Getting a hybrid SUV...but not the CRV

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Test drove the 2023 CRV hybrid and didn't like it.
Test drove the RAV4 hybrid and liked it...but shocked that the one we'd buy was close to 50K (because the dealerships are adding 6K over MSRP!)
At that price point (or slightly above)...is there something else we should look at? We have to wait a few months for the RAV4 to come in anyway.

Thanks!

At that price point, isn't the Model Y a good choice? I know it's not a Hybrid but you get the 7,500 tax credit and it's a highly rated car.

As someone who just went through this, this is why the Model Y was a nonstarter (at least for us).

1. We wanted a car with a lot of cargo capacity and the Y was not remotely that. If Subaru made an Outback PHEV or legit hybrid we'd have bought that. But, Subaru doesn't. The Tucson and RAV4 both have way more cargo room than the Y
2. We were excited about getting a 3rd row seat for those rare occasions when we might have more people. The "3rd row seat" on the Y is that in name only. No adult (or medium size child) would want to ride there for more than 2 minutes. So you are getting a pretend 3rd row and giving up cargo space in the process
3. Ultimately we decided we can't go 100% electric with cars that can handle 230 miles or so in the cold. When and were we drive the infrastructure is not there, and the idea of waiting for 20-40 minutes for a charge (even if we can find one) vs driving 500 miles on a full tank is a better option for us
4. I considered a PHEV, but even if I could have found one at MSRP, MSRP to MSRP vs a comparable straight hybrid (RAV4 and Tucson) is @$6-10k more. At current gas and electricity prices where we live the cost savings per year on Tucson hybrid vs Tesla Y are @$600. The math on Hybrid vs PHEV Hybrid is even less good. PHEV vs hybrid (apples to apples with similar trims) our break even was 10-13 years. At which point the efficacy of any battery is going to be suspect so it was not worth the extra cost
5. Elon is a d-bag who is undermining democracy. I don't give money to people who want to enable white supremacists and end democratic governments
6. Tesla's warranty and car service model are a sh*t show based on what we've see from friends. We keep cars for a very long time and it would concern me

Thanks for the analysis! Did you end up buying the Tuscon?

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Test drove the 2023 CRV hybrid and didn't like it.
Test drove the RAV4 hybrid and liked it...but shocked that the one we'd buy was close to 50K (because the dealerships are adding 6K over MSRP!)
At that price point (or slightly above)...is there something else we should look at? We have to wait a few months for the RAV4 to come in anyway.

Thanks!

At that price point, isn't the Model Y a good choice? I know it's not a Hybrid but you get the 7,500 tax credit and it's a highly rated car.

As someone who just went through this, this is why the Model Y was a nonstarter (at least for us).

1. We wanted a car with a lot of cargo capacity and the Y was not remotely that. If Subaru made an Outback PHEV or legit hybrid we'd have bought that. But, Subaru doesn't. The Tucson and RAV4 both have way more cargo room than the Y
2. We were excited about getting a 3rd row seat for those rare occasions when we might have more people. The "3rd row seat" on the Y is that in name only. No adult (or medium size child) would want to ride there for more than 2 minutes. So you are getting a pretend 3rd row and giving up cargo space in the process
3. Ultimately we decided we can't go 100% electric with cars that can handle 230 miles or so in the cold. When and were we drive the infrastructure is not there, and the idea of waiting for 20-40 minutes for a charge (even if we can find one) vs driving 500 miles on a full tank is a better option for us
4. I considered a PHEV, but even if I could have found one at MSRP, MSRP to MSRP vs a comparable straight hybrid (RAV4 and Tucson) is @$6-10k more. At current gas and electricity prices where we live the cost savings per year on Tucson hybrid vs Tesla Y are @$600. The math on Hybrid vs PHEV Hybrid is even less good. PHEV vs hybrid (apples to apples with similar trims) our break even was 10-13 years. At which point the efficacy of any battery is going to be suspect so it was not worth the extra cost
5. Elon is a d-bag who is undermining democracy. I don't give money to people who want to enable white supremacists and end democratic governments
6. Tesla's warranty and car service model are a sh*t show based on what we've see from friends. We keep cars for a very long time and it would concern me

Thanks for the analysis! Did you end up buying the Tuscon?

