Music when you don’t expect they will major in music

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look, it comes down to what message do you want to send your child.

Do you want them to think that only "profitable" interests matter? That an activity is not "worth it" if it doesn't contribute to college admissions?

Or do you want your child to find something he loves, to develop a work ethic, and to have a refuge in MS and HS with other kids who have shared interests?

For what its worth, colleges LOVE classically trained musicians who are not destined for the conservatory, because even schools without conservatories want to have orchestras/bands.

Ack. Maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned colleges. I don’t think I am explaining this correctly. Re: colleges- If he is indeed going to pursue music as a profession, I don’t think he’d regret this time when looking back. But if he isn’t, I don’t want him to burn out by going so hard now. And potentially miss out on other opportunities too (like being outside more, playing with friends more often, a different hobby like a sport). I’m happy whether he pursues music as a career or not. But I definitely don’t want him to reject music later because of overload as a child. I was pushed to take piano and I abandoned it as an adult for 20 years.

It’s not about college or being professional it’s about enjoyment. If you don’t want to don’t. But you are wrong.

[Anonymous]

I have a kid like this. I would stay with once/week lessons (an hour in length, maybe twice/week in summer) and encourage him to practice as much as he wants (several hours a day). The key for us has been to find a teacher who understands him, challenges him, but is ok with his goals (not to be a professional) and helps him play at a high level but doesn’t burn him out.

My kid is on HS and most of his friends do plan to pursue music professionally. He probably could too but is clear he doesn’t have the desire to. I sometimes wonder if he will change his mind in college.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have a kid like this. I would stay with once/week lessons (an hour in length, maybe twice/week in summer) and encourage him to practice as much as he wants (several hours a day). The key for us has been to find a teacher who understands him, challenges him, but is ok with his goals (not to be a professional) and helps him play at a high level but doesn’t burn him out.

My kid is on HS and most of his friends do plan to pursue music professionally. He probably could too but is clear he doesn’t have the desire to. I sometimes wonder if he will change his mind in college.

Anyway, I get what you are saying and I think it’s all about the right teacher. Some teachers won’t be able to resist pushing too hard with a kid like this.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:DS 8 learns an instrument. He’s been playing about a year. He’s always been enthusiastic and sounded good from the start. After moving to a more advanced teacher, I feel like he is flying through his exercises and pieces. The new teacher suggested longer lessons or lessons twice per week.

DS is eager to do it all because he feels 30 minutes of lesson time a week is not enough. He practices close to an hour a day.

The thing is… I do not expect he will major in music or become a professional. He is not even close to being a prodigy and is just a normally skilled musician with perhaps slightly harder work ethic than most.

How far do you think I should let him lean into this, perhaps at the cost of giving up other things (other activities like sports or language, fewer play dates, math and language enrichment/remediation, less down time)?

It's a great hobby. IMO
It's important that children be allowed to pursue their passions. It looks good as an EC to any college

[Anonymous]

It's impossible for someone to burn out whole only doing as much as they want. They might get bored and move on (quite likely for an 8 yo) but not burn out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Look, it comes down to what message do you want to send your child.

Do you want them to think that only "profitable" interests matter? That an activity is not "worth it" if it doesn't contribute to college admissions?

Or do you want your child to find something he loves, to develop a work ethic, and to have a refuge in MS and HS with other kids who have shared interests?

For what its worth, colleges LOVE classically trained musicians who are not destined for the conservatory, because even schools without conservatories want to have orchestras/bands.

Ack. Maybe I shouldn’t have mentioned colleges. I don’t think I am explaining this correctly. Re: colleges- If he is indeed going to pursue music as a profession, I don’t think he’d regret this time when looking back. But if he isn’t, I don’t want him to burn out by going so hard now. And potentially miss out on other opportunities too (like being outside more, playing with friends more often, a different hobby like a sport). I’m happy whether he pursues music as a career or not. But I definitely don’t want him to reject

music later because of overload as a child. I was pushed to take piano and I abandoned it as an adult for 20 years.

Yes but the spirit of what you said remains, even in your explanation. let the kid pursue a passion until he doesn't want to, even if you have "invested" to the expense of other interests (b/c you seem like you may be the sort of parent who might not let him quit either which is sad)

[Anonymous]

My DC is 8 and takes lessons 1x a week and also takes music theory 1x a week and also performance class 1x per month. They spend about 9 hours a week on music.

