or Hopkins or the like, I would tell them to give up the music or at least scale it back and go to one of those schools. Because the academic difference is pretty big, and that is what matters for the long haul. Or, as others have noted, find a similar school where the two can compromise more.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DS (rising senior) is interested in a music performance major in addition to a math/physics major. While he will probably get credit for many of AP and DE math courses that he has taken, we realize that the music major will be intensive and time-consuming. A quick ChatGPT consult shows most of the prospective classes would be music ones, which would limit any research or upper level courses that can be taken. Another possibility is to just do music as a minor (which would in turn limit access to performances, recitals and instruction compared to music majors).

Any advice from parents of kids who have successfully navigated something like this, either at conservatory-type schools (Rice, NW, Rochester, IU) or schools that just have a school of music (e.g. Penn State, UMD)?

Look at Northwestern (NU) and their dual degree program.

Their engineering school loves musicians.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DS (rising senior) is interested in a music performance major in addition to a math/physics major. While he will probably get credit for many of AP and DE math courses that he has taken, we realize that the music major will be intensive and time-consuming. A quick ChatGPT consult shows most of the prospective classes would be music ones, which would limit any research or upper level courses that can be taken. Another possibility is to just do music as a minor (which would in turn limit access to performances, recitals and instruction compared to music majors).

Any advice from parents of kids who have successfully navigated something like this, either at conservatory-type schools (Rice, NW, Rochester, IU) or schools that just have a school of music (e.g. Penn State, UMD)?

We looked into this for DC for a music performance and math double degree. DC really likes Rice, but the school of music explicitly told us they do not support double degrees. So DC didn't apply. JHU + Peabody have a double degree arrangement, but the audition is very tough, and 1st year double degree students are required to stay at Peabody's dorm, rather than the main campus, which is not appealing to DC. UVA supports double degrees, but the music department is not as rigorous. At the end, the best option is UMD, which has a very reputable school of music that supports double degrees, and the math department is very good too. DC went through the 20 minute live audition in their concert hall and was offer admission with a small music scholarship. Quite happy. DC was also admitted to Penn State and Santa Barbara. Both of these schools support double degree. But DC does not think they are any better than UMD.

PP here who is looking into BA degrees. I'm just going to point out that they are kind of conflated here. UVA offers a double major, not a double degree. The music department offers a BA, but no BM degree. It's one of the schools on my daughter's list.

Personally, I don't get the whole double degree thing. It would be like trying to get a nursing degree and an engineering degree at the same time. But I'm sure it serves a purpose for some since it's out there.

But if you have a kid like mine - who is conservatory competitive but not interested in a music career - I'd encourage you at least discuss the double major path, or, at the very list, be very clear on the distinction and which your kids wants!

[Anonymous]

Music BA double major graduate from a liberal arts school here - just wanted to agree with everyone who suggested looking into BA programs without a music school. I know quite a few people from my BA program who have ended up doing MMs at top conservatories in the past few years, and all of them have been double majors! As long as you can take lessons and are intrinsically motivated, you do not need a BM even if you wanted to pursue music performance professionally, since admission is more or less strictly about your audition. On the flip side, most double majors from my program do end up pursuing a career in the other major, and the BA instead of BM in music makes it a lot easier to manage focusing on both

[Anonymous]

Generally it would be easier to do Math as the double than a lab science. More difficult to fit the labs in with ensemble rehearsals.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DS (rising senior) is interested in a music performance major in addition to a math/physics major. While he will probably get credit for many of AP and DE math courses that he has taken, we realize that the music major will be intensive and time-consuming. A quick ChatGPT consult shows most of the prospective classes would be music ones, which would limit any research or upper level courses that can be taken. Another possibility is to just do music as a minor (which would in turn limit access to performances, recitals and instruction compared to music majors).

Any advice from parents of kids who have successfully navigated something like this, either at conservatory-type schools (Rice, NW, Rochester, IU) or schools that just have a school of music (e.g. Penn State, UMD)?

We looked into this for DC for a music performance and math double degree. DC really likes Rice, but the school of music explicitly told us they do not support double degrees. So DC didn't apply. JHU + Peabody have a double degree arrangement, but the audition is very tough, and 1st year double degree students are required to stay at Peabody's dorm, rather than the main campus, which is not appealing to DC. UVA supports double degrees, but the music department is not as rigorous. At the end, the best option is UMD, which has a very reputable school of music that supports double degrees, and the math department is very good too. DC went through the 20 minute live audition in their concert hall and was offer admission with a small music scholarship. Quite happy. DC was also admitted to Penn State and Santa Barbara. Both of these schools support double degree. But DC does not think they are any better than UMD.

