What happened to every elementary school having a dedicated level 4 classroom??

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Does anyone have any backstory for why elementary schools Don’t have these classrooms as we were told they would?

DEI and logistical issues, but primarily DEI. As a parent of a non-AAP AND AAP students (both likely borderline and almost equivalent in skills), I both love the clustering model and hate it at the same time. For my non AAP child it provides an opportunity for my child to have peers to look up to, and the teacher provides the "extra" aspects to all students who can handle it such as my child. However, the program seemed watered down (maybe it's just my expectations as I don't have an example of a full time program), and the teacher was still spending the majority of the time with underperforming children, while the higher end of the class was largely learning independently or from eachother. For example, my child consistently says that when he asked for help, he's directed to another student because she is too busy with other children. Not a BAD approach, but I'd not think it's optimal for learning either, and feel bad for the 3-4 students who are constantly being asked to teach instead of learning.

As a parent of one of these kids, I appreciate you recognizing this! But I think it is a bad approach for these kids - it's really hard to have normal social interactions when you are a mini-teacher in the classroom. I support local level 4 but it requires staffing up so that all kids get the support they need, including "level 3" kids who deserve to get as much of the level 4 content as they are ready for.

Mixed classrooms work fine if there are more teachers: the point is not to segregate the AAP kids, the point is to get them time with teachers instead of making them teach themselves. Centers with giant AAP classes have similar problems with kids teaching themselves, btw. It's an unmet staffing need no matter which model you choose.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Science and Social Studies exist, too, my friend. Maybe there was no difference for your DC but mine received Level IV S/SS as well as LA and Advanced Math.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Y’all are out of touch. It’s not called Level IV. It’s called Full-time cluster services. You keep looking and listening for the wrong term.

There’s not necessarily going to be a dedicated classroom at grades 3-6. As another poster noted, the services can easily be delivered using a cluster model where 6-8 eligible students are in a classroom.

The point was not that the services can be easily delivered via the cluster model, but that the cluster model isn't delivering the same level of services (watered down) and that third graders are called into service as teachers for their peers instead of getting the education they need. Cluster classrooms have students in them who are underperforming and get most of the teacher's attention because the school can't let them be "left behind." It's not fair to teachers or students at any level to pretend to offer full time AAP with this approach.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Y’all are out of touch. It’s not called Level IV. It’s called Full-time cluster services. You keep looking and listening for the wrong term.

There’s not necessarily going to be a dedicated classroom at grades 3-6. As another poster noted, the services can easily be delivered using a cluster model where 6-8 eligible students are in a classroom.

he point was not that the services can be easily delivered via the cluster model, but that the cluster model isn't delivering the same level of services (watered down) and that third graders are called into service as teachers for their peers instead of getting the education they need. Cluster classrooms have students in them who are underperforming and get most of the teacher's attention because the school can't let them be "left behind." It's not fair to teachers or students at any level to pretend to offer full time AAP with this approach.

Welcome to what gen ed parents have to deal with.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Thanks! Now that that's out of the way...

[Anonymous]

What's the explanation for how this "cluster" approach is better for the AAP kids than a designated AAP classroom?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What's the explanation for how this "cluster" approach is better for the AAP kids than a designated AAP classroom?

It doesn't need to be better for AAP kids. It needs to be adequate under state law- it is, thanks to the bar being very low, and it's better for the school as a whole.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Science and Social Studies exist, too, my friend. Maybe there was no difference for your DC but mine received Level IV S/SS as well as LA and Advanced Math.

The SS/Science content is the same too. Some schools are teaching the Level 4 curriculum to everyone. The only difference between SS/Science and GenEd are some extensions and quicker pace. Adv Math is offered at base school too. Your child isn’t getting an advanced curriculum that isn’t offered at their base school too.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Science and Social Studies exist, too, my friend. Maybe there was no difference for your DC but mine received Level IV S/SS as well as LA and Advanced Math.

The SS/Science content is the same too. Some schools are teaching the Level 4 curriculum to everyone. The only difference between SS/Science and GenEd are some extensions and quicker pace. Adv Math is offered at base school too. Your child isn’t getting an advanced curriculum that isn’t offered at their base school too.

What you don't know, you don't know.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:What's the explanation for how this "cluster" approach is better for the AAP kids than a designated AAP classroom?

It isn’t better for the kids but it is better/easier for the school, and besides, Advanced Math in 3rd grade + is the biggie and the other advanced subjects are watered down to the point that they’re barely any different. If you have a really great ELA/Social Studies student who isn’t in advanced math, I feel bad for them because they’re getting nothing.

Most of the 3rd grade advanced math kids are just “good students” in general. If you cluster them all together, you have one class with all good students and 2 or 3 that are really iffy with few good students. If you spread them out in the classrooms, or have them switch classrooms just for math, you don’t have that imbalance.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:What's the explanation for how this "cluster" approach is better for the AAP kids than a designated AAP classroom?

It isn’t better for the kids but it is better/easier for the school, and besides, Advanced Math in 3rd grade + is the biggie and the other advanced subjects are watered down to the point that they’re barely any different. If you have a really great ELA/Social Studies student who isn’t in advanced math, I feel bad for them because they’re getting nothing.

