Selective Admissions High Schools - Testing Requirements

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The only way this happens is if you can get Congressional Republicans to care, and the way that caring would manifest would not be otherwise pleasant.

If MAGA wants to make DCPS unpleasant—possibly by imposing some Christian crazy—then they will come for all DCPS not just the selective high schools. At which point VA and MD schools will get crowded very quickly.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way this happens is if you can get Congressional Republicans to care, and the way that caring would manifest would not be otherwise pleasant.

Right. This is the opportunity. Republicans would need to save us from ourselves. My preference would be they pass something like the Hecht-Calendra Act. That was a NY state law protecting test only admissions at selective NYC high schools like Stuyvesant. We would need to start a PAC and raise some money to Lobby for this.

You don't need to start with money. If someone seriously wants to do this, put your name out there and an email address.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Trying to gauge interest--would anyone join/support a group seeking require dcps only use objective and transparent examination process for admission to Banneker and SWW?

I would totally testify in favor of bringing back a test, or considering CAPE scores.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way this happens is if you can get Congressional Republicans to care, and the way that caring would manifest would not be otherwise pleasant.

Right. This is the opportunity. Republicans would need to save us from ourselves. My preference would be they pass something like the Hecht-Calendra Act. That was a NY state law protecting test only admissions at selective NYC high schools like Stuyvesant. We would need to start a PAC and raise some money to Lobby for this.

You don't need to start with money. If someone seriously wants to do this, put your name out there and an email address.

Money I can easily donate. Raising the issue and getting a wedge group of parents to support it feels much more daunting.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I believe they moved away from standard testing to make the schools more equitable, no? Not all kids can afford test prep.

I get the in-person essays; they make sense. No parent or other outside help. It is 100% kid.

That said, my kid applied with a 4.0 and (according to teachers) great recs, and did not get an interview. I’m sure she looked just liked like a thousand or more other candidates in this way. No idea if what recommendation metrics look like though, e.g., if there were any actual quantitative metrics used to narrow the applicant pool. Anyone know how that works?

My kid had a 4.0 and got in. I think the issue is that there are more kids with a 4.0 than there are seats at Walls.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The only way this happens is if you can get Congressional Republicans to care, and the way that caring would manifest would not be otherwise pleasant.

Right. This is the opportunity. Republicans would need to save us from ourselves. My preference would be they pass something like the Hecht-Calendra Act. That was a NY state law protecting test only admissions at selective NYC high schools like Stuyvesant. We would need to start a PAC and raise some money to Lobby for this.

You don't need to start with money. If someone seriously wants to do this, put your name out there and an email address.

Money I can easily donate. Raising the issue and getting a wedge group of parents to support it feels much more daunting.

You have to be willing to put your name on it. That's the main thing.

[Anonymous]

No. The fact that a test is "objective" doesn't mean that it measures something I would want to know or a characteristic that will lead to a better school.

I went to college with kids from Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, Boston Latin etc. They are doing fine, but they don't have better careers or larger contributions to society than the kids who went to non selective high schools.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. The fact that a test is "objective" doesn't mean that it measures something I would want to know or a characteristic that will lead to a better school.

I went to college with kids from Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, Boston Latin etc. They are doing fine, but they don't have better careers or larger contributions to society than the kids who went to non selective high schools.

Do you understand that "conditional on us all being at the same college" is doing all of the work in that claim?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No. The fact that a test is "objective" doesn't mean that it measures something I would want to know or a characteristic that will lead to a better school.

I went to college with kids from Stuyvesant, Bronx Science, Boston Latin etc. They are doing fine, but they don't have better careers or larger contributions to society than the kids who went to non selective high schools.

Does DC have “non-selective high schools” where going to college is the norm? And don’t say Wilson, since you need to select that one by buying your way in to the most expensive part of DC. The issue here is since we are already being selective, tests are more fair than GPA and interviews.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The issue here is since we are already being selective, tests are more fair than GPA and interviews.

A lot of folks responding to this thread don't seem to know what changed in the last 2 years at Walls. The CURRENT selectivity (at least to get to the interview process) is GPA threshold + teacher recommendations (weighted extremely heavily).