The way I think about it is 1. I like them be the driver of goals and intentions- I approach it as teaching them a lifelong skill that they can use not only as an “activity “ now but for refuge and mental health when they are older and 2. I think about the amount of hours per week of time investment; my DC does not have any interest in sports. I cannot make them want to play them. I compare the amount of time they spend on music a week and compare it to kids playing sports at their age. Kids playing travel sports or even rec sports spend maybe an 1-2 hours average a day practicing (including traveling time to and from games). Many kids in multiple sports do this or more. And travel teams definitely require more time commitment. My DC spends way less time than their peers engaged in “required” music commitments.

People don’t even bat an eye when parents say they have their kids doing hours and hours of sports a week but when you say your kid does this much music people raise their eyes. I assume it’s because people assume the parent is “making” their child do this. However, my DC lives for their music classes and relationships. They thrive being engaged in structured activities and still have plenty of time for play dates, school events/activities, and family time.

It’s about knowing your child, what drives them, and setting an intention for the process. Do not make it about the outcome, make it about the journey.

[Anonymous]

No one is raising an eye to a kid spending lots of time on activities they love.

Everyone should raise an eye on a parent who thinks activities should lead to something bigger -- when their kid is 8.

Yes kids will drop an activity because they are kids. Totally normal too. Not a sign of burnout or their college major or profession.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:My DC is 8 and takes lessons 1x a week and also takes music theory 1x a week and also performance class 1x per month. They spend about 9 hours a week on music.

The way I think about it is 1. I like them be the driver of goals and intentions- I approach it as teaching them a lifelong skill that they can use not only as an “activity “ now but for refuge and mental health when they are older and 2. I think about the amount of hours per week of time investment; my DC does not have any interest in sports. I cannot make them want to play them. I compare the amount of time they spend on music a week and compare it to kids playing sports at their age. Kids playing travel sports or even rec sports spend maybe an 1-2 hours average a day practicing (including traveling time to and from games). Many kids in multiple sports do this or more. And travel teams definitely require more time commitment. My DC spends way less time than their peers engaged in “required” music commitments.

People don’t even bat an eye when parents say they have their kids doing hours and hours of sports a week but when you say your kid does this much music people raise their eyes. I assume it’s because people assume the parent is “making” their child do this. However, my DC lives for their music classes and relationships. They thrive being engaged in structured activities and still have plenty of time for play dates, school events/activities, and family time.

It’s about knowing your child, what drives them, and setting an intention for the process. Do not make it about the outcome, make it about the journey.

I think that kind of 9 hours/week in music is different and I think I might feel more comfortable with that. With music theory and group class, you have a music community and your child can build connections and make friends in those classes. With mine, it’s individual lessons and private practice. That’s a whole lot of solo time. With sports at least there is more team time and social interaction. But even then, spending 9 hours a week on a sport seems like a lot to me for an 8 year old.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:8 OP. Your child is 8. You sound like a lunatic.

I am a lunatic. But I also wonder if it is lunacy to allow an 8 year old to spend 7-8 hours a week on music. It doesn’t leave much time or flexibility for other things.

He doesn’t need to “lean into” anything, idiot.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a kid like this. I would stay with once/week lessons (an hour in length, maybe twice/week in summer) and encourage him to practice as much as he wants (several hours a day). The key for us has been to find a teacher who understands him, challenges him, but is ok with his goals (not to be a professional) and helps him play at a high level but doesn’t burn him out.

My kid is on HS and most of his friends do plan to pursue music professionally. He probably could too but is clear he doesn’t have the desire to. I sometimes wonder if he will change his mind in college.

Anyway, I get what you are saying and I think it’s all about the right teacher. Some teachers won’t be able to resist pushing too hard with a kid like this.

Thanks for your reply. It’s helpful to hear from someone with a similar kid and also an older one so you’ve BTDT. I think you’re right about finding the right teacher too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:My DC is 8 and takes lessons 1x a week and also takes music theory 1x a week and also performance class 1x per month. They spend about 9 hours a week on music.

The way I think about it is 1. I like them be the driver of goals and intentions- I approach it as teaching them a lifelong skill that they can use not only as an “activity “ now but for refuge and mental health when they are older and 2. I think about the amount of hours per week of time investment; my DC does not have any interest in sports. I cannot make them want to play them. I compare the amount of time they spend on music a week and compare it to kids playing sports at their age. Kids playing travel sports or even rec sports spend maybe an 1-2 hours average a day practicing (including traveling time to and from games). Many kids in multiple sports do this or more. And travel teams definitely require more time commitment. My DC spends way less time than their peers engaged in “required” music commitments.

