MCPS Charging Parental Rights Group $18K to Fulfill Public Information Request

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The "Parent Rights Group" asked MCPS to turn over any emails from a four-month period from 30 individuals that included a common phrase.

This isn't just a matter of software turning up the term. MCPS then needs to figure out which emails were actually about the LGBT books, and from there, which pieces of correspondence were between the named individuals.

I am not an MCPS employee, nor am I someone working on this issue in any way or form.

I just searched my work email, and I sent 75 emails since April 2023 that included the phrase "opt out." Now, many of those were auto replies to solicitation emails that included the phrase "opt out from future emails" but the point is that this request isn't trivial.

It's going to take real hours of human labor that could be used for other things, and it makes sense to charge for it.

Omg. Yes, absolutely $18,000. Completely justified.

[Anonymous]

^^^speaking as someone who has both made and responded to public information requests, it's routine for the organization and the requester to work together to narrow the scope of the request so that the organization has a manageable request and the requesters get the records they most want. In fact, the courts expect the organization to reach out to the requesters about narrowing the scope. If the requesters then say NO, WE WANT EVERYTHING, well, that's their choice. But they shouldn't be surprised about the fee.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Wow… MCPS sucks. In govt, we usually charge about $15 to $20.

That’s not true. We charge for time. We give an estimate. We work with people to narrow their requests. We give away a couple of free hours but after that you pay. And you pay in advance of the work being done.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is MCPS charging 3 hours for an attorney in the General Counsel’s Office in regards to the Public Information Request?

Probably because private information needs to be redacted.

Good for MCPS, for charging for their wasted time

This.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Wow… MCPS sucks. In govt, we usually charge about $15 to $20.

That’s not true. We charge for time. We give an estimate. We work with people to narrow their requests. We give away a couple of free hours but after that you pay. And you pay in advance of the work being done.

My govt too. Anything over and hour or 2 and we have to charge a billable rate. If possible disclosure is involved, you pay for that review as well.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is MCPS charging 3 hours for an attorney in the General Counsel’s Office in regards to the Public Information Request?

Probably because private information needs to be redacted.

Good for MCPS, for charging for their wasted time

I know. This seems cheap for the amount of busy work they are incurring.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is MCPS charging 3 hours for an attorney in the General Counsel’s Office in regards to the Public Information Request?

Probably because private information needs to be redacted.

Good for MCPS, for charging for their wasted time

You say that now because you don't let the politics of the people who are requesting it. And maybe you're right. But you won't like it as much next time, when someone requests information about covering up something like drug dealing and rapes at school.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Why is MCPS charging 3 hours for an attorney in the General Counsel’s Office in regards to the Public Information Request?

Probably because private information needs to be redacted.

Good for MCPS, for charging for their wasted time

You say that now because you don't let the politics of the people who are requesting it. And maybe you're right. But you won't like it as much next time, when someone requests information about covering up something like drug dealing and rapes at school.

DP. No. MCPS has an obligation to disclose records, but MCPS also has an obligation not to waste their time and resources to fulfill ridiculously overbroad requests for records.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gotta give MCPS credit. They are fantastic at creatively using bureaucracy to dodge accountability.

But I don't think that, in this case, "accountability" is the issue.

Oh? Is accountability ever not an issue at MCPS? Do tell...
We don't know what exactly they requested, so you cant make a judgement whether MCPS is avoiding disclosure or accountability.
Honestly, once the parent group gets the documents, there probably will be a lawsuit.

[Anonymous]

They have to retrieve all of the emails, put all of the files into a searchable database, search the database for the key words, review to make sure there is nothing privileged and confidential or under attorney-client privilege, and produce all of the documents. That cost seems pretty reasonable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Gotta give MCPS credit. They are fantastic at creatively using bureaucracy to dodge accountability.

But I don't think that, in this case, "accountability" is the issue.

Oh? Is accountability ever not an issue at MCPS? Do tell...
We don't know what exactly they requested, so you cant make a judgement whether MCPS is avoiding disclosure or accountability.
Honestly, once the parent group gets the documents, there probably will be a lawsuit.

?????????

There already is a lawsuit: https://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/judge-denies-motion-for-montgomery-county-families-to-opt-kids-out-of-curriculum-involving-lgbtq-books/3410565/

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They have to retrieve all of the emails, put all of the files into a searchable database, search the database for the key words, review to make sure there is nothing privileged and confidential or under attorney-client privilege, and produce all of the documents. That cost seems pretty reasonable.

Lots of us could do this in a week, except for attorney review.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:The request was probably too broad. If it takes 440 hours they were probably requesting every document in the system to be viewed or scanned in some way.

You can see the substance of the request at the link. They’re asking for emails containing “opt-out” and "opt out" sent from 30 addresses over a 6 month period.

That's an easy search to run on the back-end. Manual processing time would obviously depend on the number of emails, but I'd be surprised if there are more than a thousand or so. Probably much less after deduplication.

I've done FOIAs ordered if magnitude bigger than that. And we didn't charge, despite the FOIA being obviously malicious.

I fully support charging, but $18k is ridiculous.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:They have to retrieve all of the emails, put all of the files into a searchable database, search the database for the key words, review to make sure there is nothing privileged and confidential or under attorney-client privilege, and produce all of the documents. That cost seems pretty reasonable.

You don’t think Google Workspace has e-discovery features? It does. The search itself is easy.

You have to go through the results, but that doesn't take that long. They'll have some discussions with legal, but everything else should be pretty quick to redact and clear. I've done this far more than I'd like. I could get through about 1 email/minute on average.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:They have to retrieve all of the emails, put all of the files into a searchable database, search the database for the key words, review to make sure there is nothing privileged and confidential or under attorney-client privilege, and produce all of the documents. That cost seems pretty reasonable.

Lots of us could do this in a week, except for attorney review.

The privilege review is the time consuming part.