If you could move anywhere in DC for elementary…

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wouldn't. And I say that as someone with a kid in DCPS who is doing fine.

But if I had to do it again, I'd have pushed my spouse MUCH harder to move out of DC before our our kid was old enough that it would be hard to do. It's not even that I think schools are so much better elsewhere, it's more that I think DC's public school system is highly dysfunctional and stressful to navigate, and I think I personally would prefer to parent in a district where you just live in the best pyramid you can and then make do. That has it's drawbacks too, but I think I'm better suited to them.

Do you mean another district in the DMV or leave the area entirely?

What dysfunctions stand out?

The demographics of DC combined with the government culture and the lottery create very dysfunctional public school systems. Everyone works at cross purposes. Schools, parents, administrators, teachers, and the district. Plus charters. The lottery is great on a micro level (can help families get access to better schools) but toxic on a macro level (creates a sense of instability in the system and schools, creates a lot of churn, disincentivizes people to have a "make it work" attitude even with more minor challenges).

I think some people have no issues with this and navigate it well. I find it stressful and unsettling. My kid is in middle elementary and we are now figuring out middle school. I thought nothing could ever be as stressful and annoying as PK lotteries. I was incorrect. Stakes are much higher for MS and there are simply not enough spots at decent schools to go around. There's this weird intensity among parents, especially where I am (Capital Hill) but this is countered by an almost apathetic or aggressively neutral attitude among schools, likely just as a self-protective measure because some of the parents are so intense. I simply cannot have another conversation about math tracking. I'm tired of all of it.

I think I'd find a lot of this in the burbs as well which is why I'd rather leave the area altogether, but I think I personally am better suited to deal with the way suburban districts handle these issues better than I deal with DC public schools.

This post is amazing.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:B. Find an apartment with a pool, trails, and playground nearby.
I love ours- pool, parking, bus stop on 2 sides, rooftop, trails, community gardens, gym, front desk (kids can easily stay home alone), grounds for laying around, library, and other kids in the building.
My kids went to two different elementary schools and I worked in 3rd. All were great.
Stay away from anything on Cathedral Avenue.

Curious why not Cathedral Avenue. We’re in a similar situation- moving to DC post not getting a great lottery result for prek4. Hoping to find an address that would get us a better option next year. Waitlist positions are low so not holding out hope. We’re looking in ward 3 and would love to know what building you’re in! I’m very stressed trying to navigate the housing situation.

In other news we did get offered a spot at Communikids Cathedral commons for pre-K 4 but it seems so unsure considering it’s pending funding that doesn’t get finalized until June.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Option B is Ross. However the middle school feed is a little bit of a step down and the high school feed is not an option.

Ross is hard to argue with. What a warm, sweet little school! Amazing staff and community. It basically feels like a private school, not that I went to private school.

The middle, Francis, meets my personal bar and seems to be improving every year. But agree, it's not as good as Ross itself.

Also true that the HS, Cardozo, is terrible and will never ever get better. No kid should have to go there.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wouldn't. And I say that as someone with a kid in DCPS who is doing fine.

But if I had to do it again, I'd have pushed my spouse MUCH harder to move out of DC before our our kid was old enough that it would be hard to do. It's not even that I think schools are so much better elsewhere, it's more that I think DC's public school system is highly dysfunctional and stressful to navigate, and I think I personally would prefer to parent in a district where you just live in the best pyramid you can and then make do. That has it's drawbacks too, but I think I'm better suited to them.

Do you mean another district in the DMV or leave the area entirely?

What dysfunctions stand out?

The demographics of DC combined with the government culture and the lottery create very dysfunctional public school systems. Everyone works at cross purposes. Schools, parents, administrators, teachers, and the district. Plus charters. The lottery is great on a micro level (can help families get access to better schools) but toxic on a macro level (creates a sense of instability in the system and schools, creates a lot of churn, disincentivizes people to have a "make it work" attitude even with more minor challenges).

I think some people have no issues with this and navigate it well. I find it stressful and unsettling. My kid is in middle elementary and we are now figuring out middle school. I thought nothing could ever be as stressful and annoying as PK lotteries. I was incorrect. Stakes are much higher for MS and there are simply not enough spots at decent schools to go around. There's this weird intensity among parents, especially where I am (Capital Hill) but this is countered by an almost apathetic or aggressively neutral attitude among schools, likely just as a self-protective measure because some of the parents are so intense. I simply cannot have another conversation about math tracking. I'm tired of all of it.

