Best used smaller 4x4

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:If you want a reliable car, get RAV4 or CRV used.

I those are AWD not 4x4?

?? And that matters to you? If so, why?

DP
AWD and 4WD are NOT the same things.

4WD systems have a locking transfer case with high and low range gearing. AWD systems don’t operate like this. AWD can be fantastic in snow, but in off-road situations requiring low speed crawling, deep mud, or terrain that causes wheels to come off the ground from suspension flex, AWD systems cannot cope with this.

I have NEVER had an issue with my AWD in DMV. Do you live in mountains OP?

DP

OP is not talking about driving to Starbucks in the rain. If someone specifically says they need 4wd, it’s because they NEED it. Your silly AWD car isn’t driving through two feet of water and surviving.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't want a truck bc it's too long but I need a beater 4x4 for driving around in the woods. But it can't look too tragic because I have to park it in my driveway in town.

Need further information/elaboration on what exactly “driving around in the woods” means before I can recommend at vehicle.

Are we talking gravel or dirt roads or driveways out in rural areas? Or forest service fire/logging roads in national forest land? Or did you mean actual hard-core off-road Jeep trails (Potts Mountain, Flagpole Knob, etc)? Need to know the type of off-road driving you’ll be doing, because they are not all equal.

County and state gravel roads generally do not require 4wd. Virtually any car will suffice.

Forest Service roads (Peters Mill, etc) require some kind of basic, stock 4wd/AWD. Subaru, most other SUV’s, Jeep Cherokee, Liberty, Grand Cherokee, etc.

Off-road trails (Potts Mountain, Flagpole Knob, etc) require either a Jeep Wrangler or aftermarket modified SUV or compact pick up of some kind (4Runner, Defender, Tacoma, etc). You will not be able to drive many of these trails in anything other than a Jeep (and ideally a modified one, at that) without destroying the vehicle. Modified 4Runners, Defenders, Xterra’s can also handle these these trails as well as a Wrangler can, but ONLY if they’re modified.

Also, what’s your budget?

These woods are 3 hours away from DC, so low mountains like Appalachian will be the worst of it I think.
Private gravel and dirt roads, plus off road unmaintained trails. We have a RAV4, and I don't trust it on gravel roads in the winter. A big plus is if the vehicle can ford a small creek under 2 feet deep.

Budget is under 35k

The water fording thing is gonna be problematic for virtually everything except a Jeep Wrangler or Ford Bronco on larger size tires (32”-35”). 24” is a LOT of water. Yikes.

It’s not that other vehicles can’t technically ford that deep in an emergency, it’s just that their interiors and electrical systems aren’t set up to get wet like a Wrangler or Bronco interior. And if spend more than a moment in water that deep, regardless of vehicle type, you’re going to get water flooding inside to some degree. The Jeep and Bronco (I think?) have drain holes in the body tub to get water out and their electrical components are water resistant. Other SUVs aren’t built with that in mind. Even Land Rover advises no water fording deeper than 15” on the new Defender.


At your price point and your fording requirements, you’re pretty much limited to Jeep Wranglers prior to about 2018.

I’d look for a 2014-2017 Rubicon at the top end of your budget, and for a 2000-2006 TJ Wrangler in decent shape (ideally lightly modified) for something further under your budget.

A 4Runner or 70/80 series Landcruiser would be good too, IF it weren’t for the water fording depth.


I drive a LOT off-road, and I try and avoid water that deep. Two feet is a LOT of water. Yikes. Make sure your breather lines for your differentials are water tight and extended. Same for t-case breather line if it has one.

My rubicon on standard tires can ford almost 3 feet (33 inches). As for the Land Rover - given their electronics issues, I wouldn't advise even drinking water in one.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I don't want a truck bc it's too long but I need a beater 4x4 for driving around in the woods. But it can't look too tragic because I have to park it in my driveway in town.

Need further information/elaboration on what exactly “driving around in the woods” means before I can recommend at vehicle.

Are we talking gravel or dirt roads or driveways out in rural areas? Or forest service fire/logging roads in national forest land? Or did you mean actual hard-core off-road Jeep trails (Potts Mountain, Flagpole Knob, etc)? Need to know the type of off-road driving you’ll be doing, because they are not all equal.

County and state gravel roads generally do not require 4wd. Virtually any car will suffice.

Forest Service roads (Peters Mill, etc) require some kind of basic, stock 4wd/AWD. Subaru, most other SUV’s, Jeep Cherokee, Liberty, Grand Cherokee, etc.

