Searching kids’ bags at APS - question

[Anonymous]

Maybe the admin actually searched the bags but then had to claim they didn't due to privacy? I am a teacher and I would absolutely search bags if someone told me there was a specific threat. I might do it when all the kids were at recess, but I would absolutely search. Whether I would admit it or not, well that depends what principal I had and if they were supportive or not. It could be the principal was told by someone higher up that he or she couldn't search.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

In all seriousness, though, if we’re going to strip kids of their right to privacy they need to be on notice that they have no expectation of privacy when they enter the building.

I mean the Supreme Court has ruled on this in 1984. Students have a reduced expectation of privacy at school. Schools may search students things if they have a reasonable suspicion. Lockers are basically a free foe all because they are considered school property.

Anyway there is established law on this. I don't know if APS or VA has more restrictive policies.

https://www.youthrights.org/issues/student-rights/search-and-seizure/#:~:text=Personal%20belongings&text=T.L.O.%20(US%20Supreme%20Court%2C%201985,of%20privacy%20when%20in%20school.

A reasonable suspicion of “what” is my question. My kid’s bag was searched because somebody did something obnoxious and they wanted to figure out which kid did it. There was no weapon or stolen goods or drugs or the type of thing you’d typically think of when you hear kids were searched. I’d like to be able to tell my kid if there are any instances when he has the right to object to a bag search.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Maybe the admin actually searched the bags but then had to claim they didn't due to privacy? I am a teacher and I would absolutely search bags if someone told me there was a specific threat. I might do it when all the kids were at recess, but I would absolutely search. Whether I would admit it or not, well that depends what principal I had and if they were supportive or not. It could be the principal was told by someone higher up that he or she couldn't search.

The thing that I find crazy about this is that, as a parent, I would assume teachers sometimes access little kids’ bags simply because they are generally still relying on adults when it comes to certain things. It’s like there’s implicit consent for an elementary school teacher to exercise some level of control over the children’s belongings.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

Ok. Well if he is embarrassed of those items, and they are private, there’s really no reason why he would need them in his school bag, right? What would be reasonably be doing with them during the school day, especially if he finds them embarrassing? If your kid is at school, they should expect their bags could be searched.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

In all seriousness, though, if we’re going to strip kids of their right to privacy they need to be on notice that they have no expectation of privacy when they enter the building.

I mean the Supreme Court has ruled on this in 1984. Students have a reduced expectation of privacy at school. Schools may search students things if they have a reasonable suspicion. Lockers are basically a free foe all because they are considered school property.

Anyway there is established law on this. I don't know if APS or VA has more restrictive policies.

https://www.youthrights.org/issues/student-rights/search-and-seizure/#:~:text=Personal%20belongings&text=T.L.O.%20(US%20Supreme%20Court%2C%201985,of%20privacy%20when%20in%20school.

A reasonable suspicion of “what” is my question. My kid’s bag was searched because somebody did something obnoxious and they wanted to figure out which kid did it. There was no weapon or stolen goods or drugs or the type of thing you’d typically think of when you hear kids were searched. I’d like to be able to tell my kid if there are any instances when he has the right to object to a bag search.

God bless our teachers. With everything else they are dealing with, they also have to deal with parents like the above poster. They really aren’t paid enough to put up with this kind of stuff.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

Ok. Well if he is embarrassed of those items, and they are private, there’s really no reason why he would need them in his school bag, right? What would be reasonably be doing with them during the school day, especially if he finds them embarrassing? If your kid is at school, they should expect their bags could be searched.

I don't think any 8 yos (or their parents) expect their backpacks to be private from adults in charge. Sure, kids expect that the class bully can't go through their backpack and take their things, but they also expect adults to take actions to keep them safe.

It didn't seem reasonable to anyone that APS admin couldn't search or pat down 8 yos' backpacks when presented with a specific threat for a specific group of students. At the very, very least, APS could have used a wand metal detector to screen backpacks.

[Anonymous]

This is another example of APS off the rails and the dominant liberal agenda/politicking of the folks running the schools overwhelming good judgment. I am a democrat for gods sake and it’s just too much. The teacher and admin absolutely have the rights to go into children’s backpacks. All day long. What nonsense at Key. Fear of crazy parents + politically driven admin making absolutely terrible decisions.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is another example of APS off the rails and the dominant liberal agenda/politicking of the folks running the schools overwhelming good judgment. I am a democrat for gods sake and it’s just too much. The teacher and admin absolutely have the rights to go into children’s backpacks. All day long. What nonsense at Key. Fear of crazy parents + politically driven admin making absolutely terrible decisions.