I think I'd find a lot of this in the burbs as well which is why I'd rather leave the area altogether, but I think I personally am better suited to deal with the way suburban districts handle these issues better than I deal with DC public schools.

I could have written this post myself and also live in Capitol Hill. The DCPS middles that the Hill elementary schools feed into are inconsistent and are all (I believe) Title I schools. Some have increasing neighborhood buy in and we will be sending our DS to one next year that we are hopeful about, but many of DS's friends left last year for Latin or BASIS and that was hard on him. Looming on the horizon is the high school question, so we have to throw our hats in the ring with the lottery again, and also will have to apply our kid to private high school as a backstop. The people whose kids "win" the high school or charter lottery are literally winning a thing of significant value: not having to pay for four years of private or parochial high school or not having to move and face all of the financial costs (buying/selling home) and social/emotional costs (uprooting your kids, trying to make new adult friends) etc. And not having to worry about the uncertainty and not knowing where your kid is going to school next. Same with the burbs in a decent pyramid.

You've articulated very well the neutral or indifferent attitude about math tracking and other issues in schools. I wish so badly that DCPS would track kids better, including in subjects other than math. More UMC families with strong students would consider staying. But there have been entire years where it felt like my kid was teaching himself math because he started out the year above grade level and so nobody was worried about him. I feel like we've been gaslighted when we push back or ask questions about what he's up to.

If I had to go back and do it again, I would have at least moved to NW DC into a Deal feeder (or Arlington) before my kids were old enough for switching schools to matter, and before we felt so settled in this community. We love the Hill and don't want to leave but the stress of this crazy school situation takes a toll. I am exhausted.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wouldn't. And I say that as someone with a kid in DCPS who is doing fine.

But if I had to do it again, I'd have pushed my spouse MUCH harder to move out of DC before our our kid was old enough that it would be hard to do. It's not even that I think schools are so much better elsewhere, it's more that I think DC's public school system is highly dysfunctional and stressful to navigate, and I think I personally would prefer to parent in a district where you just live in the best pyramid you can and then make do. That has it's drawbacks too, but I think I'm better suited to them.

Do you mean another district in the DMV or leave the area entirely?

What dysfunctions stand out?

The demographics of DC combined with the government culture and the lottery create very dysfunctional public school systems. Everyone works at cross purposes. Schools, parents, administrators, teachers, and the district. Plus charters. The lottery is great on a micro level (can help families get access to better schools) but toxic on a macro level (creates a sense of instability in the system and schools, creates a lot of churn, disincentivizes people to have a "make it work" attitude even with more minor challenges).

I think some people have no issues with this and navigate it well. I find it stressful and unsettling. My kid is in middle elementary and we are now figuring out middle school. I thought nothing could ever be as stressful and annoying as PK lotteries. I was incorrect. Stakes are much higher for MS and there are simply not enough spots at decent schools to go around. There's this weird intensity among parents, especially where I am (Capital Hill) but this is countered by an almost apathetic or aggressively neutral attitude among schools, likely just as a self-protective measure because some of the parents are so intense. I simply cannot have another conversation about math tracking. I'm tired of all of it.

I think I'd find a lot of this in the burbs as well which is why I'd rather leave the area altogether, but I think I personally am better suited to deal with the way suburban districts handle these issues better than I deal with DC public schools.

I could have written this post myself and also live in Capitol Hill. The DCPS middles that the Hill elementary schools feed into are inconsistent and are all (I believe) Title I schools. Some have increasing neighborhood buy in and we will be sending our DS to one next year that we are hopeful about, but many of DS's friends left last year for Latin or BASIS and that was hard on him. Looming on the horizon is the high school question, so we have to throw our hats in the ring with the lottery again, and also will have to apply our kid to private high school as a backstop. The people whose kids "win" the high school or charter lottery are literally winning a thing of significant value: not having to pay for four years of private or parochial high school or not having to move and face all of the financial costs (buying/selling home) and social/emotional costs (uprooting your kids, trying to make new adult friends) etc. And not having to worry about the uncertainty and not knowing where your kid is going to school next. Same with the burbs in a decent pyramid.

