Why is FCPS trying to keep high performing students out of AAP?

[Anonymous]

There is a way to get into AAP if you do private testing (WISC, etc.)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is one of those that got 99th percentile test scores at a high SES school who didn't get into AAP. Her friends at other schools with lower test scores got in. It's infuriating - is this FCPS way of encouraging young families to move to crappier parts of the county? I'm confident my child would have gotten in at a school with different peers.

That fact may be your child did not cut it against your child’s competition at their school. It makes sense the way they are doing it based on the school’s population. If you don’t like it move or go private.

It actually doesn’t make any sense when the AAP curriculum is determined at the county level and not the local elementary. A 99% student should have access to the advanced curriculum, especially in math, where that child is cut off from future educational opportunities that they’re fully qualified and capable of. It makes no sense that a 99% kid can’t get advanced math but a 92% kid does at another school.

If the local elementary schools want to start more widely offering AAP accelerated math to qualified students, then I might feel differently. At our high SES center school, I know a number of highly qualified GE kids who had to jump through hoops to get into AAP math every school year, oftentimes missing 4-6 weeks of classes before the testing was completed and they were allowed in, late and now behind on curriculum.

They have to consider the space available.

No, they don’t. Space is not supposed to be a barrier

Ok.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The in pool scores for higher SES school is significantly higher than lower SES schools. It seems like FCPS is trying to keep students from wealthier schools from accessing AAP. Students scoring in the 99th percentile are not “in pool” at some elementary schools. I can understand lowering the “in pool” requirement for schools that traditionally have less AAP students; but it makes absolutely no sense to try to keep students scoring in the 98th/99th percentile from accessing A
The Advanced Academic Program.

FCPS is trying to “dumb down” the higher performing high schools by lowering the academics for students starting in 3rd grade. Less kids in AAP will mean lower I-ready/SOL scores, less kids taking advanced math in middle school, overall less prepared students for AP/DE classes in high school.

I got news for you. It's always been dumbed down.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is one of those that got 99th percentile test scores at a high SES school who didn't get into AAP. Her friends at other schools with lower test scores got in. It's infuriating - is this FCPS way of encouraging young families to move to crappier parts of the county? I'm confident my child would have gotten in at a school with different peers.

That fact may be your child did not cut it against your child’s competition at their school. It makes sense the way they are doing it based on the school’s population. If you don’t like it move or go private.

It actually doesn’t make any sense when the AAP curriculum is determined at the county level and not the local elementary. A 99% student should have access to the advanced curriculum, especially in math, where that child is cut off from future educational opportunities that they’re fully qualified and capable of. It makes no sense that a 99% kid can’t get advanced math but a 92% kid does at another school.

If the local elementary schools want to start more widely offering AAP accelerated math to qualified students, then I might feel differently. At our high SES center school, I know a number of highly qualified GE kids who had to jump through hoops to get into AAP math every school year, oftentimes missing 4-6 weeks of classes before the testing was completed and they were allowed in, late and now behind on curriculum.

They have to consider the space available.

No, they don’t. Space is not supposed to be a barrier

Anyone who wants to be in aap gets in. It just takes fortitude and deep pockets. It's never been about motivation or talent.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is one of those that got 99th percentile test scores at a high SES school who didn't get into AAP. Her friends at other schools with lower test scores got in. It's infuriating - is this FCPS way of encouraging young families to move to crappier parts of the county? I'm confident my child would have gotten in at a school with different peers.

That fact may be your child did not cut it against your child’s competition at their school. It makes sense the way they are doing it based on the school’s population. If you don’t like it move or go private.

It actually doesn’t make any sense when the AAP curriculum is determined at the county level and not the local elementary. A 99% student should have access to the advanced curriculum, especially in math, where that child is cut off from future educational opportunities that they’re fully qualified and capable of. It makes no sense that a 99% kid can’t get advanced math but a 92% kid does at another school.

If the local elementary schools want to start more widely offering AAP accelerated math to qualified students, then I might feel differently. At our high SES center school, I know a number of highly qualified GE kids who had to jump through hoops to get into AAP math every school year, oftentimes missing 4-6 weeks of classes before the testing was completed and they were allowed in, late and now behind on curriculum.

They have to consider the space available.

No, they don’t. Space is not supposed to be a barrier

Anyone who wants to be in aap gets in. It just takes fortitude and deep pockets. It's never been about motivation or talent.

Yes, they take everyone. Well everyone except the dumb poster above. 🙄

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:There is a way to get into AAP if you do private testing (WISC, etc.)

Oh good, you’re back.

