What is a donut family? A donut hole family?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I have never understood this metaphor and still don’t. If income distribution were circular, I could picture it, but great wealth doesn’t loop around and eventually become impoverished.

What am I missing?

It's a stupid metaphor, it was stolen from Medicare discussions. Donut is the visual, but the discussion of income is really just an axis starting at the center of the donut extending to infinity. You can't get from 0 income to infinite income, without passing through this donut.

[Anonymous]

This is a helpful visual:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doughnut_(economic_model)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is a helpful visual:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doughnut_(economic_model)

for some reason that link didn't work.. maybe this time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doughnut_(economic_model)

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:This is a helpful visual:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doughnut_(economic_model)

for some reason that link didn't work.. maybe this time:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doughnut_(economic_model)

This?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Someone who makes too much money to qualify for financial aid but doesn't make enough not to feel the pinch of paying full price.

new poster here
I always thought it was more extreme than just "feel the pinch"...more like lopping off an arm or something?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Someone who makes too much money to qualify for financial aid but doesn't make enough not to feel the pinch of paying full price.

new poster here
I always thought it was more extreme than just "feel the pinch"...more like lopping off an arm or something?

To me, it means unaffordable. The family with a 200k income and two kids heading to college would be a donut hole family for FAFSA schools assuming 60k EFCs

[Anonymous]

Typical DCUM donut hole family is not an object of pity for 95% of Americans, probably more. Average DCUM donut hole family probably has gross income of $300-400K. Yes, some are lower, but that’s how averages work. They’re unable to cash-flow college tuition because they have (some combination of these) a lot of house/s, a lot of private school tuition, a lot of travel spend, a lot of travel sports spend, a lot of retirement deductions, a lot of household service spend, etc.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Typical DCUM donut hole family is not an object of pity for 95% of Americans, probably more. Average DCUM donut hole family probably has gross income of $300-400K. Yes, some are lower, but that’s how averages work. They’re unable to cash-flow college tuition because they have (some combination of these) a lot of house/s, a lot of private school tuition, a lot of travel spend, a lot of travel sports spend, a lot of retirement deductions, a lot of household service spend, etc.

In other words, a whole bunch of luxuries from which most Americans would feel lucky to afford even just one or two.

"Donut hole" families deserve no sympathy for whining about affording luxuries.

[Anonymous]

It's a dog whistle.

It's based on the idea that UMC families deserve to be able to afford college tuition, and all the luxuries they currently have, while people who already don't have any luxuries and who might possibly, at a small percentage of colleges, still be able to attend, are seen as "lucky", because they don't really deserve anything at all.

When someone uses the term we can assume one of two things about them.

1) They are incredibly self centered

or

2) They are uneducated and naive and somehow buy the narrative that someone with an $80K before tax income, who earns a spot at a college where they are expected to make a $10K contribution, doesn't feel a "pinch".

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:
Can someone please properly define what a "donut family" and a "donut hole family" are?

Families in the top 10% of household income earners nationwide, who are butthurt that they don’t get need-based aid at elite private colleges that cost the same as what the national median HHI is per year. And while they are wealthy enough to have given their kids almost every advantage, are mad that they are not wealthy enough to have no problem paying 240k+ over four years for just one kid—without having that cut into their current lifestyle/being able to max out retirement contributions/not able to take that 10k+ yearly vacation, etc…

Another requirement of being a donut hole family not ever even considering loans. They either just suck it up and pay full price, or tell their kid to go to some other school that is somewhat cheaper even though it kills them since it’s only a T100 and not a T50.

Tl;dr. Families better off than 90-95% of every other household in the country, but still think they should get need-based aid since they’re not “rich”.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Can someone please properly define what a "donut family" and a "donut hole family" are?

Families in the top 10% of household income earners nationwide, who are butthurt that they don’t get need-based aid at elite private colleges that cost the same as what the national median HHI is per year. And while they are wealthy enough to have given their kids almost every advantage, are mad that they are not wealthy enough to have no problem paying 240k+ over four years for just one kid—without having that cut into their current lifestyle/being able to max out retirement contributions/not able to take that 10k+ yearly vacation, etc…

Another requirement of being a donut hole family not ever even considering loans. They either just suck it up and pay full price, or tell their kid to go to some other school that is somewhat cheaper even though it kills them since it’s only a T100 and not a T50.

Tl;dr. Families better off than 90-95% of every other household in the country, but still think they should get need-based aid since they’re not “rich”.

Yes, donut eaters.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Typical DCUM donut hole family is not an object of pity for 95% of Americans, probably more. Average DCUM donut hole family probably has gross income of $300-400K. Yes, some are lower, but that’s how averages work. They’re unable to cash-flow college tuition because they have (some combination of these) a lot of house/s, a lot of private school tuition, a lot of travel spend, a lot of travel sports spend, a lot of retirement deductions, a lot of household service spend, etc.

You’re clueless if you think everyone making this salary has more than one house, private school tuition, and lots of travel. The reason DCUM is so angry in general is because we’re making that munch money and living completely unimpressive, uninteresting, not fun lives. And we grew up feeling confident that this much money would give us all those luxuries. Are you 15?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:
Can someone please properly define what a "donut family" and a "donut hole family" are?

Families in the top 10% of household income earners nationwide, who are butthurt that they don’t get need-based aid at elite private colleges that cost the same as what the national median HHI is per year. And while they are wealthy enough to have given their kids almost every advantage, are mad that they are not wealthy enough to have no problem paying 240k+ over four years for just one kid—without having that cut into their current lifestyle/being able to max out retirement contributions/not able to take that 10k+ yearly vacation, etc…

Another requirement of being a donut hole family not ever even considering loans. They either just suck it up and pay full price, or tell their kid to go to some other school that is somewhat cheaper even though it kills them since it’s only a T100 and not a T50.

Tl;dr. Families better off than 90-95% of every other household in the country, but still think they should get need-based aid since they’re not “rich”.

The kid can’t borrow enough under the loan limits to pay that $87k a year cost, the PARENTS are the ones who will have to borrow.

That’s why the loan option is invisible to them, they have to do it.

If it’s so ultra important for Larla to go T20 then you can borrow PLUS loans in literally unlimited amounts for it.

[Anonymous]

Yes that’s exactly it- I make too much for most need based aid (and it’s not even close to $300k) and I don’t have enough savings and cash to pay full freight for a T50.

Not sure where the “whining” claims comes from.

We just told DC what we can afford and to pick from schools in that price range. There are a lot out there that are very good. I don’t feel deprived. I feel lucky.

Getting generous aid isn’t a guarantee of no problems- genuinely poor families often have trouble coming up with the parental contribution and borrow it.

Any frenzy comes from feeling entitled to the most expensive schools on the planet as the ONLY OPTION.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Typical DCUM donut hole family is not an object of pity for 95% of Americans, probably more. Average DCUM donut hole family probably has gross income of $300-400K. Yes, some are lower, but that’s how averages work. They’re unable to cash-flow college tuition because they have (some combination of these) a lot of house/s, a lot of private school tuition, a lot of travel spend, a lot of travel sports spend, a lot of retirement deductions, a lot of household service spend, etc.

You’re clueless if you think everyone making this salary has more than one house, private school tuition, and lots of travel. The reason DCUM is so angry in general is because we’re making that munch money and living completely unimpressive, uninteresting, not fun lives. And we grew up feeling confident that this much money would give us all those luxuries. Are you 15?

No, the people responding say with confidence that a 300K household can cover full tuition, because they are paying half tuition in a 150K household. There are choices, but this is not an injustice.