You've articulated very well the neutral or indifferent attitude about math tracking and other issues in schools. I wish so badly that DCPS would track kids better, including in subjects other than math. More UMC families with strong students would consider staying. But there have been entire years where it felt like my kid was teaching himself math because he started out the year above grade level and so nobody was worried about him. I feel like we've been gaslighted when we push back or ask questions about what he's up to.

If I had to go back and do it again, I would have at least moved to NW DC into a Deal feeder (or Arlington) before my kids were old enough for switching schools to matter, and before we felt so settled in this community. We love the Hill and don't want to leave but the stress of this crazy school situation takes a toll. I am exhausted.

We are facing the same choice now. Our question is do we do Deal/Hardy, Arlington, or near in MoCo.

[Anonymous]

What exactly is the "tracking" that keeps being mentioned. Can someone describe what it is and why its currently insuffient?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is the "tracking" that keeps being mentioned. Can someone describe what it is and why its currently insuffient?

They're talking about high school math offerings for middle schoolers (Algebra I, Geometry, Algebra II). Different schools handle placement into these classes in different ways and not all schools offer all classes. Plus it's the only subject that is officially separated by ability in middle school, though some schools seem to do some level of ability tracking for other subjects under the radar.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is the "tracking" that keeps being mentioned. Can someone describe what it is and why its currently insuffient?

Tracking means different kids in the same grade get "tracked" into different levels of math based on ability. Most of us grew up with a version of this - honors classes. DCPS doesn't do it by policy, but some schools try to differentiate in the same classroom for kids who are ready for harder work. This is obviously pretty opaque, hard to account for outcomes, incredibly unequal in application across schools (and teachers) and very hard on the teacher vs. having kids grouped by basic ability. It's a point of contention for UMC families who want their kids to enter high school ready to tackle AP subjects so they show well on college applications but may not be able to make that happen without a lot of outside supplementation if they can't get to Algebra before high school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is the "tracking" that keeps being mentioned. Can someone describe what it is and why its currently insuffient?

Tracking means different kids in the same grade get "tracked" into different levels of math based on ability. Most of us grew up with a version of this - honors classes. DCPS doesn't do it by policy, but some schools try to differentiate in the same classroom for kids who are ready for harder work. This is obviously pretty opaque, hard to account for outcomes, incredibly unequal in application across schools (and teachers) and very hard on the teacher vs. having kids grouped by basic ability. It's a point of contention for UMC families who want their kids to enter high school ready to tackle AP subjects so they show well on college applications but may not be able to make that happen without a lot of outside supplementation if they can't get to Algebra before high school.

Every DCPS middle school offers Algebra I. The UMC argument is mostly about Geometry and Algebra II.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is the "tracking" that keeps being mentioned. Can someone describe what it is and why its currently insuffient?

It's insufficient for some kids because it doesn't allow the top kids to do the level of math that they would be capable of. Some kids can handle Geometry in 7th and Algebra II in 8th. But only if they do Algebra I in 6th. If that's not offered to them early enough, they won't get it all done. But there aren't very many of these kids so it's a logistical and budgeting problem how to offer it to them. It's easier for the bigger schools.

Outside of math it's just about having more challenging coursework generally and not having a teacher who's struggling to work across a really wide ability range. And getting away from bad behavior.

[Anonymous]

Regarding tracking, there is also the problem that even if a middle school offers Algebra I (which, yes, all DC middle schools do, at least in name), if a majority of students in the school are below grade level (common in DC middle schools) then that class may not actually compare to a true Algebra I class.

That's why people want tracking. It's not just about getting their kids more advanced material or getting their kids into a class called "Geometry". It's about ensuring their kids will be in a classroom where the focus/expectation will be on grade level or above grade level math, and not actually a remedial course targeted at struggling kids but called "Algebra I" for equity reasons.

[Anonymous]

If I could afford to move anywhere in DC for elementary, I’d move out of DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What exactly is the "tracking" that keeps being mentioned. Can someone describe what it is and why its currently insuffient?

It's insufficient for some kids because it doesn't allow the top kids to do the level of math that they would be capable of. Some kids can handle Geometry in 7th and Algebra II in 8th. But only if they do Algebra I in 6th. If that's not offered to them early enough, they won't get it all done. But there aren't very many of these kids so it's a logistical and budgeting problem how to offer it to them. It's easier for the bigger schools.

