Is it worth it to buy at the Watergate?

[Anonymous]

I would never again own in a coop. It’s much worse than an HOA. Read the coop docs. The board has a ridiculous amount of power and can make arbitrary decisions. Also really look at the building infrastructure. The concrete (in the plaza and parking garages in particular) is in poor shape. There appears to be a ton of deferred maintenance, which is sadly common in coops. I would anticipate a lot of one time significant charges. That’s when it will get ugly bc some long time homeowners won’t be able to pay, even with monthly plans, etc.

[Anonymous]

I've been in several units in Watergate South and they are striking because of how big they are. Even 1BRs are much bigger than what's being built new today. The units are well-insulated - I don't think I ever heard a neighbor or smelled someone else's cooking.

The downside (other than lack of community) is the fees. That's the reason the unit prices are so low - if you are paying $2K+ in monthly coop fees that's like going up $300K in purchase price elsewhere for the same monthly payment. And the amenities aren't exceptional, but you are paying for the pool, the extensive full-time staff, the fountains, the landscaping, etc. A friend who renovated found it challenging because there are procedures for contractors to be approved to work in the building, and the hours allowed for work are limited.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've been in several units in Watergate South and they are striking because of how big they are. Even 1BRs are much bigger than what's being built new today. The units are well-insulated - I don't think I ever heard a neighbor or smelled someone else's cooking.

The downside (other than lack of community) is the fees. That's the reason the unit prices are so low - if you are paying $2K+ in monthly coop fees that's like going up $300K in purchase price elsewhere for the same monthly payment. And the amenities aren't exceptional, but you are paying for the pool, the extensive full-time staff, the fountains, the landscaping, etc. A friend who renovated found it challenging because there are procedures for contractors to be approved to work in the building, and the hours allowed for work are limited.

Thanks for bringing this up. This is a huge concern for me. The 1BRs I'm seeing on the market now aren't total gut jobs, but I'd want to redo the kitchen at minimum. I imagine the co-op board makes it a PITA as it is and I'd hate for renovations to take weeks longer over arbitrary work hours. -OP

[Anonymous]

OP, if you're younger than 70 you may feel out of place there. You won't escape condo associations or co-ops in DC for the most part, but this one is a real "gem" to deal with. Imagine a bunch of retired people with nothing to do except maintain their "power" on the co-op board. It's going to be miserable.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I would never again own in a coop. It’s much worse than an HOA. Read the coop docs. The board has a ridiculous amount of power and can make arbitrary decisions. Also really look at the building infrastructure. The concrete (in the plaza and parking garages in particular) is in poor shape. There appears to be a ton of deferred maintenance, which is sadly common in coops. I would anticipate a lot of one time significant charges. That’s when it will get ugly bc some long time homeowners won’t be able to pay, even with monthly plans, etc.

Thanks for bringing this up. I'm a renter in a condo building right now and the HOA annoys even me! I don't want to be involved with that type of thing as an owner. What happens if homeowners aren't able to pay, are other owners expected to pay extra? -OP

[Anonymous]

I live in a coop building in NWDC and I'm ... familiar with the challenges (and don't mind them).

The thing that I can't get over about the Watergate is that it's not particularly walkable. One of the trade-offs for some of those challenges is that I can walk to a dozen easy amenities within 2-5 minutes, including numerous transit options. The Watergate is cut off by that huge traffic circle and not integrated into a walkable neighborhood.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:I've considered the Watergate, as have my friends. The prices are really attractive. The issue that has stopped all of us is the HOA fees. They're really high compared to similar square-foot condos/coops in the area. I don't personally care about rats in the Safeway, because I imagine every Safeway in the DMV has rats. But the high HOA fees would impact resale values, and they're probably going to stay high given the building's ongoing needs. Also, if you're over about age 25, the Kennedy Center is obviously appealing, but a lot of the area is focussed on GW undergrads. The views from the balconies are fabulous, though.

There are not HOA fees. It is a coop.

I owned a coop 7 years and I did like it. The maintenance includes so much more than a condo so not apples to apples to a condo. My coop maintenance included property taxes, water, gas, heat that in my condo I all pay separately. Also condo handled water heater, gas related repairs. My condo I have a new gas water heater etc.

I also liked greater control of neighbors, less investors, more long term neighbors. It was just so much easier to pay one monthly maintenance bill. In DC unlike NY people are less familiar with coops. It has to do with when you leave NYC you become less worldly and sophisticated. OK just kidding. But in NY buildings like the Dakota where the super rich are coops. The board keeps the rift raft out.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:Thank you for your insight; this is the kind of insider info I was looking for . I don't mind the lack of community, but the noise is a great point: that there will probably be some airplane noise, too, in addition to the Rock Creek Parkway noise. I imagine it'd get old quickly if you're there to relax or have a conversation as cars honk and planes are taking off or landing; it can be annoying having to talk over the planes at East Potomac, for example. Great point about light only coming in from one side as well; exposure is something I hadn't considered, even though I love natural light, but it's so true. Thank you again. -OP

You're welcome! I should add that in the nature of things a river view here means a western exposure, which is not ideal in so many ways: hotter in the afternoons and summer evenings, glare when you want to be enjoying the view, etc. Honestly, I dream of having a river view, but if I weren't committed to being in DC I'd rather be on the VA side gazing east/northeast towards DC than vice-versa.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I would never again own in a coop. It’s much worse than an HOA. Read the coop docs. The board has a ridiculous amount of power and can make arbitrary decisions. Also really look at the building infrastructure. The concrete (in the plaza and parking garages in particular) is in poor shape. There appears to be a ton of deferred maintenance, which is sadly common in coops. I would anticipate a lot of one time significant charges. That’s when it will get ugly bc some long time homeowners won’t be able to pay, even with monthly plans, etc.