Private testing only helps if it shows your child to be gifted. I know many who had their children tested but couldn’t submit results bc it confirmed that there wasn’t necessarily a need.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The in pool scores for higher SES school is significantly higher than lower SES schools. It seems like FCPS is trying to keep students from wealthier schools from accessing AAP. Students scoring in the 99th percentile are not “in pool” at some elementary schools. I can understand lowering the “in pool” requirement for schools that traditionally have less AAP students; but it makes absolutely no sense to try to keep students scoring in the 98th/99th percentile from accessing A
The Advanced Academic Program.

FCPS is trying to “dumb down” the higher performing high schools by lowering the academics for students starting in 3rd grade. Less kids in AAP will mean lower I-ready/SOL scores, less kids taking advanced math in middle school, overall less prepared students for AP/DE classes in high school.

OP, I'm sure the justification for the local norms is to make the program more "equitable," but I agree with you that it makes no sense to keep out kids with two scores in the 99th percentile (or the 95th percentile) from a program that ends up serving 20% of the student population. The administrators would never admit to trying to dumb down the AAP program, but considering that a few decades ago, it used to allow only about 5% of the students, the program had to change so it could accommodate less smart kids. It's not like kids in the 2020's are four times as smart as in the 1990's, so the rigor is much less today. Ironically, all the hate around the program is mostly caused by the fact that many parents believe their children should be in that 20%; when it was just 5%, it was easier to dismiss as those kids being true outliers/oddballs/etc.

[Anonymous]

If there are a large number of students scoring highly - you don’t need a special program. The home school can accommodate them because they have the critical mass of student.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My child is one of those that got 99th percentile test scores at a high SES school who didn't get into AAP. Her friends at other schools with lower test scores got in. It's infuriating - is this FCPS way of encouraging young families to move to crappier parts of the county? I'm confident my child would have gotten in at a school with different peers.

That fact may be your child did not cut it against your child’s competition at their school. It makes sense the way they are doing it based on the school’s population. If you don’t like it move or go private.

Please tell me how it makes sense? The same curriculum is being taught at every school, PP.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:If there are a large number of students scoring highly - you don’t need a special program. The home school can accommodate them because they have the critical mass of student.

No. They. Can’t. And yes, they still need advanced programming for high scoring kids b/c the class sizes are enormous and are still being taught to the lowest performing students. These programs aren’t offering advanced math, at a faster pace, for the masses. Further, as a parent of 2 kids in a high SES base-is-center school, the AAP cohort v. Base class cohort, pace of class, and curriculum offered, has been vastly different. I’m relieved my kids are in AAP and I completely understand the frustration of parents who are getting gaslit by admin who say their 98/99% scoring kids, who are bored out of their minds in base classes, don’t need AAP bc we’re “such a high performing school.”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The in pool scores for higher SES school is significantly higher than lower SES schools. It seems like FCPS is trying to keep students from wealthier schools from accessing AAP. Students scoring in the 99th percentile are not “in pool” at some elementary schools. I can understand lowering the “in pool” requirement for schools that traditionally have less AAP students; but it makes absolutely no sense to try to keep students scoring in the 98th/99th percentile from accessing A
The Advanced Academic Program.

FCPS is trying to “dumb down” the higher performing high schools by lowering the academics for students starting in 3rd grade. Less kids in AAP will mean lower I-ready/SOL scores, less kids taking advanced math in middle school, overall less prepared students for AP/DE classes in high school.

I think you are looking at it from the wrong end of the of the telescope.
There is a cutoff (it's usually the 98th percentile or higher on both tests, if you didn't make the cutoff with one score in the 99th percentile, it's probably because you were below the 98th percentile on one of the tests) that is objectively applied to everyone.
But there are some schools where there aren't enough kids making the cutoff to fill even one class so to fill those spaces, they lower the cutoff for those schools.
They aren't applying a higher standard to your kid. They are applying a lower standard to kids from crappy schools.

The cutoff at the richest school in the county is not higher than the cutoff at Greenbriar west with a 20% FARM rate. But the cutoff starts to drop when you have a school where half the kids are ESL and 2/3rds are FARM students.

If you want that lower cutoff, you have to attend a crappier school.

Or you can just do a parent referral.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The in pool scores for higher SES school is significantly higher than lower SES schools. It seems like FCPS is trying to keep students from wealthier schools from accessing AAP. Students scoring in the 99th percentile are not “in pool” at some elementary schools. I can understand lowering the “in pool” requirement for schools that traditionally have less AAP students; but it makes absolutely no sense to try to keep students scoring in the 98th/99th percentile from accessing A
The Advanced Academic Program.

