Best colleges aren't the best forever

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Prestige still matters, in fact quite a bit, but it is simply not achievable either due to cost or admissions to many. UMC parents who went to prestigious schools are grappling with the downward social mobility their children are facing. Lower ranking schools, more competitive job markets, housing market unaffordable etc. For a parenting generation that threw everything into their kids it’s a deep blow.

They are clinging to this idea that the prestige isn’t worth it. It’s sort of like gazing into a bakery with no money and telling yourself oh it’s probably too sweet or more healthy not to eat it.

Can people succeed from a state school? Of course, as they always have, it’s just harder and requires hustle. Sadly, many UMC lack hustle because their helicopter parents never let them develop it. Instead they were groomed to follow in their parents foot steps to the prestigious legacy or at least an equivalent. Losing stings.

the point is that the cost of these prestigious universities aren't really worth it.

You should read the Chetty study

came here to say the same. we are full pay and happy to pay for the best fit for ours which happened to be the Chetty schools. every full pay family we know from our private has picked ivy/similar over UVA or WM in state when they were admitted to both. there is no lack of interest in the top schools, just lack of ease to get admitted unhooked.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Prestige still matters, in fact quite a bit, but it is simply not achievable either due to cost or admissions to many. UMC parents who went to prestigious schools are grappling with the downward social mobility their children are facing. Lower ranking schools, more competitive job markets, housing market unaffordable etc. For a parenting generation that threw everything into their kids it’s a deep blow.

They are clinging to this idea that the prestige isn’t worth it. It’s sort of like gazing into a bakery with no money and telling yourself oh it’s probably too sweet or more healthy not to eat it.

Can people succeed from a state school? Of course, as they always have, it’s just harder and requires hustle. Sadly, many UMC lack hustle because their helicopter parents never let them develop it. Instead they were groomed to follow in their parents foot steps to the prestigious legacy or at least an equivalent. Losing stings.

Prestige does not really matter. What matters is what you do while at school and afterwards. The top students will succeed wherever they go. And it's easier to succeed when you are not strapped with $100K+ in student loans when you graduate.

1. students cannot take out any where near that amount. parents can but not students.
2, top schools give some need-based aid up to 300k HHI or more these days. for those in the 180-350k bracket, which is top 5-10% HHI in this country, the top schools are often cheaper than the instate flaghsips.
3. for those just out of range for need based aid (350k HHI), i get it can be hard, but with minimal planning in middle school they could have saved at least 25k per year. For those over 400+k HHI, paying for one kid at an ivy straight from the paycheck is not hard, and paying for two as long as you saved some the past 10 years is also not too difficult. many do it with less than that, this poster included! In these income ranges its a choice to prioritize saving for college and a choice to prioritize huge house, fancy vacations, fancy private k-12 over college, on and on

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a timely article in the midst of college applications. My youngest DC is going through it now.

The vast majority of parents today see college as an investment in the student's future, ie, can they get a good paying job.

I think my older DC would've been like one of these students in the article had DC been accepted to one of the top program for their major. They ended up at the state flagship with merit (which is still T20 for their major) but less intense. The cost differential is no joke, and DC was able to secure some amazing internships from their state flagship.

https://www.yahoo.com/news/articles/best-colleges-aren-t-best-120000222.html

"More and more families are measuring a school’s worth by what it delivers rather than what it represents." +1000

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Prestige still matters, in fact quite a bit, but it is simply not achievable either due to cost or admissions to many. UMC parents who went to prestigious schools are grappling with the downward social mobility their children are facing. Lower ranking schools, more competitive job markets, housing market unaffordable etc. For a parenting generation that threw everything into their kids it’s a deep blow.

They are clinging to this idea that the prestige isn’t worth it. It’s sort of like gazing into a bakery with no money and telling yourself oh it’s probably too sweet or more healthy not to eat it.

Can people succeed from a state school? Of course, as they always have, it’s just harder and requires hustle. Sadly, many UMC lack hustle because their helicopter parents never let them develop it. Instead they were groomed to follow in their parents foot steps to the prestigious legacy or at least an equivalent. Losing stings.

the point is that the cost of these prestigious universities aren't really worth it.
You should read the Chetty study

What do you think the Chetty study actually says? I'm not sure that you actually understand it.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The cost of private universities has changed everything. Two kids equals $800,000.

That is absurd.

There are tons of MC and UMC families choosing state flagships and merit at slightly lower ranked schools over the cost of attending a T20 school without aid.

It’s really only an issue if the kid wants finance or consulting. Those two industries remain stuck in 1990 when it comes to recruiting.

That is the smart choice, unless you can easily pay the $100K/year and/or have it all saved already for college (our kids both had enough for 4 years at "top schools" and professional degrees ) But yes, otherwise, search for merit/go somewhere that is affordable. My own kids found great merit and we were not even searching. one was a 1220/3.5UW/no AP kid and attended a T100 with 35% of tuition as a merit award (had another similar school with same award)---had a T130 with ~70% of tuition award as well. My 1500/3.96UW/8AP kid had multiple great merit awards at T65 schools, including $42K/year at CWRU (a few years ago when all in was ~$80-85K). So step outside your reach schools and your kid can find excellent merit. Both could have attended several in state schools with good merit/low costs as well. Our T120 state U (2nd in state), would have cost the 1500 kid about $15K, and the 1220 kid about $20K. So something the kid alone would pay for 50-80%+ with jobs and federal loans. Very doable and affordable

Was there something else about the 1220/3.5UW/no AP kid that strengthened their application, or is it common for kids like this to get into the lower end of the T100 with merit aid?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Prestige still matters, in fact quite a bit, but it is simply not achievable either due to cost or admissions to many. UMC parents who went to prestigious schools are grappling with the downward social mobility their children are facing. Lower ranking schools, more competitive job markets, housing market unaffordable etc. For a parenting generation that threw everything into their kids it’s a deep blow.

They are clinging to this idea that the prestige isn’t worth it. It’s sort of like gazing into a bakery with no money and telling yourself oh it’s probably too sweet or more healthy not to eat it.

Can people succeed from a state school? Of course, as they always have, it’s just harder and requires hustle. Sadly, many UMC lack hustle because their helicopter parents never let them develop it. Instead they were groomed to follow in their parents foot steps to the prestigious legacy or at least an equivalent. Losing stings.

the point is that the cost of these prestigious universities aren't really worth it.
You should read the Chetty study

What do you think the Chetty study actually says? I'm not sure that you actually understand it.

DP

I think they are referring to the 2023 Chetty study (just saying Chetty study is very unhelpful considering how many studies have his name on it). That study shows that while average lifetime income is not affected very much by where you go to college, the chances of achieving very high incomes is affected by where you go to college. Perhaps they stopped reading after the first half paragraph.

[Anonymous]

I think a lot of top private schools are simply gentler and more comfortable than the big public schools. If you’re broke, or you believe in tough love, the comfort might not be worth it, or might be a negative.

For a lot of kids who can afford the comfort, having the comfort might be nice.

[Anonymous]

Prestige only really matters if your kid needs to get into consulting/IB or wants to attend a top grad school- yes, grad schools still favor students at the top universities and LACs