90/10 grading system

[Anonymous]

I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

So a kid who does 100% of the work (40% of total points earned) but gets 50% on tests (30% of total points earned) gets a C- (70%)? That seems generous.

Or a kid who can get 95s on tests (57% of points earned) but does no work (0% of points earned) fails (57%)? That seems punitive.

I understand that 90% of kids are in the gray area in the middle, but what grade should a student who can't pass an assessment get? They aren't prepared to move forward to the next level of course work that builds on this one. It's disingenuous to tell families this kid is a B student if they're getting 67% on tests but working hard.

I'd rather that kids were eligible to retake assessments (after doing all the skipped practice, perhaps) to prove they know more material rather than give them fluff points for doing the worksheets (or having chatgpt do the worksheets, or working with a tutor to do the worksheets). Learn it however you need to, then show me you know it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

So a kid who does 100% of the work (40% of total points earned) but gets 50% on tests (30% of total points earned) gets a C- (70%)? That seems generous.

Or a kid who can get 95s on tests (57% of points earned) but does no work (0% of points earned) fails (57%)? That seems punitive.

I understand that 90% of kids are in the gray area in the middle, but what grade should a student who can't pass an assessment get? They aren't prepared to move forward to the next level of course work that builds on this one. It's disingenuous to tell families this kid is a B student if they're getting 67% on tests but working hard.

I'd rather that kids were eligible to retake assessments (after doing all the skipped practice, perhaps) to prove they know more material rather than give them fluff points for doing the worksheets (or having chatgpt do the worksheets, or working with a tutor to do the worksheets). Learn it however you need to, then show me you know it.

A kid that is getting 100% on all their homework and class assignments and has nothing missing isn’t going to get a 50% on test. They just aren’t. Unless your tests are far removed from what the kids have been learning and doing in class.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Math teacher:

Because anything that goes home cannot be assumed to be their work. Why should a child get more than 10% of their grade from something a parent, a tutor, google, or ChatGPT did for them? Or even something done in class where I had to hold their hand and prompt each step of every problem, where they needed to use their notes to remember a procedure, or ask their friend if they got the same answer. If they need that to learn, then they should absolutely use those supports, but eventually the goal is that they demonstrate their own ability to solve problems. 10% free points for trying seems fair.

A grade in a class should represent the percent of standards mastered. The only way a teacher can guarantee a student did 100% of their work themselves is through individual assessments, done within the 4 walls of the classroom.

I would be 1000% okay with giving two separate grades: “effort” for classwork and homework, and “ability” for tests and quizzes. But if it is going to be a combined one, the subject mastery needs to be weighted significantly more than effort—otherwise why is my class called “algebra 2” vs “worksheet completion”?

I do think that grades have been inflated way too long, so we are used to straight As being the normal for a hard working kid. It’s going to be a while for us to adapt to a new normal where a hard working kid who only masters 75% of the material has a B or a B- vs an A- when homework and classwork was 30%, and that’s okay.

Another math teacher and this is absolutely correct. A majority of students at all levels either don't do their homework or cheat on it. Back in the old days they used to cheat by copying a friend's homework or copying the key. There have been a multitude of apps for some years that allow them to hold up their phone to the problem on the screen or the page and have a full solution spit out in a fraction of second for them to copy. AI just exacerbates this.
The only way to ensure that a student will make an effort to learn something is by testing them in class. This is why grades were so high during the covid year--cheating was through the roof.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

So a kid who does 100% of the work (40% of total points earned) but gets 50% on tests (30% of total points earned) gets a C- (70%)? That seems generous.

Or a kid who can get 95s on tests (57% of points earned) but does no work (0% of points earned) fails (57%)? That seems punitive.

I understand that 90% of kids are in the gray area in the middle, but what grade should a student who can't pass an assessment get? They aren't prepared to move forward to the next level of course work that builds on this one. It's disingenuous to tell families this kid is a B student if they're getting 67% on tests but working hard.

I'd rather that kids were eligible to retake assessments (after doing all the skipped practice, perhaps) to prove they know more material rather than give them fluff points for doing the worksheets (or having chatgpt do the worksheets, or working with a tutor to do the worksheets). Learn it however you need to, then show me you know it.

A kid that is getting 100% on all their homework and class assignments and has nothing missing isn’t going to get a 50% on test. They just aren’t. Unless your tests are far removed from what the kids have been learning and doing in class.