Thanks for bringing this up. I'm a renter in a condo building right now and the HOA annoys even me! I don't want to be involved with that type of thing as an owner. What happens if homeowners aren't able to pay, are other owners expected to pay extra? -OP

This is more DC nonsense. A condo if an owner can’t pay us a massive headache you have to go through a huge foreclosure process and with banks can drag on for years and building usually loses out on past common arrears owed.

A coop technically you don’t directly own real estate you own shares in the cooperative. My coop I had a stock certificate similar to a stock. It is cheaper and quicker to take back unit.

Other thing to closing costs way cheaper on a coop. It is a stock certificate transfer.

Downside they don’t appreciate much. Upside better to live in if you are a primary owner. I almost felt like I lived in a hotel in my coop. My condo to be honest I still have to deal with a board but I get stuck with way way more repairs and bills to deal with in my own,

[Anonymous]

It’s worth it if you love it and can afford it but don’t look at it as an investment.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've considered the Watergate, as have my friends. The prices are really attractive. The issue that has stopped all of us is the HOA fees. They're really high compared to similar square-foot condos/coops in the area. I don't personally care about rats in the Safeway, because I imagine every Safeway in the DMV has rats. But the high HOA fees would impact resale values, and they're probably going to stay high given the building's ongoing needs. Also, if you're over about age 25, the Kennedy Center is obviously appealing, but a lot of the area is focussed on GW undergrads. The views from the balconies are fabulous, though.

There are not HOA fees. It is a coop.

I owned a coop 7 years and I did like it. The maintenance includes so much more than a condo so not apples to apples to a condo. My coop maintenance included property taxes, water, gas, heat that in my condo I all pay separately. Also condo handled water heater, gas related repairs. My condo I have a new gas water heater etc.

I also liked greater control of neighbors, less investors, more long term neighbors. It was just so much easier to pay one monthly maintenance bill. In DC unlike NY people are less familiar with coops. It has to do with when you leave NYC you become less worldly and sophisticated. OK just kidding. But in NY buildings like the Dakota where the super rich are coops. The board keeps the rift raft out.

You mean like the people who don’t know the term is “riff raff?”

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've considered the Watergate, as have my friends. The prices are really attractive. The issue that has stopped all of us is the HOA fees. They're really high compared to similar square-foot condos/coops in the area. I don't personally care about rats in the Safeway, because I imagine every Safeway in the DMV has rats. But the high HOA fees would impact resale values, and they're probably going to stay high given the building's ongoing needs. Also, if you're over about age 25, the Kennedy Center is obviously appealing, but a lot of the area is focussed on GW undergrads. The views from the balconies are fabulous, though.

There are not HOA fees. It is a coop.

I owned a coop 7 years and I did like it. The maintenance includes so much more than a condo so not apples to apples to a condo. My coop maintenance included property taxes, water, gas, heat that in my condo I all pay separately. Also condo handled water heater, gas related repairs. My condo I have a new gas water heater etc.

I also liked greater control of neighbors, less investors, more long term neighbors. It was just so much easier to pay one monthly maintenance bill. In DC unlike NY people are less familiar with coops. It has to do with when you leave NYC you become less worldly and sophisticated. OK just kidding. But in NY buildings like the Dakota where the super rich are coops. The board keeps the rift raft out.

You mean like the people who don’t know the term is “riff raff?”

This is one of the reasons I hate co-op and HOA boards. A lot of times, who counts as “riff-raff” is based on skin colour, xenophobia, and other prejudices but somehow the standards always fall by the wayside for people like management’s criminal cousin or the board president’s uncouth children with debt up to their eyeballs.

[Anonymous]

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:

Anonymous wrote:I've considered the Watergate, as have my friends. The prices are really attractive. The issue that has stopped all of us is the HOA fees. They're really high compared to similar square-foot condos/coops in the area. I don't personally care about rats in the Safeway, because I imagine every Safeway in the DMV has rats. But the high HOA fees would impact resale values, and they're probably going to stay high given the building's ongoing needs. Also, if you're over about age 25, the Kennedy Center is obviously appealing, but a lot of the area is focussed on GW undergrads. The views from the balconies are fabulous, though.

There are not HOA fees. It is a coop.

I owned a coop 7 years and I did like it. The maintenance includes so much more than a condo so not apples to apples to a condo. My coop maintenance included property taxes, water, gas, heat that in my condo I all pay separately. Also condo handled water heater, gas related repairs. My condo I have a new gas water heater etc.

I also liked greater control of neighbors, less investors, more long term neighbors. It was just so much easier to pay one monthly maintenance bill. In DC unlike NY people are less familiar with coops. It has to do with when you leave NYC you become less worldly and sophisticated. OK just kidding. But in NY buildings like the Dakota where the super rich are coops. The board keeps the rift raft out.

You mean like the people who don’t know the term is “riff raff?”

This is one of the reasons I hate co-op and HOA boards. A lot of times, who counts as “riff-raff” is based on skin colour, xenophobia, and other prejudices but somehow the standards always fall by the wayside for people like management’s criminal cousin or the board president’s uncouth children with debt up to their eyeballs.

This is absolutely untrue in DC. Local law is extremely clear about protected classes (pretty much everyone) you can't discriminate against and coop application review criteria have to be clear and fair - basically, that applicants meet financing terms.

[Anonymous]

Coop fees usually include property taxes so that can take the sting off how high they are.

With that said, I would buy elsewhere due to the building being so old and just take a private car service for all of your Kennedy center shows. You’ll come out way ahead.

[Anonymous]

Do owners have access to the hotel facilities, like the pool?

Just curious.