FCPS is trying to “dumb down” the higher performing high schools by lowering the academics for students starting in 3rd grade. Less kids in AAP will mean lower I-ready/SOL scores, less kids taking advanced math in middle school, overall less prepared students for AP/DE classes in high school.

I think you are looking at it from the wrong end of the of the telescope.
There is a cutoff (it's usually the 98th percentile or higher on both tests, if you didn't make the cutoff with one score in the 99th percentile, it's probably because you were below the 98th percentile on one of the tests) that is objectively applied to everyone.
But there are some schools where there aren't enough kids making the cutoff to fill even one class so to fill those spaces, they lower the cutoff for those schools.
They aren't applying a higher standard to your kid. They are applying a lower standard to kids from crappy schools.

The cutoff at the richest school in the county is not higher than the cutoff at Greenbriar west with a 20% FARM rate. But the cutoff starts to drop when you have a school where half the kids are ESL and 2/3rds are FARM students.

If you want that lower cutoff, you have to attend a crappier school.

Or you can just do a parent referral.

PP, can you share where the info in bold comes from? Because unless there is misinformation in the "in pool" thread: that parent's kid in Lake Braddock pyramid reported the child had 138 on NNAT and 136 on CogAT and didn't make the pool. Both these scores are in the 99th percentile.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If there are a large number of students scoring highly - you don’t need a special program. The home school can accommodate them because they have the critical mass of student.

No. They. Can’t. And yes, they still need advanced programming for high scoring kids b/c the class sizes are enormous and are still being taught to the lowest performing students. These programs aren’t offering advanced math, at a faster pace, for the masses. Further, as a parent of 2 kids in a high SES base-is-center school, the AAP cohort v. Base class cohort, pace of class, and curriculum offered, has been vastly different. I’m relieved my kids are in AAP and I completely understand the frustration of parents who are getting gaslit by admin who say their 98/99% scoring kids, who are bored out of their minds in base classes, don’t need AAP bc we’re “such a high performing school.”

Yes they can. They might not do it. But it is easily done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If there are a large number of students scoring highly - you don’t need a special program. The home school can accommodate them because they have the critical mass of student.

No. They. Can’t. And yes, they still need advanced programming for high scoring kids b/c the class sizes are enormous and are still being taught to the lowest performing students. These programs aren’t offering advanced math, at a faster pace, for the masses. Further, as a parent of 2 kids in a high SES base-is-center school, the AAP cohort v. Base class cohort, pace of class, and curriculum offered, has been vastly different. I’m relieved my kids are in AAP and I completely understand the frustration of parents who are getting gaslit by admin who say their 98/99% scoring kids, who are bored out of their minds in base classes, don’t need AAP bc we’re “such a high performing school.”

Yes they can. They might not do it. But it is easily done.

Right, the point is that they don’t/won’t do it, therefore the home school is NOT accommodating those high scoring student who you allege are already being served by base curriculum.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:The in pool scores for higher SES school is significantly higher than lower SES schools. It seems like FCPS is trying to keep students from wealthier schools from accessing AAP. Students scoring in the 99th percentile are not “in pool” at some elementary schools. I can understand lowering the “in pool” requirement for schools that traditionally have less AAP students; but it makes absolutely no sense to try to keep students scoring in the 98th/99th percentile from accessing A
The Advanced Academic Program.

FCPS is trying to “dumb down” the higher performing high schools by lowering the academics for students starting in 3rd grade. Less kids in AAP will mean lower I-ready/SOL scores, less kids taking advanced math in middle school, overall less prepared students for AP/DE classes in high school.

I think you are looking at it from the wrong end of the of the telescope.
There is a cutoff (it's usually the 98th percentile or higher on both tests, if you didn't make the cutoff with one score in the 99th percentile, it's probably because you were below the 98th percentile on one of the tests) that is objectively applied to everyone.
But there are some schools where there aren't enough kids making the cutoff to fill even one class so to fill those spaces, they lower the cutoff for those schools.
They aren't applying a higher standard to your kid. They are applying a lower standard to kids from crappy schools.

The cutoff at the richest school in the county is not higher than the cutoff at Greenbriar west with a 20% FARM rate. But the cutoff starts to drop when you have a school where half the kids are ESL and 2/3rds are FARM students.

If you want that lower cutoff, you have to attend a crappier school.

Or you can just do a parent referral.

PP, can you share where the info in bold comes from? Because unless there is misinformation in the "in pool" thread: that parent's kid in Lake Braddock pyramid reported the child had 138 on NNAT and 136 on CogAT and didn't make the pool. Both these scores are in the 99th percentile.

I think it was on this site years ago.
Are any of the cogat subelement scores below 133?