Tell me you aren't a teacher without telling me.

The number of kids who turn in every single worksheet, beautifully completed and then can't pass a test is not a trivial number. Between friends and photomath and chatgpt, they are great at copying and poor at actually doing work. When I dive into the electronic assignment records they show they completed 20 math problems in 3 minutes. They chase the "free points" of homework and classwork, but don't want to spend the time/effort to do it themselves to learn the actual material.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

So a kid who does 100% of the work (40% of total points earned) but gets 50% on tests (30% of total points earned) gets a C- (70%)? That seems generous.

Or a kid who can get 95s on tests (57% of points earned) but does no work (0% of points earned) fails (57%)? That seems punitive.

I understand that 90% of kids are in the gray area in the middle, but what grade should a student who can't pass an assessment get? They aren't prepared to move forward to the next level of course work that builds on this one. It's disingenuous to tell families this kid is a B student if they're getting 67% on tests but working hard.

I'd rather that kids were eligible to retake assessments (after doing all the skipped practice, perhaps) to prove they know more material rather than give them fluff points for doing the worksheets (or having chatgpt do the worksheets, or working with a tutor to do the worksheets). Learn it however you need to, then show me you know it.

A kid that is getting 100% on all their homework and class assignments and has nothing missing isn’t going to get a 50% on test. They just aren’t. Unless your tests are far removed from what the kids have been learning and doing in class.

Tell me you aren't a teacher without telling me.

The number of kids who turn in every single worksheet, beautifully completed and then can't pass a test is not a trivial number. Between friends and photomath and chatgpt, they are great at copying and poor at actually doing work. When I dive into the electronic assignment records they show they completed 20 math problems in 3 minutes. They chase the "free points" of homework and classwork, but don't want to spend the time/effort to do it themselves to learn the actual material.

Still absurd. That isn’t most kids. Kids that don’t care aren’t going through the effort to cheat on all assignments. You can’t get an A or even a B in a class if you fail all the tests and quizzes, even if you get full homework credit. Besides, all high school level classes have state standardized final exams- you must pass them in order to receive class credit.

[Anonymous]

We have this in MCPS and I think it is to align with standards-based grading. The 90% reflects whether you actually meet the standard. It is fine - teachers are required to have at least 9 assignments in the 90% category and no assignment can count for more than 25% of the grade.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

So a kid who does 100% of the work (40% of total points earned) but gets 50% on tests (30% of total points earned) gets a C- (70%)? That seems generous.

Or a kid who can get 95s on tests (57% of points earned) but does no work (0% of points earned) fails (57%)? That seems punitive.

I understand that 90% of kids are in the gray area in the middle, but what grade should a student who can't pass an assessment get? They aren't prepared to move forward to the next level of course work that builds on this one. It's disingenuous to tell families this kid is a B student if they're getting 67% on tests but working hard.

I'd rather that kids were eligible to retake assessments (after doing all the skipped practice, perhaps) to prove they know more material rather than give them fluff points for doing the worksheets (or having chatgpt do the worksheets, or working with a tutor to do the worksheets). Learn it however you need to, then show me you know it.

A kid that is getting 100% on all their homework and class assignments and has nothing missing isn’t going to get a 50% on test. They just aren’t. Unless your tests are far removed from what the kids have been learning and doing in class.

Tell me you aren't a teacher without telling me.

The number of kids who turn in every single worksheet, beautifully completed and then can't pass a test is not a trivial number. Between friends and photomath and chatgpt, they are great at copying and poor at actually doing work. When I dive into the electronic assignment records they show they completed 20 math problems in 3 minutes. They chase the "free points" of homework and classwork, but don't want to spend the time/effort to do it themselves to learn the actual material.

Still absurd. That isn’t most kids. Kids that don’t care aren’t going through the effort to cheat on all assignments. You can’t get an A or even a B in a class if you fail all the tests and quizzes, even if you get full homework credit. Besides, all high school level classes have state standardized final exams- you must pass them in order to receive class credit.

???

No they don't. In Virginia you only have to pass 1 high school SOL in each subject, after that you're exempt.