People don’t even bat an eye when parents say they have their kids doing hours and hours of sports a week but when you say your kid does this much music people raise their eyes. I assume it’s because people assume the parent is “making” their child do this. However, my DC lives for their music classes and relationships. They thrive being engaged in structured activities and still have plenty of time for play dates, school events/activities, and family time.

It’s about knowing your child, what drives them, and setting an intention for the process. Do not make it about the outcome, make it about the journey.

I think that kind of 9 hours/week in music is different and I think I might feel more comfortable with that. With music theory and group class, you have a music community and your child can build connections and make friends in those classes. With mine, it’s individual lessons and private practice. That’s a whole lot of solo time. With sports at least there is more team time and social interaction. But even then, spending 9 hours a week on a sport seems like a lot to me for an 8 year old.

Mine do sports and music many hours a week. Its good on many levels. You are making this about you not your child. There are so many great orchestra and other groups for your child to participate in

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:8 OP. Your child is 8. You sound like a lunatic.

I am a lunatic. But I also wonder if it is lunacy to allow an 8 year old to spend 7-8 hours a week on music. It doesn’t leave much time or flexibility for other things.

OP from your list of alternative activities, what do you think he needs the most? I'm guessing play dates but you know your kid. Tell us more.

I think he needs down time, play with other kids (he’s an only) and math/literacy support (he’s at a so-so public).

Why do you assume that music isn't his down time? For me, playing the piano is like meditation, and it helps me feel centered. Some people love music more than anything else they could be doing.

I think my kid moved from 30 minute lessons to 45 minute ones around Suzuki book 3. It's pretty normal to have longer lessons when the music is more complicated and the kid is mature enough to handle a longer lesson. For practice, if you set a minimum practice time, and your kid is choosing to practice a lot longer than the minimum, that's fine. The kids most likely to burn out are the ones being forced to practice a lot longer than they'd like, to play even during summer when they need a break, or to do a lot of competitions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I have a kid like this. I would stay with once/week lessons (an hour in length, maybe twice/week in summer) and encourage him to practice as much as he wants (several hours a day). The key for us has been to find a teacher who understands him, challenges him, but is ok with his goals (not to be a professional) and helps him play at a high level but doesn’t burn him out.

My kid is on HS and most of his friends do plan to pursue music professionally. He probably could too but is clear he doesn’t have the desire to. I sometimes wonder if he will change his mind in college.

Anyway, I get what you are saying and I think it’s all about the right teacher. Some teachers won’t be able to resist pushing too hard with a kid like this.

Thanks for your reply. It’s helpful to hear from someone with a similar kid and also an older one so you’ve BTDT. I think you’re right about finding the right teacher too.

Being pushed a little is not a bad thing. That's how kids advance. With a HS student, mine lives for music - private lessons, a group at the university, private orchestra AND does sports on top of it. Its all about priorities. I'd rather they be doing that than video games.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:No one is raising an eye to a kid spending lots of time on activities they love.

Everyone should raise an eye on a parent who thinks activities should lead to something bigger -- when their kid is 8.

Yes kids will drop an activity because they are kids. Totally normal too. Not a sign of burnout or their college major or profession.

+1 Right now he's finding joy in this so let him. Maybe ask him to do one other thing too just for exposure, but otherwise, lean into the joy. If he stops enjoying it he'll move on to something else.

My main caution is to not push to competition if he's not interested and make sure he doesn't have a teacher that does that. In our culture there's so much push to make everything an external accomplishment but it doesn't have to be that way and sometimes the external stuff can kill the joy. (of course some kids like the competition and if so, great!)

I played piano all through childhood and high school. During HS it was my stress relief. I played at least an hour a day just for my own enjoyment. I'd hated recitals and stopped in MS and my teacher was fine with that. If I'd been forced to continue recitals I'd have dropped the lessons. Similarly my DD loves art, has taken a few classes over the years, but mostly self-taught and spends many hours a week on it. But it is purely for herself. She will not take a for-credit class at school, she will not enter work in a show/competition. Still her college essay was mostly about her art even through she's majoring in a science field. Got some notes from admissions officers about how much they liked it and how she could pursue her art passion at their school while also studying science.