As a result, Walls is actively screening OUT kids based on their unspecified scoring of (obviously, non-normed) teacher rec forms.

Before two years ago, the process was also arbitrary - but kids screened into the interview/essay based on GPA alone and teacher recs were not considered in the process. Before that, of course, the school looked at PARCC scores and the entrance exam.

[Anonymous]

Equity matters to uplift all DC students. There bright and capable kids all through DC schools but they shouldn’t be at a disadvantage compared to Deal or Hardy kids simply because their schools or SES do not give them the opportunities that UMC get.

To clear the “mystery” about the recommendation letters- Here is an idea: Last year Deal sent 41 kids to Walls- Maybe do some reasearch on what made them standout compared to their peers to get an interview at Walls beyond their GPAs.

Also- here is a reference to the link between SES and kids performance in standardized tests.
“A recent paper released by Opportunity Insights, a Harvard-based team of researchers and policy analysts, found that children of the wealthiest 1 percent of Americans were 13 times likelier than the children of low-income families to score 1300 or higher on SAT/ACT tests.” https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2023/11/new-study-finds-wide-gap-in-sat-act-test-scores-between-wealthy-lower-income-kids/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote: Equity matters to uplift all DC students. There bright and capable kids all through DC schools but they shouldn’t be at a disadvantage compared to Deal or Hardy kids simply because their schools or SES do not give them the opportunities that UMC get.

To clear the “mystery” about the recommendation letters- Here is an idea: Last year Deal sent 41 kids to Walls- Maybe do some reasearch on what made them standout compared to their peers to get an interview at Walls beyond their GPAs.

Also- here is a reference to the link between SES and kids performance in standardized tests.
“A recent paper released by Opportunity Insights, a Harvard-based team of researchers and policy analysts, found that children of the wealthiest 1 percent of Americans were 13 times likelier than the children of low-income families to score 1300 or higher on SAT/ACT tests.” https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2023/11/new-study-finds-wide-gap-in-sat-act-test-scores-between-wealthy-lower-income-kids/

Not sure where you are getting this from--SWW has only 12 percent at risk students https://profiles.dcps.dc.gov/School+Without+Walls+High+School. The current process either isn't intended to help low SES or they are trying and failing. Compare that to Stuyvesant in NYC with 48% economically disadvantaged https://www.usnews.com/education/best-high-schools/new-york/districts/new-york-city-public-schools/stuyvesant-high-school-13092.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
To clear the “mystery” about the recommendation letters- Here is an idea: Last year Deal sent 41 kids to Walls- Maybe do some reasearch on what made them standout compared to their peers to get an interview at Walls beyond their GPAs.

This is exactly the problem. This is a public school. Families deserve clear guidelines on how to get in--not some research project figure out how best to game the recommendation process.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
To clear the “mystery” about the recommendation letters- Here is an idea: Last year Deal sent 41 kids to Walls- Maybe do some reasearch on what made them standout compared to their peers to get an interview at Walls beyond their GPAs.

This is exactly the problem. This is a public school. Families deserve clear guidelines on how to get in--not some research project figure out how best to game the recommendation process.

Bringing back testing is not the solution. It is a public school for all DC not just the upper middle class of DC.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
To clear the “mystery” about the recommendation letters- Here is an idea: Last year Deal sent 41 kids to Walls- Maybe do some reasearch on what made them standout compared to their peers to get an interview at Walls beyond their GPAs.

This is exactly the problem. This is a public school. Families deserve clear guidelines on how to get in--not some research project figure out how best to game the recommendation process.

Bringing back testing is not the solution. It is a public school for all DC not just the upper middle class of DC.

They are not for all of DC. They are specialized schools with admission processes. If you want to just turn them into full lottery schools, then that is a different conversation. If they are going to be selective, then they should have simple guidelines on how to get in. If the worry is low-SES students cannot get in these schools via a competitive testing process DCPS should hold open additional spots for at-risk students. I don't have an issue with putting a thumb on the scale for those that need extra support, but at least be transparent about it.