Yes. Have not taken delivery yet though.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Test drove the 2023 CRV hybrid and didn't like it.
Test drove the RAV4 hybrid and liked it...but shocked that the one we'd buy was close to 50K (because the dealerships are adding 6K over MSRP!)
At that price point (or slightly above)...is there something else we should look at? We have to wait a few months for the RAV4 to come in anyway.

Thanks!

At that price point, isn't the Model Y a good choice? I know it's not a Hybrid but you get the 7,500 tax credit and it's a highly rated car.

As someone who just went through this, this is why the Model Y was a nonstarter (at least for us).

1. We wanted a car with a lot of cargo capacity and the Y was not remotely that. If Subaru made an Outback PHEV or legit hybrid we'd have bought that. But, Subaru doesn't. The Tucson and RAV4 both have way more cargo room than the Y
2. We were excited about getting a 3rd row seat for those rare occasions when we might have more people. The "3rd row seat" on the Y is that in name only. No adult (or medium size child) would want to ride there for more than 2 minutes. So you are getting a pretend 3rd row and giving up cargo space in the process
3. Ultimately we decided we can't go 100% electric with cars that can handle 230 miles or so in the cold. When and were we drive the infrastructure is not there, and the idea of waiting for 20-40 minutes for a charge (even if we can find one) vs driving 500 miles on a full tank is a better option for us
4. I considered a PHEV, but even if I could have found one at MSRP, MSRP to MSRP vs a comparable straight hybrid (RAV4 and Tucson) is @$6-10k more. At current gas and electricity prices where we live the cost savings per year on Tucson hybrid vs Tesla Y are @$600. The math on Hybrid vs PHEV Hybrid is even less good. PHEV vs hybrid (apples to apples with similar trims) our break even was 10-13 years. At which point the efficacy of any battery is going to be suspect so it was not worth the extra cost
5. Elon is a d-bag who is undermining democracy. I don't give money to people who want to enable white supremacists and end democratic governments
6. Tesla's warranty and car service model are a sh*t show based on what we've see from friends. We keep cars for a very long time and it would concern me

Thanks for the analysis! Did you end up buying the Tuscon?

Yes. Have not taken delivery yet though.

After reading your posts, I dug around a bit. The Tuscon seems smaller than a Sante Fe which seems smaller than a Kia Sorento (all hybrids). Did you look at the Kia? It has 3 rows, costs a bit more and supposedly gives the same mileage..

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Test drove the 2023 CRV hybrid and didn't like it.
Test drove the RAV4 hybrid and liked it...but shocked that the one we'd buy was close to 50K (because the dealerships are adding 6K over MSRP!)
At that price point (or slightly above)...is there something else we should look at? We have to wait a few months for the RAV4 to come in anyway.

Thanks!

At that price point, isn't the Model Y a good choice? I know it's not a Hybrid but you get the 7,500 tax credit and it's a highly rated car.

As someone who just went through this, this is why the Model Y was a nonstarter (at least for us).