Outside of math it's just about having more challenging coursework generally and not having a teacher who's struggling to work across a really wide ability range. And getting away from bad behavior.

Ahh.. thank you all.. That is actually a huge issue and fairly stifling.. wow

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wouldn't. And I say that as someone with a kid in DCPS who is doing fine.

But if I had to do it again, I'd have pushed my spouse MUCH harder to move out of DC before our our kid was old enough that it would be hard to do. It's not even that I think schools are so much better elsewhere, it's more that I think DC's public school system is highly dysfunctional and stressful to navigate, and I think I personally would prefer to parent in a district where you just live in the best pyramid you can and then make do. That has it's drawbacks too, but I think I'm better suited to them.

Do you mean another district in the DMV or leave the area entirely?

What dysfunctions stand out?

The demographics of DC combined with the government culture and the lottery create very dysfunctional public school systems. Everyone works at cross purposes. Schools, parents, administrators, teachers, and the district. Plus charters. The lottery is great on a micro level (can help families get access to better schools) but toxic on a macro level (creates a sense of instability in the system and schools, creates a lot of churn, disincentivizes people to have a "make it work" attitude even with more minor challenges).

I think some people have no issues with this and navigate it well. I find it stressful and unsettling. My kid is in middle elementary and we are now figuring out middle school. I thought nothing could ever be as stressful and annoying as PK lotteries. I was incorrect. Stakes are much higher for MS and there are simply not enough spots at decent schools to go around. There's this weird intensity among parents, especially where I am (Capital Hill) but this is countered by an almost apathetic or aggressively neutral attitude among schools, likely just as a self-protective measure because some of the parents are so intense. I simply cannot have another conversation about math tracking. I'm tired of all of it.

I think I'd find a lot of this in the burbs as well which is why I'd rather leave the area altogether, but I think I personally am better suited to deal with the way suburban districts handle these issues better than I deal with DC public schools.

I think the fundamental issue is that voters in DC are liberal Democrats and they reflexively vote for very liberal candidates, without realizing that very liberal Democratic politicians are extremely opposed to raising academic standards and tracking and gifted and talented programs. They think all of that is racist and they will never, ever support it. They think the purpose of schools is to fight inequality. If you voted for different people, you'd get a different result and schools would look different than they do today.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I just wouldn't. And I say that as someone with a kid in DCPS who is doing fine.

But if I had to do it again, I'd have pushed my spouse MUCH harder to move out of DC before our our kid was old enough that it would be hard to do. It's not even that I think schools are so much better elsewhere, it's more that I think DC's public school system is highly dysfunctional and stressful to navigate, and I think I personally would prefer to parent in a district where you just live in the best pyramid you can and then make do. That has it's drawbacks too, but I think I'm better suited to them.

Do you mean another district in the DMV or leave the area entirely?

What dysfunctions stand out?

The demographics of DC combined with the government culture and the lottery create very dysfunctional public school systems. Everyone works at cross purposes. Schools, parents, administrators, teachers, and the district. Plus charters. The lottery is great on a micro level (can help families get access to better schools) but toxic on a macro level (creates a sense of instability in the system and schools, creates a lot of churn, disincentivizes people to have a "make it work" attitude even with more minor challenges).

I think some people have no issues with this and navigate it well. I find it stressful and unsettling. My kid is in middle elementary and we are now figuring out middle school. I thought nothing could ever be as stressful and annoying as PK lotteries. I was incorrect. Stakes are much higher for MS and there are simply not enough spots at decent schools to go around. There's this weird intensity among parents, especially where I am (Capital Hill) but this is countered by an almost apathetic or aggressively neutral attitude among schools, likely just as a self-protective measure because some of the parents are so intense. I simply cannot have another conversation about math tracking. I'm tired of all of it.

I think I'd find a lot of this in the burbs as well which is why I'd rather leave the area altogether, but I think I personally am better suited to deal with the way suburban districts handle these issues better than I deal with DC public schools.

I think the fundamental issue is that voters in DC are liberal Democrats and they reflexively vote for very liberal candidates, without realizing that very liberal Democratic politicians are extremely opposed to raising academic standards and tracking and gifted and talented programs. They think all of that is racist and they will never, ever support it. They think the purpose of schools is to fight inequality. If you voted for different people, you'd get a different result and schools would look different than they do today.

The above poster comes on and says this all the time, on many posts where parents are complaining about DCPS.