Totally agree. In fact I think many of us consider ourselves democrats, but this is just ludicrous. I’m ambivalent about the school resource officer issue, but not allowing teachers to go through a kid’s bag is off-the-rails insane. These people are nuts.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:This is another example of APS off the rails and the dominant liberal agenda/politicking of the folks running the schools overwhelming good judgment. I am a democrat for gods sake and it’s just too much. The teacher and admin absolutely have the rights to go into children’s backpacks. All day long. What nonsense at Key. Fear of crazy parents + politically driven admin making absolutely terrible decisions.

Yeah, the way it was handled really didn’t inspire confidence that anyone had a clue how to address safety.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

In all seriousness, though, if we’re going to strip kids of their right to privacy they need to be on notice that they have no expectation of privacy when they enter the building.

I mean the Supreme Court has ruled on this in 1984. Students have a reduced expectation of privacy at school. Schools may search students things if they have a reasonable suspicion. Lockers are basically a free foe all because they are considered school property.

Anyway there is established law on this. I don't know if APS or VA has more restrictive policies.

https://www.youthrights.org/issues/student-rights/search-and-seizure/#:~:text=Personal%20belongings&text=T.L.O.%20(US%20Supreme%20Court%2C%201985,of%20privacy%20when%20in%20school.

A reasonable suspicion of “what” is my question. My kid’s bag was searched because somebody did something obnoxious and they wanted to figure out which kid did it. There was no weapon or stolen goods or drugs or the type of thing you’d typically think of when you hear kids were searched. I’d like to be able to tell my kid if there are any instances when he has the right to object to a bag search.

God bless our teachers. With everything else they are dealing with, they also have to deal with parents like the above poster. They really aren’t paid enough to put up with this kind of stuff.

You’re kidding, right? You don’t think kids should know their rights in school? It’s a fair question to ask whether searches are permissible when there’s no suspicion of a weapon or drugs. If teachers are allowed to do spot checks whenever they please, kids should know that. And if there are limits to when searches are permissible, they should know that too. How is educating our kids on this topic even remotely offensive to teachers?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

In all seriousness, though, if we’re going to strip kids of their right to privacy they need to be on notice that they have no expectation of privacy when they enter the building.

I mean the Supreme Court has ruled on this in 1984. Students have a reduced expectation of privacy at school. Schools may search students things if they have a reasonable suspicion. Lockers are basically a free foe all because they are considered school property.

Anyway there is established law on this. I don't know if APS or VA has more restrictive policies.

https://www.youthrights.org/issues/student-rights/search-and-seizure/#:~:text=Personal%20belongings&text=T.L.O.%20(US%20Supreme%20Court%2C%201985,of%20privacy%20when%20in%20school.

A reasonable suspicion of “what” is my question. My kid’s bag was searched because somebody did something obnoxious and they wanted to figure out which kid did it. There was no weapon or stolen goods or drugs or the type of thing you’d typically think of when you hear kids were searched. I’d like to be able to tell my kid if there are any instances when he has the right to object to a bag search.

God bless our teachers. With everything else they are dealing with, they also have to deal with parents like the above poster. They really aren’t paid enough to put up with this kind of stuff.

You’re kidding, right? You don’t think kids should know their rights in school? It’s a fair question to ask whether searches are permissible when there’s no suspicion of a weapon or drugs. If teachers are allowed to do spot checks whenever they please, kids should know that. And if there are limits to when searches are permissible, they should know that too. How is educating our kids on this topic even remotely offensive to teachers?

If OP wants reliable info, they can call their kid’s school. If they want their kid to potentially object to a teacher’s request, it seems like the info of internet strangers isn’t the right source.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

In all seriousness, though, if we’re going to strip kids of their right to privacy they need to be on notice that they have no expectation of privacy when they enter the building.

I mean the Supreme Court has ruled on this in 1984. Students have a reduced expectation of privacy at school. Schools may search students things if they have a reasonable suspicion. Lockers are basically a free foe all because they are considered school property.

Anyway there is established law on this. I don't know if APS or VA has more restrictive policies.

https://www.youthrights.org/issues/student-rights/search-and-seizure/#:~:text=Personal%20belongings&text=T.L.O.%20(US%20Supreme%20Court%2C%201985,of%20privacy%20when%20in%20school.