1. We wanted a car with a lot of cargo capacity and the Y was not remotely that. If Subaru made an Outback PHEV or legit hybrid we'd have bought that. But, Subaru doesn't. The Tucson and RAV4 both have way more cargo room than the Y
2. We were excited about getting a 3rd row seat for those rare occasions when we might have more people. The "3rd row seat" on the Y is that in name only. No adult (or medium size child) would want to ride there for more than 2 minutes. So you are getting a pretend 3rd row and giving up cargo space in the process
3. Ultimately we decided we can't go 100% electric with cars that can handle 230 miles or so in the cold. When and were we drive the infrastructure is not there, and the idea of waiting for 20-40 minutes for a charge (even if we can find one) vs driving 500 miles on a full tank is a better option for us
4. I considered a PHEV, but even if I could have found one at MSRP, MSRP to MSRP vs a comparable straight hybrid (RAV4 and Tucson) is @$6-10k more. At current gas and electricity prices where we live the cost savings per year on Tucson hybrid vs Tesla Y are @$600. The math on Hybrid vs PHEV Hybrid is even less good. PHEV vs hybrid (apples to apples with similar trims) our break even was 10-13 years. At which point the efficacy of any battery is going to be suspect so it was not worth the extra cost
5. Elon is a d-bag who is undermining democracy. I don't give money to people who want to enable white supremacists and end democratic governments
6. Tesla's warranty and car service model are a sh*t show based on what we've see from friends. We keep cars for a very long time and it would concern me

Thanks for the analysis! Did you end up buying the Tuscon?

Yes. Have not taken delivery yet though.

After reading your posts, I dug around a bit. The Tuscon seems smaller than a Sante Fe which seems smaller than a Kia Sorento (all hybrids). Did you look at the Kia? It has 3 rows, costs a bit more and supposedly gives the same mileage..

We did look at the Santa Fe. It gets noticeably worse mileage than the Tucson. I didn't look hard (read: in person) at the Sorento because it was bigger and more expensive than the Tucson and the third row seat (like most of them) is not particularly useful for us (or any full size adult). I tried below to summarize our thinking on those cars and couple of others we considered that might peek your interest.

Tucson hybrid vs Santa Fe hybrid is beyond confusing. I have no idea why they have two such similar cars. The Santa Fe is larger in length (6") and height (1"), but oddly has less cargo space inside. That is due to its more roomy interior. It also is noticeably less good on gas mileage (37 vs 32 average, and 36 vs 30 hwy). The Santa Fe is $5k more than the Tucson in the SEL trim. For our purposes having a larger car that is driven and parked mostly in downtown that didn't offer more cargo space, got less good gas mileage and cost more was not a good trade-off for us.

The Kia Sportage Hybrid is the comparable car to the Tucson hybrid. It may actually be a better value at the top trim level. The styling (interior and exterior) are very different than the Tucson but many people prefer it. I prefer the look of the Tucson and I was able to find one to order in the interior color we wanted, so didn't test drive the Sportage. If you think you like the Tucson hybrid you should probably check out the Sportage Hybrid too.

The Sorento Hybrid is I guess kind of comparable to the Santa Fe...and less impressive across the board IMHO. The Sorento gets better gas mileage than the Santa Fe and offers more cargo space and a nascent 3rd row. If you need more space or a larger interior than the Tucson I agree the Sorento seems like a good choice and a very good value. For our purposes we would be spending another $5 for space and features we didn't need.

If you like the added space of the Sorento maybe also look at the Toyota Highlander. We drove the Highlander. It drove incredibly well for a very large vehicle and gets really good MPG for a car that large. It (like the Sorento) was too big for our needs and starts at $10k more than the Tucson (and $5k more than the Sorento) in comparable trims so it wasn't a good fit for us. Hyundai doesn't make the Palisade in a hybrid so it doesn't really have anything to compare to the Sorento and Highlander.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:Test drove the 2023 CRV hybrid and didn't like it.
Test drove the RAV4 hybrid and liked it...but shocked that the one we'd buy was close to 50K (because the dealerships are adding 6K over MSRP!)
At that price point (or slightly above)...is there something else we should look at? We have to wait a few months for the RAV4 to come in anyway.

Thanks!

At that price point, isn't the Model Y a good choice? I know it's not a Hybrid but you get the 7,500 tax credit and it's a highly rated car.

As someone who just went through this, this is why the Model Y was a nonstarter (at least for us).