PP here who is looking into BA degrees. I'm just going to point out that they are kind of conflated here. UVA offers a double major, not a double degree. The music department offers a BA, but no BM degree. It's one of the schools on my daughter's list.

Personally, I don't get the whole double degree thing. It would be like trying to get a nursing degree and an engineering degree at the same time. But I'm sure it serves a purpose for some since it's out there.

But if you have a kid like mine - who is conservatory competitive but not interested in a music career - I'd encourage you at least discuss the double major path, or, at the very list, be very clear on the distinction and which your kids wants!

Thanks, PP. You quoted me, so I will respond. For UMD, even though the school of music is well respected, it allows students to choose between BA and BM down the road, after they have started attending. The difference is the number of credits necessary to fulfill BM or BA, with BM being more demanding. This is quite a lot more flexible than other schools of music or conservatory, and they are supportive of either degree. So in a way, the performance students will have the good training of a music school, being taught by the music professors and not graduate students for both BM and BA. In comparison, for Rice, they prioritize those students in their BM program, and the BA students will be taught by graduate students, not professors. This was what they told us when we visited.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:DS (rising senior) is interested in a music performance major in addition to a math/physics major. While he will probably get credit for many of AP and DE math courses that he has taken, we realize that the music major will be intensive and time-consuming. A quick ChatGPT consult shows most of the prospective classes would be music ones, which would limit any research or upper level courses that can be taken. Another possibility is to just do music as a minor (which would in turn limit access to performances, recitals and instruction compared to music majors).

Any advice from parents of kids who have successfully navigated something like this, either at conservatory-type schools (Rice, NW, Rochester, IU) or schools that just have a school of music (e.g. Penn State, UMD)?

We looked into this for DC for a music performance and math double degree. DC really likes Rice, but the school of music explicitly told us they do not support double degrees. So DC didn't apply. JHU + Peabody have a double degree arrangement, but the audition is very tough, and 1st year double degree students are required to stay at Peabody's dorm, rather than the main campus, which is not appealing to DC. UVA supports double degrees, but the music department is not as rigorous. At the end, the best option is UMD, which has a very reputable school of music that supports double degrees, and the math department is very good too. DC went through the 20 minute live audition in their concert hall and was offer admission with a small music scholarship. Quite happy. DC was also admitted to Penn State and Santa Barbara. Both of these schools support double degree. But DC does not think they are any better than UMD.

PP here who is looking into BA degrees. I'm just going to point out that they are kind of conflated here. UVA offers a double major, not a double degree. The music department offers a BA, but no BM degree. It's one of the schools on my daughter's list.

Personally, I don't get the whole double degree thing. It would be like trying to get a nursing degree and an engineering degree at the same time. But I'm sure it serves a purpose for some since it's out there.

But if you have a kid like mine - who is conservatory competitive but not interested in a music career - I'd encourage you at least discuss the double major path, or, at the very list, be very clear on the distinction and which your kids wants!

Thanks, PP. You quoted me, so I will respond. For UMD, even though the school of music is well respected, it allows students to choose between BA and BM down the road, after they have started attending. The difference is the number of credits necessary to fulfill BM or BA, with BM being more demanding. This is quite a lot more flexible than other schools of music or conservatory, and they are supportive of either degree. So in a way, the performance students will have the good training of a music school, being taught by the music professors and not graduate students for both BM and BA. In comparison, for Rice, they prioritize those students in their BM program, and the BA students will be taught by graduate students, not professors. This was what they told us when we visited.

PP you are quoting. My kid had a few summer festival friends (a year older than her) go to Rice; but it fell off her radar for exactly this reason. The BA is there to serve kids interested in studying music, not performing it at a high level and even the website is pretty clear on that! I wasn't aware of the nuance at UMD though. It's not on my kids radar, if they have music scholarships, maybe it should be!

(That's a whole other topic, we are chasing a lot of fine arts scholarships.)

[Anonymous]

Here's the quote, in fact, from Rice's website about the goals of a BA degree;

Demonstrate an intermediate level of technical and musical competence in performance.
Possess rudimentary skills in music theory and an understanding of how those skills are related to music performance.
Acquire a fundamental understanding and appreciation of the various historical periods of music literature

Regardless, it was the double major vs double degree distinction that so often gets lost. I think that's honestly the first step the OP needs to think about. Then you have to decide if you want to just go to an excellent school with a music program or try to tease out the rare places you can get both.

I also can't stress enough the utility of contacting faculty. Take a school like Duke - excellent student orchestra. But we found out my daughter's instrument is not placed in orchestra except on an as needed basis. (Her first love is orchestra) On the other hand, UVA, not as strong in the surface in music in general, but the orchestra runs as a combined program with a local community orchestra - which can be an amazing experience for undergrads. You don't learn this stuff without reaching out to people and asking specific questions.