A reasonable suspicion of “what” is my question. My kid’s bag was searched because somebody did something obnoxious and they wanted to figure out which kid did it. There was no weapon or stolen goods or drugs or the type of thing you’d typically think of when you hear kids were searched. I’d like to be able to tell my kid if there are any instances when he has the right to object to a bag search.

God bless our teachers. With everything else they are dealing with, they also have to deal with parents like the above poster. They really aren’t paid enough to put up with this kind of stuff.

You’re kidding, right? You don’t think kids should know their rights in school? It’s a fair question to ask whether searches are permissible when there’s no suspicion of a weapon or drugs. If teachers are allowed to do spot checks whenever they please, kids should know that. And if there are limits to when searches are permissible, they should know that too. How is educating our kids on this topic even remotely offensive to teachers?

If OP wants reliable info, they can call their kid’s school. If they want their kid to potentially object to a teacher’s request, it seems like the info of internet strangers isn’t the right source.

Ok, so let’s play that out. She calls the school. What if it turns out the search in question isn’t proper? Now she’s almost certain to lodge a formal complaint because she’s gone to the trouble of contacting the school. Don’t see how that helps anyone, especially if she was motivated to ask the question more by curiosity rather than outrage. It should be common knowledge of all parents and students if/when searches are permitted. The fact that nobody could give a definitive answer with confidence is it’s own interesting data point. None of this is antagonistic to teachers.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:There was a gun threat in 3rd grade at Escuela Key last year and the administration took the position that they couldn't search kids' bags because of privacy concerns.

Interesting. My kid’s bag got searched on suspicion that someone in the classroom had something disruptive (my understanding is that they searched everyone’s stuff until they found the item - it is entirely possible the teacher requested permission to conduct the search - I can’t imagine my kid would feel comfortable saying no). I’m actually ok with it as long as the kids are aware that bags are subject to search at all times, assuming that’s the policy.

so let’s play this out, what do you think your kid would do differently if they thought their bags be searched at any time?

For starters, he would make sure not to pack his Taylor Swift poster and super-secret diary in his school bag.

In all seriousness, though, if we’re going to strip kids of their right to privacy they need to be on notice that they have no expectation of privacy when they enter the building.

I mean the Supreme Court has ruled on this in 1984. Students have a reduced expectation of privacy at school. Schools may search students things if they have a reasonable suspicion. Lockers are basically a free foe all because they are considered school property.

Anyway there is established law on this. I don't know if APS or VA has more restrictive policies.

https://www.youthrights.org/issues/student-rights/search-and-seizure/#:~:text=Personal%20belongings&text=T.L.O.%20(US%20Supreme%20Court%2C%201985,of%20privacy%20when%20in%20school.

A reasonable suspicion of “what” is my question. My kid’s bag was searched because somebody did something obnoxious and they wanted to figure out which kid did it. There was no weapon or stolen goods or drugs or the type of thing you’d typically think of when you hear kids were searched. I’d like to be able to tell my kid if there are any instances when he has the right to object to a bag search.

God bless our teachers. With everything else they are dealing with, they also have to deal with parents like the above poster. They really aren’t paid enough to put up with this kind of stuff.

You’re kidding, right? You don’t think kids should know their rights in school? It’s a fair question to ask whether searches are permissible when there’s no suspicion of a weapon or drugs. If teachers are allowed to do spot checks whenever they please, kids should know that. And if there are limits to when searches are permissible, they should know that too. How is educating our kids on this topic even remotely offensive to teachers?

If OP wants reliable info, they can call their kid’s school. If they want their kid to potentially object to a teacher’s request, it seems like the info of internet strangers isn’t the right source.

Ok, so let’s play that out. She calls the school. What if it turns out the search in question isn’t proper? Now she’s almost certain to lodge a formal complaint because she’s gone to the trouble of contacting the school. Don’t see how that helps anyone, especially if she was motivated to ask the question more by curiosity rather than outrage. It should be common knowledge of all parents and students if/when searches are permitted. The fact that nobody could give a definitive answer with confidence is it’s own interesting data point. None of this is antagonistic to teachers.

But in your example, if she’s asking out of mere curiosity, then no, she’s not lodging a formal complaint.

I think this whole scenario is crazy.