Of course it's not most kids. Most kids pass unit tests regardless if they did the worksheets. But the ones who fail (Maybe 10% in any given class), the vast majority of them have all their work turned in. Parents threaten to take away their phone for missing assignments, so they rush through worksheets to turn them in without actually doing them.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Math teacher:

Because anything that goes home cannot be assumed to be their work. Why should a child get more than 10% of their grade from something a parent, a tutor, google, or ChatGPT did for them? Or even something done in class where I had to hold their hand and prompt each step of every problem, where they needed to use their notes to remember a procedure, or ask their friend if they got the same answer. If they need that to learn, then they should absolutely use those supports, but eventually the goal is that they demonstrate their own ability to solve problems. 10% free points for trying seems fair.

A grade in a class should represent the percent of standards mastered. The only way a teacher can guarantee a student did 100% of their work themselves is through individual assessments, done within the 4 walls of the classroom.

I would be 1000% okay with giving two separate grades: “effort” for classwork and homework, and “ability” for tests and quizzes. But if it is going to be a combined one, the subject mastery needs to be weighted significantly more than effort—otherwise why is my class called “algebra 2” vs “worksheet completion”?

I do think that grades have been inflated way too long, so we are used to straight As being the normal for a hard working kid. It’s going to be a while for us to adapt to a new normal where a hard working kid who only masters 75% of the material has a B or a B- vs an A- when homework and classwork was 30%, and that’s okay.

Another math teacher and this is absolutely correct. A majority of students at all levels either don't do their homework or cheat on it. Back in the old days they used to cheat by copying a friend's homework or copying the key. There have been a multitude of apps for some years that allow them to hold up their phone to the problem on the screen or the page and have a full solution spit out in a fraction of second for them to copy. AI just exacerbates this.
The only way to ensure that a student will make an effort to learn something is by testing them in class. This is why grades were so high during the covid year--cheating was through the roof.

+ another math teacher

They have the key, they have tutors, they have parents doing it for them, they have AI. They can authentically do their homework or not, for a 10% completion credit, and then show me what they mastered on the assessments.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

So a kid who does 100% of the work (40% of total points earned) but gets 50% on tests (30% of total points earned) gets a C- (70%)? That seems generous.

Or a kid who can get 95s on tests (57% of points earned) but does no work (0% of points earned) fails (57%)? That seems punitive.

I understand that 90% of kids are in the gray area in the middle, but what grade should a student who can't pass an assessment get? They aren't prepared to move forward to the next level of course work that builds on this one. It's disingenuous to tell families this kid is a B student if they're getting 67% on tests but working hard.

I'd rather that kids were eligible to retake assessments (after doing all the skipped practice, perhaps) to prove they know more material rather than give them fluff points for doing the worksheets (or having chatgpt do the worksheets, or working with a tutor to do the worksheets). Learn it however you need to, then show me you know it.

A kid that is getting 100% on all their homework and class assignments and has nothing missing isn’t going to get a 50% on test. They just aren’t. Unless your tests are far removed from what the kids have been learning and doing in class.

Yes they are. All. The. Time.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

I deliberately spam my students with homework to heighten stress loads and then make tests extra harder. Feck free grades and easy rides. Suffer now and be prepared for the real life.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I’m a teacher and understand what people are saying about mastery, grading, kids not doing the work, etc. However, 90/10 seems extreme to me. At our school it’s 60/40.

So a kid who does 100% of the work (40% of total points earned) but gets 50% on tests (30% of total points earned) gets a C- (70%)? That seems generous.

Or a kid who can get 95s on tests (57% of points earned) but does no work (0% of points earned) fails (57%)? That seems punitive.

I understand that 90% of kids are in the gray area in the middle, but what grade should a student who can't pass an assessment get? They aren't prepared to move forward to the next level of course work that builds on this one. It's disingenuous to tell families this kid is a B student if they're getting 67% on tests but working hard.

I'd rather that kids were eligible to retake assessments (after doing all the skipped practice, perhaps) to prove they know more material rather than give them fluff points for doing the worksheets (or having chatgpt do the worksheets, or working with a tutor to do the worksheets). Learn it however you need to, then show me you know it.

A kid that is getting 100% on all their homework and class assignments and has nothing missing isn’t going to get a 50% on test. They just aren’t. Unless your tests are far removed from what the kids have been learning and doing in class.

Yes they are. All. The. Time.

Seriously. I actually have very few missing assignments in my gradebook for most kids (especially with the generous late work policy), but I still have a bunch of failures. I don't know where they are getting answers from and I'm not going to spend my time playing detective. The natural/logical consequence to not learning how to do the practice is that they fail the test and therefore fail the class.