Most of the 3rd grade advanced math kids are just “good students” in general. If you cluster them all together, you have one class with all good students and 2 or 3 that are really iffy with few good students. If you spread them out in the classrooms, or have them switch classrooms just for math, you don’t have that imbalance.

I think our smaller center school puts all the level 2/3/4 kids together. Either that or 40% of base kids made AAP (based on comparing class rosters to last year's yearbook). I've heard gen Ed is a mess.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Science and Social Studies exist, too, my friend. Maybe there was no difference for your DC but mine received Level IV S/SS as well as LA and Advanced Math.

The SS/Science content is the same too. Some schools are teaching the Level 4 curriculum to everyone. The only difference between SS/Science and GenEd are some extensions and quicker pace. Adv Math is offered at base school too. Your child isn’t getting an advanced curriculum that isn’t offered at their base school too.

What you don't know, you don't know.

I am a different poster but the OP above is correct. SS/Science in AAP isn’t anything drastically different and many schools are using the LL4 pacing and resources with all. In fact, some of the AAP lessons the county creates in SS are also on the Gen Ed one. The differences are AAP has a different PBL, and might go more in depth on a topic, but the content is the same. - AAP teacher

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Science and Social Studies exist, too, my friend. Maybe there was no difference for your DC but mine received Level IV S/SS as well as LA and Advanced Math.

The SS/Science content is the same too. Some schools are teaching the Level 4 curriculum to everyone. The only difference between SS/Science and GenEd are some extensions and quicker pace. Adv Math is offered at base school too. Your child isn’t getting an advanced curriculum that isn’t offered at their base school too.

What you don't know, you don't know.

I am a different poster but the OP above is correct. SS/Science in AAP isn’t anything drastically different and many schools are using the LL4 pacing and resources with all. In fact, some of the AAP lessons the county creates in SS are also on the Gen Ed one. The differences are AAP has a different PBL, and might go more in depth on a topic, but the content is the same. - AAP teacher

Arts and crafts is a ridiculous way to teach history- parent who despises PBL

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Science and Social Studies exist, too, my friend. Maybe there was no difference for your DC but mine received Level IV S/SS as well as LA and Advanced Math.

The SS/Science content is the same too. Some schools are teaching the Level 4 curriculum to everyone. The only difference between SS/Science and GenEd are some extensions and quicker pace. Adv Math is offered at base school too. Your child isn’t getting an advanced curriculum that isn’t offered at their base school too.

What you don't know, you don't know.

I am a different poster but the OP above is correct. SS/Science in AAP isn’t anything drastically different and many schools are using the LL4 pacing and resources with all. In fact, some of the AAP lessons the county creates in SS are also on the Gen Ed one. The differences are AAP has a different PBL, and might go more in depth on a topic, but the content is the same. - AAP teacher

Arts and crafts is a ridiculous way to teach history- parent who despises PBL

Like anything, it's all in the planning and execution. Dioramas are not real PBLs, but a 3D timeline representation or making an ancient newspaper might be.

However, the focus on math to the exclusion of all of other subjects is damaging. Kids who are weak in LA or science deserve to have their own class pacing, and kids who are advanced in those deserve appropriate material.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I'm surprised the anti-AAP/anti-Center poster hasn't shown up yet.

The Center model should stay for precisely this reason. There aren't enough kids at base schools to fill a class in each grade so they will either cluster and/or drop the academic threshold to include more kids in order to fill AAP seats.

Centers are not needed anymore. AAP is a joke now with the new basal. EVERYONE is getting the same LA. Adv Math should be offered at all ES at this point.

Science and Social Studies exist, too, my friend. Maybe there was no difference for your DC but mine received Level IV S/SS as well as LA and Advanced Math.

The SS/Science content is the same too. Some schools are teaching the Level 4 curriculum to everyone. The only difference between SS/Science and GenEd are some extensions and quicker pace. Adv Math is offered at base school too. Your child isn’t getting an advanced curriculum that isn’t offered at their base school too.

What you don't know, you don't know.

I am a different poster but the OP above is correct. SS/Science in AAP isn’t anything drastically different and many schools are using the LL4 pacing and resources with all. In fact, some of the AAP lessons the county creates in SS are also on the Gen Ed one. The differences are AAP has a different PBL, and might go more in depth on a topic, but the content is the same. - AAP teacher

Arts and crafts is a ridiculous way to teach history- parent who despises PBL

Like anything, it's all in the planning and execution. Dioramas are not real PBLs, but a 3D timeline representation or making an ancient newspaper might be.

However, the focus on math to the exclusion of all of other subjects is damaging. Kids who are weak in LA or science deserve to have their own class pacing, and kids who are advanced in those deserve appropriate material.

The first is arts and crafts, the second is make believe unless you really think that 4th graders are accessing source material for their articles. Maybe instead of the diorama or the article, they could, and I know this is crazy talk, read a text book that discusses the history they're studying at a grade appropriate level.