1. We wanted a car with a lot of cargo capacity and the Y was not remotely that. If Subaru made an Outback PHEV or legit hybrid we'd have bought that. But, Subaru doesn't. The Tucson and RAV4 both have way more cargo room than the Y
2. We were excited about getting a 3rd row seat for those rare occasions when we might have more people. The "3rd row seat" on the Y is that in name only. No adult (or medium size child) would want to ride there for more than 2 minutes. So you are getting a pretend 3rd row and giving up cargo space in the process
3. Ultimately we decided we can't go 100% electric with cars that can handle 230 miles or so in the cold. When and were we drive the infrastructure is not there, and the idea of waiting for 20-40 minutes for a charge (even if we can find one) vs driving 500 miles on a full tank is a better option for us
4. I considered a PHEV, but even if I could have found one at MSRP, MSRP to MSRP vs a comparable straight hybrid (RAV4 and Tucson) is @$6-10k more. At current gas and electricity prices where we live the cost savings per year on Tucson hybrid vs Tesla Y are @$600. The math on Hybrid vs PHEV Hybrid is even less good. PHEV vs hybrid (apples to apples with similar trims) our break even was 10-13 years. At which point the efficacy of any battery is going to be suspect so it was not worth the extra cost
5. Elon is a d-bag who is undermining democracy. I don't give money to people who want to enable white supremacists and end democratic governments
6. Tesla's warranty and car service model are a sh*t show based on what we've see from friends. We keep cars for a very long time and it would concern me

Thanks for the analysis! Did you end up buying the Tuscon?

Yes. Have not taken delivery yet though.

After reading your posts, I dug around a bit. The Tuscon seems smaller than a Sante Fe which seems smaller than a Kia Sorento (all hybrids). Did you look at the Kia? It has 3 rows, costs a bit more and supposedly gives the same mileage..

We did look at the Santa Fe. It gets noticeably worse mileage than the Tucson. I didn't look hard (read: in person) at the Sorento because it was bigger and more expensive than the Tucson and the third row seat (like most of them) is not particularly useful for us (or any full size adult). I tried below to summarize our thinking on those cars and couple of others we considered that might peek your interest.

Tucson hybrid vs Santa Fe hybrid is beyond confusing. I have no idea why they have two such similar cars. The Santa Fe is larger in length (6") and height (1"), but oddly has less cargo space inside. That is due to its more roomy interior. It also is noticeably less good on gas mileage (37 vs 32 average, and 36 vs 30 hwy). The Santa Fe is $5k more than the Tucson in the SEL trim. For our purposes having a larger car that is driven and parked mostly in downtown that didn't offer more cargo space, got less good gas mileage and cost more was not a good trade-off for us.

The Kia Sportage Hybrid is the comparable car to the Tucson hybrid. It may actually be a better value at the top trim level. The styling (interior and exterior) are very different than the Tucson but many people prefer it. I prefer the look of the Tucson and I was able to find one to order in the interior color we wanted, so didn't test drive the Sportage. If you think you like the Tucson hybrid you should probably check out the Sportage Hybrid too.

The Sorento Hybrid is I guess kind of comparable to the Santa Fe...and less impressive across the board IMHO. The Sorento gets better gas mileage than the Santa Fe and offers more cargo space and a nascent 3rd row. If you need more space or a larger interior than the Tucson I agree the Sorento seems like a good choice and a very good value. For our purposes we would be spending another $5 for space and features we didn't need.

If you like the added space of the Sorento maybe also look at the Toyota Highlander. We drove the Highlander. It drove incredibly well for a very large vehicle and gets really good MPG for a car that large. It (like the Sorento) was too big for our needs and starts at $10k more than the Tucson (and $5k more than the Sorento) in comparable trims so it wasn't a good fit for us. Hyundai doesn't make the Palisade in a hybrid so it doesn't really have anything to compare to the Sorento and Highlander.

Awesome! Thanks for sharing. I need to replace an old van but in no hurry. Will begin test driving the various choices. Hopefully prices will drop over the course of the year and there are good deals towards the end of the year.

[Anonymous]

I like my Lexus ux