Off-road trails (Potts Mountain, Flagpole Knob, etc) require either a Jeep Wrangler or aftermarket modified SUV or compact pick up of some kind (4Runner, Defender, Tacoma, etc). You will not be able to drive many of these trails in anything other than a Jeep (and ideally a modified one, at that) without destroying the vehicle. Modified 4Runners, Defenders, Xterra’s can also handle these these trails as well as a Wrangler can, but ONLY if they’re modified.

Also, what’s your budget?

These woods are 3 hours away from DC, so low mountains like Appalachian will be the worst of it I think.
Private gravel and dirt roads, plus off road unmaintained trails. We have a RAV4, and I don't trust it on gravel roads in the winter. A big plus is if the vehicle can ford a small creek under 2 feet deep.

Budget is under 35k

The water fording thing is gonna be problematic for virtually everything except a Jeep Wrangler or Ford Bronco on larger size tires (32”-35”). 24” is a LOT of water. Yikes.

It’s not that other vehicles can’t technically ford that deep in an emergency, it’s just that their interiors and electrical systems aren’t set up to get wet like a Wrangler or Bronco interior. And if spend more than a moment in water that deep, regardless of vehicle type, you’re going to get water flooding inside to some degree. The Jeep and Bronco (I think?) have drain holes in the body tub to get water out and their electrical components are water resistant. Other SUVs aren’t built with that in mind. Even Land Rover advises no water fording deeper than 15” on the new Defender.


At your price point and your fording requirements, you’re pretty much limited to Jeep Wranglers prior to about 2018.

I’d look for a 2014-2017 Rubicon at the top end of your budget, and for a 2000-2006 TJ Wrangler in decent shape (ideally lightly modified) for something further under your budget.

A 4Runner or 70/80 series Landcruiser would be good too, IF it weren’t for the water fording depth.


I drive a LOT off-road, and I try and avoid water that deep. Two feet is a LOT of water. Yikes. Make sure your breather lines for your differentials are water tight and extended. Same for t-case breather line if it has one.

My rubicon on standard tires can ford almost 3 feet (33 inches). As for the Land Rover - given their electronics issues, I wouldn't advise even drinking water in one.

I have a ‘16 JKUR with a 4” and 37’s and I am very careful about not fording more than about 2 feet of water. At 33” of water at stock height, you’re kinda living on the edge, especially without an intake snorkel. Not too mention your downstream cats, O2 sensors and evap canister are all well below 33” and none of them take kindly to submersion, especially the evap can. And if you’ve got a manual, your bellhousing vent hole is on the bottom of the housing, which is at about 22” on 33” tires, and water or mud intrusion into the clutch is never a good thing. And if your Rubicon is anything like mine, the gasket plugs where the wiring for the e-locker goes into the tops of the pumpkins is probably a sloppy undersize fit, which needed a couple ounces of RTV to seal up properly - so they’re probably ALL like that.

Water crossings are fun until something goes wrong. Then it gets expensive real fast.

[Anonymous]

Mine is the newer model. Improved fording but agree with you that it is not something that should be done often or by the novice. For me, most of my off-roading nowadays is on sand in the banks but when I was younger I used to trail a stock TJ and would have no issue fording two feet of water.

[Anonymous]

Or, you can go all in on fording with just a few mods.

https://www.carthrottle.com/news/say-hello-diesel-jeep-wrangler-can-drive-underwater

Skip to 15:30 for the crossing.

[Anonymous]

Update: I ended up getting a 2024 4Runner TRD Pro. So much for going for a used car! But i think it will be fun to drive.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Update: I ended up getting a 2024 4Runner TRD Pro. So much for going for a used car! But i think it will be fun to drive.

4Runners have ALWAYS been a solid choice. For what the TRD Pro package costs I probably woulda been tempted to wait for the new Land Cruiser, but the first year will probably have huge premiums over sticker. If I weren’t a Jeep aficionado going back decades, I’d be into ‘Runners and Cruisers.

A few pieces of advice:

Get acquainted with Fluid Film. Lots of 4Runners have gone to scrapyards too soon because of rust. Do a fluid film treatment at least annually. Twice a year if you’re doing water crossings. And do the first treatment BEFORE you do that first crossing.

Don’t skimp on tires. The factory OEM tires on TRD 4Runners are just barely adequate for an off-road tire. Get some BFG AT’s or Falken Wildpeak AT’s if you’ll be off-road.

Join a local Toyota club. You’ll learn a LOT about your vehicle and hang out with fun people.




Have fun. Solid choice.

[Anonymous]

I'll second the advice on Fluid Film. I use it mostly to combat road salt, but it's good for other things as mentioned above. As for tires, I'd also add General Grabber ATx to your list of good all-terrain tires.